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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » Writing Gooder... does anyone care anymore? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Ray Haddad
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Quote:
On 2002-06-03 22:00, Peter Marucci wrote:
"Esteemed" I like; and "buddy", too; but "old" -- well, that's another story! Smile
I'll have to think about that.
Or, as Leo Gorcey who played Slip Mahoney in the old Bowery Boys movies might say:
"Let me regurgitate on that for a minute."


For someone who takes exception to being referred to as old, you surely can prove your age rapidly by mentioning the Bowery Boys.

Sorry, I couldn't help but see the irony here. Then again, I, too, remember the Bowery Boys. Sigh.......

Best Always,
Ray
Peter Marucci
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Yes, indeed, whatever happened to that mangler of the language Norm Crosby? (Well, there wasn't a lot left after his beloved Dodgers left Brooklyn, 'way back when.)
And, Ray, I didn't realize the Bowery Boys dated me that much! But I guess so!
My favorite Gorcey quote:
Being interviewed on the Johnny Carson show, Gorcey was asked how he felt when his old friend Groucho Marx's marryied an ex-wife of Gorcey's.
Leo replied something to the effect that "he's still a friend; but now I look at him as my husband-in-law."
Great stuff!
cheers,
Peter Marucci
showtimecol@aol.com
Bird Brain
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I do seem to be from a generation that follows the path of least resistance, and a lot of spelling seems to be phonetic, "u can allmost ere ow dey r torking".




I know what u mean, dude! Lol!
I hate that!

My friend said that one can have an entire conversation by using just one word: dude.
I guess that's where the true beauty of the english language comes out, as one word can mean so many different things just by the way you say it. Dude.

DUDE! (in a scared voice.) DUDE! (I think it's time to leave!) DUDE! (Here come a BUNCHA writers to run me THRU with pens!)

Dude,
Bird Brain
Yes I know my enemies
They're the teachers who taught me to fight me
Compromise, conformity, assimilation, submission
Ignorance, hypocrisy, brutality, the elite
All of which are American Dreams, All of which are American Dreams
Peter695
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Norm's correctified rambulations were encapsulated in an irsupressable enthusiasm and puntuated by his calcification of a thick, Brooklyn accent.

Personally, I don't mind 'popular' expressions such as; "like" and "dude". A relaxed application of structure and rules (syntax) in a casual setting, doesn't bother me. I guess it comes under "cultural expression" or "popular culture" to my mind. So it's valid. Yes, I understand that I'm probably in the minority.

Peter
Jim Morton
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All of which ?begs the question? (actually, does anyone even know how to use THAT phrase correctly? Like, basically, I don?t think so)? does anyone care anymore?


"Begs the question" used to mean an argument that uses what it is trying to prove as its basis for proof. It still means that as far as most dictionaries are concerned, but nowadays it is usually used as a synonym for "raises the question." I once pointed this out in a newsgroup and was called a prig. William Safire wrote a column on the subject a couple years back, so at least I'm in good company. Smile

Jim
John
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I was just talking with a colleague who writes with passion and power. He tries to write only with "anglo-saxon" words - tough, short, and concrete. Well crafted words evoke and create experience. Playwright Tom Stoppard writes: "Get the right words in the right order and you can nudge the world a little, or write poems that children will speak after you when you are dead."
Matt Graves
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You should hear the kind of language my Grandma uses when she hears somebody on TV saying "like"; I don't think it would be considered very proper either! Smile
Bird Brain
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Quote:
On 2002-06-03 09:44, Platt wrote:

RE: "When I am reading something and there is a mistake such as the one mentioned, I tend to focus more on the mistake than the message. There are a few that really urk me."


There a few that really irk me too.


Dear folks,

With all due respect, and said in the kindest tone possible, I think that we should put people's feelings before spelling and grammar errors. I understand that this is just a discussion. However, I feel that it's getting to the point of comparing people's cars and homes. Some of us don't have the "money" to buy a nice car, some of us just have "money from a different country", etc.

Respectfully,
Bird Brain
Yes I know my enemies
They're the teachers who taught me to fight me
Compromise, conformity, assimilation, submission
Ignorance, hypocrisy, brutality, the elite
All of which are American Dreams, All of which are American Dreams
maurile
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On 2002-06-04 01:04, Thomas Wayne wrote:
Regarding room for improvement, beat poet Jack Kerouac once bragged that he NEVER revised his original writing; how it came out of the typewriter, so it stayed. Upon hearing about this self-congratulatory admission, Truman Capote said: "That's not writing, that's TYPING!".


"There is no such thing as good writing. There is only good rewriting." -- Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis
John Clarkson
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[quote]On 2002-06-05 11:09, Jim Morton wrote:
Quote:
...
I once pointed this out in a newsgroup and was called a prig. William Safire wrote a column on the subject a couple years back, so at least I'm in good company. Smile

Jim

This brings to mind one of my favorite quotations. In fact, I have made a business card of it that I use at conventions for fellow teachers of English to speakers of other languages:

"Correct English is the slang of prigs who write history and essays. And the strongest slang of all is the slang of poets." -- George Elliot, "Middlemarch" (1872).
John D. Clarkson, S.O.B. (Sacred Omphaloskeptic Brotherhood)
Cozener

