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Wravyn
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When a person creates an effect and puts it into the public’s hand via manufactured effect or book, I think it is hoped that the consumer will do justice for the effect; not just by presenting it properly but to bring themselves into it and not being a copy of the effects creator. At times the Modus operandi have inspired others to create a new effect or expand upon the original towards a new look. For example Deddy Corbuzier's FREE WILL has inspired other routines and so has Max Maven's POSITIVE NEGATIVE, to name just a couple.

We are fortunate to have some wonderful creators here in the Café and my questions are for them;
When you have created something and marketed it, then your effect inspires another person to do something more/different with it, how does it make you feel and do you like to hear about what someone has done with your idea?
IAIN
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I wouldnt say I was a "wonderful creator", but I'm lucky enough that the things I've put out have been well reviewed and thought of...one of my favourite compliments was from someone talking about a series of short stories of mine, saying that it was both his favourite book to read, as well as the things that were hidden within them...

and had some really nice encouragement from my betters too, I've always really appreciated that as its those guys I've learned so much from, so bob cassidy, richard webster and a few others have been silly/kind enough to help me out with advice and feedback...

as for what some have done with it, its a obviously a lovely feeling - and always very kind and generous of them to take the time to send you an email or whatever else...someone I've gotten to know this year has taken a couple of my reading systems and warped them into something else that they were working on...so its been very interesting to hear how he's been using it...

I can at times bounce off other people fairly well, so its fun to brainstorm stuff too... and to go full circle, its been great to read little reviews and comments on here about them using AEIOU for instance, and that they found ways of adding it to whatever else they perform...so I think/hope we all kinda create hybrids of one another's work by being as true to ourselves as possible whilst performing it...

like I combined something from corinda in with bob's 4DT, and can perform that around a table and have done for a while now - its a combo of methods but I wouldnt have had it without both of those guy's (excellent) work...i hope we all strive to do ourselves proud...
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IAIN
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Also, I never just wanna hear good feedback, if someone thinks its rubbish, I'd rather they come tell me their reasons...then I can judge them/poison them/arrange for a hitman to visit...

constructive criticism is always welcome...
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MentalistCreationLab
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AEIOU is total rubbish.

Well it would be if the darn thing wasn't so wonderful and briliant.
mastermindreader
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Yes, it's nice to see when my work inspires someone. It's not so nice, though, when I see an original effect modified ever so slightly and sold without permission or credit to the actual creator.

I've seen many so-called "improvements" of previously marketed material released by people who obviously didn't understand the reasoning behind the original presentation or method, thus not realizing, or caring, that their "improvement" was actually a step backwards.
Godzilla
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Bob,can a so called Creator,take an effect and just give a credit,without a Permission from the original creator too ?
Is there nothing you can do? Or,is that just a moral issue?
"If you watch Godzilla backwards, it's about a big ass lizard who helps rebuild a half burnt-down city, then moonwalks back into the ocean"
IAIN
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Quote:
On 2013-09-04 18:59, MentalistCreationLab wrote:
AEIOU is total rubbish.

Well it would be if the darn thing wasn't so wonderful and briliant.


ha! yeah, the bridge is a pile of mumbo-jumbo! and it *definitely* doesn't make a very strong impact for the person who experiences the dream...

and I definitely don't have a wishing well/bent coin version that I use..
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IAIN
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Quote:
On 2013-09-04 21:53, Godzilla wrote:
Bob,can a so called Creator,take an effect and just give a credit,without a Permission from the original creator too ?
Is there nothing you can do? Or,is that just a moral issue?


