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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » How far? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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fordkross
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209 Posts

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Somehow, this went from peeking over someone's shoulder before a show or overhearing somethingin the same situation
to black bag jobs and possiblle b&e's.
No one reccomends violating friends privacy or committing other illegal acts.

As far as calling myself real, I'm as real a me as there is. Accept no substitutes
from
Ford
Ford has a better idea
Ray Haddad
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Mansfield Center, Connecticut
151 Posts

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Quote:
On 2002-06-01 14:36, fordkross wrote:
Somehow, this went from peeking over someone's shoulder before a show or overhearing somethingin the same situation
to black bag jobs and possiblle b&e's.
No one reccomends violating friends privacy or committing other illegal acts.


Ford,

I agree that entering an unlocked room and doing a search is shocking behavior and not to be condoned. Reading a personal letter over a person's shoulder is also not a nice thing to do. Obviously, the person reading the letter could have sought a more private place to read it but that doesn't excuse active pursuit of the information.

Best Regards,
Ray
Victor Brisbin
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Washington, DC / NOVA
432 Posts

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How far is too far to go in gaining personal information for your "pre-show work" or to set up for a reading? For an entertaining lesson, check out the old cinematic version of "Nightmare Alley," starring Tyrone Power. It goes too far when you start gathering worshippers, or have people bringing you their cash or valuables for a "blessing." As a former state investigator who did extensive interviews with felons, and thorough background checks, I would caution you that once you start gathering information covertly on your friends, clients, subjects, etc., you run the risk of finding out more than you really want to know about them.

I have read accounts of some old vaudeville mediums/mindreaders, who would have advancemen visit the homes of prominent members of a community, with the offer of free tickets to the show. Once inside the doors of these houses, the delivery person took in as much visual information as possible, and wrote copious notes on the contents of the homes, which the performer made astonishing use of at the following public performances. Smile
"It is better to practice a little than talk a lot." - Muso Kokushi
mastermindreader
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V.I.P.
Seattle, WA
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I didn't do it.
You didn't see me do it!
and you cant't prove it anyway!

Bart
Marduke Kurios
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Vancouver, Canada
316 Posts

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Ah, but I did see you Bart.

I know it was you.

Milhouse told me, and he has pictures of you...

Bart, put that knife down!
Live well,
Laugh often,
Love always.

To the world you might be one person, but to one person you just might be the world.

Without Prejudice, All Rights Reserved.
David de Leon
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Sweden
417 Posts

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To us (mentalists) it obviously SEEMS more miraculous if we can give out information that we couldn’t possibly know about a person. (Without my gimmicks how could I possibly know that the stranger before me owns a little white dog?) But for the spectator the revelation of highly personal facts obtained through the usual methods, say the centre tear or cold reading, SHOULD be just as amazing (if done right)! How could I possibly know what I’m telling them?

(An aside: in Absolute Magic Derren Brown also writes about HOW we can reveal secretly obtained information in ways that give it the greatest impact.)

Is there a risk that we are overrating the effect of extreme methods (e.g. pick pocketing) just because we can’t disassociate from our own knowledge of what is and is not possible using our standard methods?

Just a thought....

- David
Ian Rowland
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London
876 Posts

Profile of Ian Rowland
I think a couple of different threads are getting tangled here.

I believe opportunism to be one of the strongest principles in mentalism, as well as being one of the most fun to exploit. Opportunities which can lend themselves to the apparent delivery of miracles surround us all the time, and the art is in learning to note, use and exploit them to best effect. I believe that some of Derren's tales in his books are there to illustrate this point, although opportunism can also be exploited in more structured ways, and I hope to expand on this in a book some day.

Obtaining information via covert investigation of private property, or premises, is one subset of 'opportunism', but it's one which necessarily involves ethical and practical concerns. As usual with 'ethics', the only real guide is that voice in your head and whichever social codes and laws pertain to your area. Peeking into a bag that's open, when that opportunity presents itself unbidden... I wouldn't get too excited about that. Contriving the chance to rummage through personal belongings when the owners believe said possessions to be safe and secure... ever so slightly iffy in my book.

There is a good middle-way strategy here, but I'll have to pop over to Secret Sessions to explain about it in more detail (if I do it here I'll get toasted for tea by the Mods). I'll thread it under 'Opportunism'.
www.ianrowland.com . Working Magic.
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