"There is nothing more important to a magician than keeping secrets. Probably because so many of them are Gay."
—Peggy, from King of the Hill (Sleight of Hank)
DarryltheWizard
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Mark Twain once pointed out, " The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and the lightning bug." I've had a few books on ventriloquism and magic published over the years- a fact that has made me a lover of words. As a lover of words, the finding of that right word is a barbaric joy, a sensuous personal excitement that can hardly be described. The situation here is analogous to the experience of an elderly minister instructing a class of ten-year olds in catechism.
"What's the first step to the forgiveness of sin?" he asked expecting a routine answer. After a bumpy silence, one intrepid youngster burst out, "Well, first you gotta sin!"
Exactly and reversely! If we would all discover the joy and love of words, the mechanics would follow naturally.
I've seen flyers from magicians both young and old with you're spelled your ,it's for its . There are over 700 pairs and triplets of homonyms in our language, so let's put forth a Herculean effort to use at least a dozen or so correctly! I know my posts are far from perfect, but I usually end up in the edit mode before I submit them.
Darryl the Wordwise Wizard Smile
DarryltheWizard
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with a snuffed out flame." Albert Einstein
Huw Collingbourne
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On 2002-06-01 12:37, Thomas Wayne wrote:

Fortunately for the English language, the decades Prince Nelson Rogers spent converting “to” and “too” to “2”, as well as substituting “4” for “for” and “fore” (say it to yourself a few times) did not seem to have a lasting effect on how most of us write.

Unfortunately, here in Britain this style of writing has become depressingly fashionable due to the advent of 'text messaging' (writing abbreviated messages using a mobile telephone). It is now quite common to read online messages containing expressions such as:

'lo m8', 'c u l8r' and 'ne1 4 10is?'
(translation: 'hello, mate', 'see you later' and 'anyone for tennis?' - ok, I admit that I made up the '10is' part but I think you'll find it's in the spirit of the thing!)

The first time you read messages like this they may seem funny. The hundredth time they are just irritating.

Curiously many of us Brits like to think that we speak the Queen's English "more proper than what them Americans do". In fact, in my experience, this is not the case.

Personally, while I hate sloppy English, I love slang. On that subject, does anyone know of any magical jargon that's crept into everyday language?

best wishes
Huw
Scott Cram
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My favorite re-occuring spelling errors, besides the 4/for and 2/too/two are their/they're/there and it's/its. You wouldn't believe how often I run across those in magic books!
Huw Collingbourne
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Quote:
On 2002-07-31 15:12, Scott Cram wrote:
My favorite re-occuring spelling errors, besides the 4/for and 2/too/two are their/they're/there and it's/its.

On the subject of it's (and other crimes against the apostrophe), take a look at:

The Apostrophe Protection Society
http://www.apostrophe.fsnet.co.uk/

You see, we aren't the only ones who care... Smile
Scott F. Guinn
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A big one that I keep seeing is "loose" when they mean to say "lose." "Loose" is the opposite of "tight." "Lose" is when you didn't win or you misplaced something.
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Ross W
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To return to Thomas's original post, a small correction is in order.

Prince's full name is not Prince Nelson Rogers, but Prince Rogers Nelson - something that sticks in my mind as a tabloid headline circa 1803:

PRINCE ROGERS NELSON
- Hardy "distraught"

(With apologies to members whose knowledge of British maritime history renders it meaningless. It IS funny - honest!)
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Ross W
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Guys - while we're on the subject, it's "recurring", not "re-occuring"!

Magical phrases that have passed into common use...

1. "Just like that!" (Catchphrase of Tommy Cooper)
2. Now you see it, now you don't
3. Keeping something up one's sleeve
4. Like a rabbit out of a hat
5. Er...
6. ...that's it.

Ross
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Harry Murphy
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There are several phrases that are currently in use including:

Hocus-Pocus (since the mid 1500’s)
Fast and loose (ok really a gambling term but street “performers” augmented their money playing the game.)
Smoke and mirrors (used recently by the media to describe Enron’s book keeping practices!)

Even that old magic word “Abracadabra!” has made it into the popular vernacular and even found its way into a popular song a few years back.

Houdini is sometimes used as a slang verb to describe a person getting out of a tight spot.

And on and on…
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
Peter Marucci
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Regarding Scott's nailing of "loose" and "lose", you could be a best-selling writer and still screw things up.
In The Godfather, author Mario Puzo refers to someone as "unloosening" his tie.
Well, "unloosening" would mean the opposite of "loosening", which would be "tightening".
And that is certainly not what Puzo meant.
It's like "ravel", although most people today would say something like: "Let's unravel this problem."
However, "ravel" means to pull apart as in a knitted sweater.
"Unravel" would, therefore, mean to "knit".
But, again, I don't think so!
Smile
cheers,
Peter Marucci
showtimecol@aol.com
Huw Collingbourne
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Quote:
On 2002-08-01 13:27, Peter Marucci wrote:
In The Godfather, author Mario Puzo refers to someone as "unloosening" his tie.
Well, "unloosening" would mean the opposite of "loosening", which would be "tightening".
And that is certainly not what Puzo meant.

I was just nodding in agreement with Peter when I suddenly thought, "Hmmm... I wonder..."

Anyway, surprisingly, this is what the Oxford English Dictionary has to say (I'll abbreviate - it does go on a bit!):

Unloose: 1) To relax, slacken; 2) To set free from bonds; 3) To undo, untie, unfasten.

Unloosen: (trans = Unloose, v.)
(example 1672): "A cord fastened about my foot, which was tied to a great Chest, which though I could, I would not unloosen." (beats me what that's about - sounds like escapology!)

Anyway, looks like you've just stumbled upon yet another example of that strange, slippery, misleading thing that is the English language...

best wishes
Huw
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