I can't remember what UF Grant effect I bought (the title I mean), but it says in the instructions "warning to dealers - just because you swop the crayons for pens does not give you the right to republish this effect"...made me laugh but also feel a bit sad that we sometimes have to say those things...

before I put out AEIOU, I sent copies to Richard Webster and Enrique Enriquez, as they were both influential in what I did with it, and its 'kind of' based on psychometry a-z, but in a visual way, I thought it was only fair that they got copies, and more importantly that both were happy with it being released...if either had said'no' then it would have never seen light of day...
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mastermindreader
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It's a matter of ethics.
Cervier
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By the way, how can one make sure (a) an effect hasn't been published yet, or (b) that what's he's about to publish is "different enough"?
"A friend is someone who know you well but loves you anyway" H. Lauwick
The Lynx Deck, http://jmmaries.free.fr/cervier/
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IAIN
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I always send stuff out to a trusted few, but with the caveat that I appreciate that they are busy people and don't actually expect a response really (if I've just randomly sent them something)... so I try not to bug them after I've sent it...

so you just have to be brave and polite, and ask people if they'd mind initially taking a look at it, but at the same time, give them space to reply...and above all else, take it onboard if the feedback is not what you were hoping for..these people have given up their time to help you...
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Wravyn
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Quote:
On 2013-09-05 07:50, LCervier wrote:
By the way, how can one make sure (a) an effect hasn't been published yet, or (b) that what's he's about to publish is "different enough"?


In my opinion, this would fall under a new creation... a new idea.
An inspired effect, the person takes an existing work/concept which they have learned (hopefully through purchase) and bring a positive aspect using the knowledge shared from the creator of the original effect.

Next question... If a person uses a concept in a different fasion, is it ok to share the 'how it is accomplished' with another person (not selling) with explaining that a certain effect or idea contributed to the final outcome?
Cervier
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Thanks, but what I mean is, "how can one make sure (a) an effect hasn't been published yet". Not if it's any good. For example, if you think you've invented a new machine or whatever, you can check whether a patent has been filed. But I don't think there's the equivalent of the "patent office" in the magic world.
So, where would one go? Ask Alexander? What other sources are there? etc.

EDIT: I realize this question is not what the thread is about. My apologies, I'll open a new one not to "pollute" this one.
"A friend is someone who know you well but loves you anyway" H. Lauwick
The Lynx Deck, http://jmmaries.free.fr/cervier/
Grapheeteez, on GooglePlay
Telemos the peek envelope, on SkywardMagic
Telemos en Francais sur TheMysteryStore
Wravyn
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You do have a very valid question... no need to start another thread since conversations do move back and forth.
funsway
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You seem to be speaking only of what the late MagicIan called "derivative effects" -- those based directly on a previous effect or idea. There is also "non-derivative" creativity prompted by an object or story theme -- or even observing an effect and figuring out how it might be done. This type of creativity is very satisfying and self-rewarding. i.e. the process of creativity may be more exciting than performing the effect. Naturally, if one desired to sell this effect they should do some research to discover if someone else published it first. This may be difficult.

One advantage of an eBook is that if you later wish to give credit to someone you can re-edit. As with any original work you can always mail a copy to yourself and save it unopened. Then you can prove the date of originality if necessary.

However, if you independently created an effect no one can take that away from you -- even if it is discovered that someone else also developed the effect in another time and place. Yes, there are those who believe that no effect is ever created without being based on some other effect observed or read previously. For me, this just means they have never enjoyed the thrill of creation.

Your title queries "inspiration" -- something different from creation. Inspiration may come in the form of a new way to present and old effect or a better story line -- or even the sense not to perform an effect at all.

I have created dozens of magic effect but am not inspired to release most of them ;-)
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
Wravyn
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Quote:
On 2013-09-04 21:09, mastermindreader wrote:
Yes, it's nice to see when my work inspires someone. It's not so nice, though, when I see an original effect modified ever so slightly and sold without permission or credit to the actual creator.

I've seen many so-called "improvements" of previously marketed material released by people who obviously didn't understand the reasoning behind the original presentation or method, thus not realizing, or caring, that their "improvement" was actually a step backwards.


How may I get in touch with you to share an effect/routine which one of your effects inspired?
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