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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Mickeys retention the best on the planet (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Jonathan Townsend
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Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
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Quote:
On 2005-10-24 20:50, SOHA wrote:
It would be interesting to hear from someone who saw Vernon in his prime do the vanish...


Agreed
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Chris S
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I believe my first post on the subject quite explicitly stated that Vernon's vanish could be found in Bobo's. Would you like the Dover page reference or the hardback?

It might be nice to hear from someone who saw Vernon do it first-hand, but ultimately I think the Crawford story says it all. Upon reflection, I do indeed wonder what Vernon would have thought of Mickey's SUV. Would he have appreciated the INCREDIBLE retention that he can acheive, or would he have disliked the slightly unnatural reaffirmation that the coin was still in the hand (after all, would a layperson show a coin was still in the hand by using both hands, or would they just open their hand)? It's interesting to ponder these sorts of things.
May your moral compass guide you true - South West is where the honourable man fare. Pity those who lose their way...
Tom Wolf
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Harrison, Ohio
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Hi Chris,

I firmly believe that the reason that Mickey keeps on showing that the coin was still in his hand, was for us to see how great the move really is.

When showing for a spectator, it really is not that important because Any retention vanish that is done Well, looks like "real magic" to them.

How many of you reading this comment, have seen the look of amazement in your audiences' eyes when the coin "disappeared"?

Tom Wolf
The magic director and performer at the Rincon Gaucho supper club in Mexico City,

We opened the first and only close-up room for magic in Mexico with Wolf Ruvinskis.
have several new coin vanishes and routines to share shortly just as soon as I can find someone to film them for me.


Now living in Harrison, Ohio
Backdoor
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Bismark, ND
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Personally, I think Vernon would find what Mr. Silver does quite exceptional. Can't see why he wouldn't think so to be honest with you. Also, I don't think Mr. Silver has to give you the reaffirmation that the coin is indeed in the hand if he doesn't want to, but it certainly reinforces the notion. Though the "incredible" retention is clearly enough for laymen, most magicians too I think. But I think when he hits you with the "hook" here, it can even devoid magicians of better thinking on the matter...That's what makes what he does so fantastic I think. He isn't just fooling laymen, that's' easy! Mr. Silver can fool the pants off magicians too, and clearly has done this in a big way wouldn't you say? Also, I think what's more important is all the things he does with this move and ability, how he has adapted that to facilitate so many of these other established tricks, such as the 3-Fly genre, where he does his version called "Spit Fly." The dvds he sent me are pretty remarkable, but I'm sure all you guys know that already.
-Only The Shadow Knows...Y'know?
KirkG
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I saw Mr. Vernon at the Magic Castle give a lecture where he performed his vanish as part of his coins to glass routine. It was amazing. It is still the Vanish that gets the most comment from magicians when I perform it for them today. He was in his 70's and still did stuff(moves) better than anyone I have seen yet. His coin and ball vanishes, bottom palm, direct steal to rear palm, were flawless and completely believable and transparent(no tells).

I wish I had developed the interest in cards that would have caused me to spend more time with him when I had the opportunity. Ah such is the folly of youth! As it is, I have just a few short personal sessions to draw from as I read the rest of his contributions in print. Unfortunately the Video series of Revelations came too late in his life and some of his message is garbled by the hosts and the ravages of age. Read and understand and think about what Vernon writes.

I think he would have liked Mickey's mechanics, but probably not the "dancing." He still would have recognized and appreciated the move and the wonderful appearance of the effect. This opinion is from having watched and talked with both men.

Mickey's showing the coin "in his hand" is to both reinforce the spectators' perception and throw off the magicians'. He is doing exactly what Mr. Vernon said. Make the move match the normal action. Except, he is doing it by never doing the normal action! Smile Think! Think! Magicians, when watching, go, "Oh, he did the steal. Oh wait, no he didn't. But now it's gone! What the . . .?" Now they can feel the moment of being fooled. What a gift!

