I'm reading "Magical Mathematics" by Persi Diaconis. He has a section on Fast and Loose though he doesn't call it that. After describing how to throw the chain so that one side is fast, and neither side is fast (as far as I can tell these are the standard throws), he then describes a move where both sides are fast. He attributes this to Stewart Judah. It involves crossing the hands. Diaconis says "as far as we know, this manouver has not been previously described".

I know the "both sides fast" throw on the SFS DVD but this one looks different - has anyone else come across it?

I don't know the reference, but there is an "in the hands"/off table version of F&L that describes a Fast/Fast throw "All-in-Air Endless Loop" by Robert L. Brooks in Harry Lorayne's Apocalypse (6):817-20. Maybe that can be of help? I'm guessing that crossing the hands involves adding a twist (and a half?) maybe? Problem is that, unless I'm doing it wrong, the Fast/Fast described therein just looks different (bulkier) at the center cross than in the Fast/Loose, Loose/Fast, Loose/Loose throws. I'm guessing this is because the architecture is different - the strands aren't passing diagonally across each other in the center, but rather using each other to change direction in the center. It's something I was just going to go through this thread to research, but stopped at the first post (yours) instead, so I apologize if this is explained/resolved better somewhere else.

Thanks - yes the one described by Diaconis looks different to me, too. It actually is smaller because it takes up more chain, as I read it.

But I don't really like the other "both fast" method because one side ends up as a hitch rather than a loop - unless I am misunderstanding it.

Reference:
The Art Of Close Up Magic, volume 1, by Lewis Ganson - Chapter 4 - It's A Gamble, "The Endless Chain".
A book published by The Supreme Magic Company, UK. Reprinted in 1972.

This covers an interesting concept - similar to the one I remember being used by Paul Daniels on UK Tv.

Featuring a "Triple Circle Routine" by Fred Lowe. Which was apparently inspired by an idea by Jack Salvin in 1952.

Very intriguing.

One, two, or three loops are formed - like a flower petal.
All of which can be either fast or loose at the performers discretion.
Paul Daniels performance was my inspiration to search for this routine.

The price of the book is a bargain for this routine alone.

A true addition to the fast and loose arsenal.
A must have ...

Is the Paul Daniels routine on DVD or YouTube to see?

Fireperformer911 ...
not that I can find.

The price of the book by Lewis Ganson - listed above - is worth the effect alone.
Consider the price of a magic DVD, which might containing only a single effect.

This book contains this, plus other routines too.

I am not familiar with the Ganson reference, but there is a similar move in the Marc DeSouza DVD on F&L "Chain Gang".

In which chapter in "magical mathematics" is the fast and loose description?

There are 48 separate photographs spread over 4 or 5 pages of a man throwing a chain.

Can't you find them?

I found it. I have it on my kindle, so it's not so easy to look for. And a search for Fast and Loose turned up nothing.

School of scoundrell method for the various options (fast - fast, fast - loose, loose - loose) is really great