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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » A math question for Landmark and other mathematicians (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Jack Straw
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 17:30, Slide wrote:
Well, now that the mathematicians have weighed in perhaps the OP won't mind a non mathematicians thought.

If someone told me they were making a playing card 4 times the size I would assume the dimensions would be 4 times the size: the length would be 4 times the size (2 inches becomes 8 inches) and the width would do likewise. I wouldn't think in terms of area. I don't think many people think in terms of area unless they are painting a wall.


Thanks, Slide.

That is certainly the way that I think.

I guess that I am in the minority on that, though.
Jack Straw from Wichita, cut his buddy down
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S2000magician
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I posted a poll on another forum, the members of which are mostly financial professionals (arguably comparable to OP's clientele). The text of the poll is:

This is a really important poll, so no messing around: I want serious replies only, please.

Poker-size playing cards are 2½” × 3½”. If you had a jumbo playing card that was 5” × 7”, then, compared to a poker-size card, would you describe it as:

• Twice as big
• Four times as big
• Something else

Thanks.


So far, the answers are running 100% for "Four times as big". My two favorites so far are:

35/8.75

It’s the same principle as how 70mm film is four times as big as 35mm film.
LobowolfXXX
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How many of them would describe a 4-acre lot as twice the size of a 1-acre lot?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

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tommy
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An elephant’s foot generally measures 16 to 20 inches, in length and width. So that would be at least 4 1/2 playing cards long.

Its footprint can determine the height of an elephant. For males shoulder height is approximately 5,8 time the length of the hind footprint (and in the case of females 5,5 times)
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 19:10, LobowolfXXX wrote:
How many of them would describe a 4-acre lot as twice the size of a 1-acre lot?

Different poll.

Perhaps tomorrow.
tommy
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There is no point in trying to bluff an elephant, according to Phil Hellmuth.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 15:20, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-02-06 15:17, S2000magician wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-02-06 13:41, LobowolfXXX wrote:
I think the moral of the story is that printers recognize and allow for the fact that most people are fairly math-illiterate.

Innumerate, according to John Allen Paulos.

Does he include as one of the consequences the possibility that one might get a playing card twice the size that one asked for?

It's been quite a while since I read the book, but I don't recall that specifically.

He does have a discussion on a very interesting set of four dice.
balducci
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Non-transitive, I assume? Otherwise, hard to imagine what would be interesting about them.
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R.S.
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First, we're lucky to have the math prowess of the guys in this thread. Bill has helped me before and I'm thankful for that. He really knows his stuff and he's a genuinely nice guy. Smile

Regarding the John Allen Paulos book "Innumeracy", it's actually one of my all time favorite books! I read it twice, and I highly recommend it.


Ron
:)
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 19:59, balducci wrote:
Non-transitive, I assume? Otherwise, hard to imagine what would be interesting about them.

Exactly. On both counts.
Bazinga
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 15:21, S2000magician wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-02-06 14:32, Jack Straw wrote:
Telling us that you want something 4 times the size is not ambiguous.

That's a good one!

Where's Bazinga when we need him?

Around here we have a pizza shop that makes square/rectangular pies. I'm trying to figure out how to convince them to charge me for a double-size pie that's actually four times the regular size. Smile

Bazinga!
landmark
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The pizza question is actually a classic problem that high school teachers love to give to their math students. Simply, if instead of making a 6-inch circular pizza, you make a 12-inch circular pizza, how much more pizza are you making?
Bob1Dog
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 22:03, landmark wrote:
The pizza question is actually a classic problem that high school teachers love to give to their math students. Simply, if instead of making a 6-inch circular pizza, you make a 12-inch circular pizza, how much more pizza are you making?

Using the pies are squared method?
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

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Tom Cutts
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 12:27, LobowolfXXX wrote:
With respect to a similar question in another discipline, I remember an employer of mine who was a skilled carpenter (though that wasn't the job for which I was working for him) telling me that half of a 2x4 was either a 1x4 or a 2x2, not a 1x2.
To a carpenter half of a 2x4. Is a 2x4x4, since the phrase "two by four" refers to the nominal dimensions of 2" x 4" x 8'. ( none of which are actual dimensions anymore). Go to a job site and ask for half a twobafour and see what you get.

Now if you ask a carpenter to rip a 2x4 in half, THEN you'll get a 1x4 or a 2x2.
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 16:32, S2000magician wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-02-06 16:16, mastermindreader wrote:
In your original post you stated that "Size and area are two entirely different things." That is not always the case, as any dictionary will reveal to you.

Stop being ambiguous here, Bob: what size dictionary we talkin' about?


Jumbo size, of course. Four times bigger than a pocket dictionary. (As opposed to humongous size, like the Oxford Unabridged- but those also list "area" as one of the many synonyms for "size.") Smile
Tom Cutts
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It's been touched on but the point where designers co-opted a phrase to make it non mathematical is still being overlooked by our print designer faction.

These folks think in terms of magnification, as already mentioned. The most accurate and concise phrase is "give me a card blown up two times". When someone inaccurately adds "the size" they throw math wife out the window. (Thank you spell check and a typo, your fill brings levity to my dry diatribe). (Please insert mathematics where it says math wife)

So the phrase "please blow this up twice the size" is just a convenient ***ization of the English language. As long as "blow this up" is included the intent is still clear. Once "blow this up" is dropped it becomes just a lazy, inaccurate, jargon phrase within an industry.

These people should be required to go back and relearn math wife!
landmark
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 23:06, Bob1Dog wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-02-06 22:03, landmark wrote:
The pizza question is actually a classic problem that high school teachers love to give to their math students. Simply, if instead of making a 6-inch circular pizza, you make a 12-inch circular pizza, how much more pizza are you making?

Using the pies are squared method?

Exactly. Since the area of a pizza is related to the square of its radius, a 12-inch pizza will contain four times the cheesy goodness of a 6-incher.
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2014-02-06 16:03, Jack Straw wrote:
I keep filling in my 3 co-workers on what we are discussing, and all 3 of them are saying things that I cannot repeat here.

All 3 of them agree with what I am saying to you.


Then that was who you should ask as it seems taking on new information seems to anger you.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
0pus
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Well, Danny, he already said that he really was only looking for confirmation that he was right.

To him, everything else is noise.
tommy
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I have neighbour who is a leading expert on the law of advertising. He works from home and companies send him adds by fax etcetera. He checks them then rewords if necessary sends them back. He used to be head of Trading Standards which are like cops for this sort of thing. It's a very tricky game. I have sat and watched him at work and earns well out of it. They come through all day and he changes them very quickly. When I see him I will ask him but the law may be different in the USA than England. Have you actual add that complaining about? I think he would have to see it, rather than me try to explain it to him.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
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