Thank you Mickey for all the gifts. I hope to continue to be thought worthy and I patiently wait for the rest of what you choose to bestow.

Kirk Grodske
Carlo
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On Mr. Silver's demo he shows at least one practical application for showing the coin "in the hand": when he's working with one coin and wants to show that it's travelled through his head into his left hand.

The move itself, which logically would seem to be overproving, does appear to reinforce the idea that the coin is really there.
saheer
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My point is that this is all very perplexing. If you are good but don't wave your hands you are bad. But, if you are good and wave your hands you are bad. Hmmmmmmm.
Al

[/quote]

hahaha - original sin.
"Because, without beer, things do not seem to go as well"

1902 diary of Brother Epp, Capuchin monk from Munjor,
Kansas
Backdoor
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To each his own...There is no set way to do all this and really there shouldn't be - that's what makes it progressive, different and always changing and exciting. Everyone brings who they are to the table, and those amongst us that bring something truly special usually bring it through their own creative side and means. Mr. Silver is no different, and probably would not want to do things as Mr. Dai Vernon did them or anyone else...After all, as great as all those guys were giving something special to the art unlike anyone else, Mr. Silver is really in the same vain here. So, while Vernon might not approve of his so-called "dancing," perhaps Mr. Silver would not approve of his particular sense of movement, lack of movement or added flair. Again, to each his own and everyone doesn't have to be like or meet Dai Vernon's approval as to excellence, with all due respect. And again, I think Mr. Vernon would be quite amazed with Mr. Silver, along with all the great magis of that time and even before that. Everyone now is amazed, can't see why they wouldn't have been just as amazed back then (perhaps even moreso), especially with Mr. Silver's stuff, stuff they did not know of or do.
-Only The Shadow Knows...Y'know?
Jonathan Townsend
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As long as we are guessing and based upon the guy's love of clever, I bet he would be intrigued and most persistent in getting the details of Mickey's sleights.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Chris S
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But Jonathan, you are always so quick to admonish people about discussing mechanics of unpublished routines. Why are you reintroducing this very thing then?
May your moral compass guide you true - South West is where the honourable man fare. Pity those who lose their way...
rikbrooks
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Olive Branch, Mississippi
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Listen up. I have stood within reach of Mickey as he did his routine. I can guarantee that I've never seen anything like it. It inspired me to go back and look at the few coin routines that I do.

I went back to Bobo's book and his retention of vision. I spend at least a couple of hours a day in front of a mirror so I started dedicating all my time to that vanish. I kept doing it over and over. Eventually slight nuances started changing the way that I did my vanish. A pivot here or there, I'd put the coin slightly more here or there.

Now my retention of vision is just about perfect - but it's not quite Mickey's. Mickey's has something else and I'd love to learn it. My Peregrinating Halves ends with a retention of vision vanish, getting rid of the last coin. I normally step right up close to the spectator and tell them to watch closely as I place the coin in my palm, open the palm to show it there, then close my hand and vanish it.

I get a dropped jaw every single time. From time to time the eye will then travel to my other hand but the Ramsay subtlety is complete and I have even gotten a second dropped jaw from the 'fact' that the coin is not in the other hand either.

I'll normally tell the spectator that I really dropped it up my sleeve. I do that because in the summer I always wear sleeveless t shirts and in the winter I roll up my sleeves. Years of Praying Mantis kung fu have left me with thick wrists that feel uncomfortable in normal shirts.
JTW
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Chris S,
Jonathan was making reference to one of Vernon's habits. That of hunting down a move or technique that he had heard of and getting the work. He would pursue this person doggedly until he got what he wanted.

He isn't talking about discussing method.
Richard Lucas
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TX fornow- MemberMagicCastle'65-'88
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Where did Mickey Silver post his message wherein he listed several web sites about coin magic?
"The only difference between a Card Cheat and a Magician is that the Magician shows off.".......... Jay Ose 1965



Dicklucas
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