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Woland
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I'm concerned about prison guards. Look at what happened recently in Baltimore.
Bob1Dog
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 10:07, Al Angello wrote:
Yada yada yada
It would be a whole cheaper if we dispensed with the ridiculous symbolism and keep them in a existing maximum security facility in this country.

So, back to my original point, would Alcatraz work for you, given that our prisons are already overcrowded anyway?
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
landmark
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International law--and the US Constitution for that matter--is not, except for enumerated rights such as voting, dependent on citizenship. But now we have the distraction of Magic Muslims who can escape from Maximum security prisons. The Constitution only applies to those who you approve of, evidently, to be trot out when it suits you and tucked away when convenient.
Al Angello
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Bob
Alcatraz is ok with me if it is ok with the bureau of corrections, but as Landmark pointed out we already have escape proof prisons.

Of course you know that going to Alcatraz is kinda like reinventing the wheel all over again.
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Dannydoyle
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Getting out of a 23 hour lockdown would be tough. Supermax facilities are so kuch better than Alcatraz ever was.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
landmark
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My comments were meant for Woland BTW.
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 14:57, Bob1Dog wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-05-15 10:07, Al Angello wrote:
Yada yada yada
It would be a whole cheaper if we dispensed with the ridiculous symbolism and keep them in a existing maximum security facility in this country.

So, back to my original point, would Alcatraz work for you, given that our prisons are already overcrowded anyway?


Supermax federal prisons don't have an overcrowding problem.
Woland
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Quote:
International law--and the US Constitution for that matter--is not, except for enumerated rights such as voting, dependent on citizenship. But now we have the distraction of Magic Muslims who can escape from Maximum security prisons. The Constitution only applies to those who you approve of, evidently, to be trot out when it suits you and tucked away when convenient.


Quote:
My comments were meant for Woland BTW.


Thanks, landmark, but what do those comments have to do with anything I have said in this discussion (or elsewhere for that matter)?

My first comment simply stated what I think has been generally recognized as one of the reasons that enemy combatants are being held at Guantanamo:

Quote:
The purpose of establishing Camp Gitmo was to keep it off American territory, hence not subject to the ACLU.


Don't you think that was one of the reasons these enemy combatants were not brought into the United States? What is so controversial about stating that. I didn't say I agreed with it, I was just pointing out why, for example, Alcatraz was not used.

My second comment was,

Quote:
I'm concerned about prison guards. Look at what happened recently in Baltimore.


What does the fact that inmates in Baltimore have taken over a state prison, running criminal conspiracies right out of it, and in the meantime seducing and impregnating female prison guards, have to do with the Constitution, Magic Muslims (whatever they are), and "enumerated rights"?

?
Bob1Dog
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 15:34, mastermindreader wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-05-15 14:57, Bob1Dog wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-05-15 10:07, Al Angello wrote:
Yada yada yada
It would be a whole cheaper if we dispensed with the ridiculous symbolism and keep them in a existing maximum security facility in this country.

So, back to my original point, would Alcatraz work for you, given that our prisons are already overcrowded anyway?


Supermax federal prisons don't have an overcrowding problem.

Bob, all due respect, I don''t read that from this:

"These prisons received partial activation funding in FY 2012, and full activation will increase federal prison capacity and alleviate overcrowding and related security issues."

Or

"...the Bureau of Prisons is moving ahead with plans to open hundreds, and perhaps thousands of new isolation cells at Thomson to “reduce crowding in high security facilities.”

Exerpted from:

http://solitarywatch.com/2013/04/13/obam......-prison/

Just sayin'.
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
mastermindreader
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Thanks. I was unaware of that. I have read that there is plenty of space in the supermax areas where convicted terrorists are confined.

Most overcrowding, though, is in state prisons, primarily due to the high number of drug convictions.
Al Angello
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Bob
Newer is much better, and totally escape proof. The prison across the creek from my house Graterford State prison is abandoning the old prison and building an all new facility for both sexes.
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Dannydoyle
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Newer is better and less expensive to maintain.

It is not the people escaping I would be worried about. It is their friends who don't mind blowing themselves up to make a point who are a nuisance.
Danny Doyle
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Woland
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How many enemy combatants have been released from Guantanamo? And how many of them have returned to the field of battle against us?
Bob1Dog
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 15:53, mastermindreader wrote:
Most overcrowding, though, is in state prisons, primarily due to the high number of drug convictions.


I agree with you on that score.
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
mastermindreader
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How many non-combatants are in Guantanamo who have NO charges pending against them and are being held indefinitely without recourse to the courts?
Bob1Dog
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 16:02, Dannydoyle wrote:
Newer is better and less expensive to maintain.

It is not the people escaping I would be worried about. It is their friends who don't mind blowing themselves up to make a point who are a nuisance.

So I see the general consensus is that Alcatraz should be left alone and maintained by the National Park Service, and that modern is cheaper and better. A reasonable course. That's what I get for staying up, watching late night TV and sipping Jack Daniels at the same time. Smile
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
acesover
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 16:02, Dannydoyle wrote:
Newer is better and less expensive to maintain.

It is not the people escaping I would be worried about. It is their friends who don't mind blowing themselves up to make a point who are a nuisance.


While not disagreeing with you about newer being less expensive to maintain. I would like to know at what point the Newer Facility becomes cost efficient. I am sure it cost millions and millions to build. So just asking when will it become cost efficien taking into consideration the cost of building it? It only becomes less expensive once it is built which means it does not take into consideration paying off the building it. Of course it will create jobs for the construction workers which will be all union workers and raise the cost a few million. But I guess that is what we have to live with. Definitely not a reason not to hire those companies who only use union workers. That is unless you are building something of your own and the money comes out of your pocket not the tax payer. However that can get us into an entirely different thread. My only point being was to try and get the point across is when does it become less expensive to maintain considering the expense involved in constructing it and where will the money come from in order to build it.

I know myself with apartments where I furnish heat etc. I can definitely build more heat efficient apartments and they will be less expensive to heat and maintain. However said apartments will cost me $5000,000 and reduce my heating costs $5,000 or evenb $10,000 a year. Not really cost effective is it? However building new and keeping the old is a different story entirely.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
Andrew Zuber
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Alcatraz is one of my favorite spots in San Francisco. Nice view of the city, a brief trip out on a boat...I've been quite a few times and always enjoyed it, as odd as that may seem.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
landmark
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 18:10, mastermindreader wrote:
How many non-combatants are in Guantanamo who have NO charges pending against them and are being held indefinitely without recourse to the courts?

You read my mind mastermindreader!
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2013-05-15 18:47, Andrew Zuber wrote:
Alcatraz is one of my favorite spots in San Francisco. Nice view of the city, a brief trip out on a boat...I've been quite a few times and always enjoyed it, as odd as that may seem.


Not odd at all. I enjoy it to. It was the guys who took the one way trip who didn't think is was all that enjoyable. Smile
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