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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » If you had to choose? Which would they be? (8 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, mediocre_magic wrote:
Is there any reason books are excluded? There is a greater wealth and diversity of material in books than video.

I too am curious why these particular parameters were set to create a show. Hoping it's hypothetical and not as C.J. "says the actual question, "I want to knock together a quick show with as little practice as possible, and I have enough money for three dvds; which ones should I pick?"

Videos are great, but reading is fundamental!


I have about 14 years of aquired books. Annemen and Corriendas (Didnt check the spelling) are great books. No. Its not to slap a show together without practice. Im not an idiot.
Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, IAIN wrote:
What one person can do might gain rabid applause...in the hands of another, it will be ignored or mocked...

sooooo, do you have sufficient personality, character, voice, presence and charisma to carry it all off?

if you have, you don't really need any advice...

not being clever, but having easy to do stuff has zero to do with your entertainment value...


My close up audiences that hire me regularly would probably agree that I have quite a personality.
Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, robwar0100 wrote:
Here's the thing, I have been working on a mentalism show since at least 2001/2003 (never remember which year I began the journey), and I am still not happy with my show. I have materials from Richard Osterlind, Bob Cassidy, Rick Maue, Max Maven, Ian Rowland, Patrick Redford, etc., and I can put together a show, but I am still not happy with it. Probably the reason I am not happy with it is, because, while I have been an ardent student of magic since the 1970s and mentalism for the past decade, I have not taken the time to sit down and figure out exactly what I *want* to do for a show, it has always been what *can* I do.

With influences from Osterlind, Maue and Rudy Coby, I am finally working on creating something uniquely personalized to fit me, my character and my personality. Accomplishing something like that takes more than three DVDs, more than just reading about mentalism and more than just looking for tricks that are easy to execute.

I am not sure who said it, but the hard way is the easy way (it could have been Bob Cassidy quoting from Amateur Magician's Handbook). I once complained about all of the money I have spent on books, videos, DVDs, props and effects that have become useless to me because of where I am as a performer. Richard Osterlind reminded me the journey was not wasted. All of those things have helped shape who I am.

I wish you well in your endeavor. Perform what you like, forget about what we like. If you perform what you like, you will be happy when you get on stage, it will be obvious to your audience and they will like you. Mentalism is so much more than effects/demonstrations/experiments. Mentalism is about you connecting with your audience. Good luck finding out how to do that on a DVD.

Bobby


Thank you!
Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, Athos wrote:
I took Ken Weber maximum entertainment and crammed it into a cd case, does that work?


I own it and read it so many times the pages are starting to fall out. AMAZING BOOK!!! EVERY SERIOUS PERFORMER SHOULD HAVE IT ON THE "MUST READ" , List of their books.

Thanks. Even if you were being sarcastic.
Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Imagine a lay person - a potential booker maybe - reading threads like this.

"Oh, so some of these guys simply buy simple magic tricks that anyone can do, call it a "show" and call themselves professionals?

"So there's no real talent then?

"Could anyone suggest a good comedian or even a juggler?"


I think every laymen knows that a magic store exists somewhere in the wrolds. The is mute.
mastermindreader
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You might have worded your OP differently if this was just intended as a game.

Because all too often we see people here who seem to believe that a commercial all-purpose mentalism show suitable for any venue can be done by anyone who buys the right self-working tricks.
Head Case
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On Apr 16, 2014, twistedace wrote:
Bob is100% correct. I didn't even think of it this way.


I have NEVER had positive feedback from Bob. He is one of my favorite performers. Almost an idol. However not some much with the way he talks to people in these forms. Or at least specifically any post I have ever written that he has replied to. No disrespect. He is absolutely one of the greats. His drunken penguin lecture was amazing.
C.J.
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I don't understand the hostility. I said that I could interpret your question one of two ways - the cynical way, or the "answer the question" way. I then answered the question, assuming the best, that this was in fact a genuine hypothetical question. I then highlighted for those who might question the simplistic nature of my choices that straightforward, entry-level DVDs can contain potent stuff if they are handled right. Then your angry response tries to correct me by saying exactly what I just said. So I'm very confused.

The confusion is compounded in that you chose to attack me when I'm the only person in this thread who actually spent their precious time answering the question. I accepted your challenge, mentally built a show from three DVDs, and then posted the names of the DVDs the effects were drawn from. But by doing so, I am told that my answer is invalid because I dared to say that a good show can come from basic sources (even though that's a premise you've just completely agreed with), and I'm told that my answer is in fact "condescending advice".

This is a lovely place. Thank you.
Connor Jacobs - The Thought Sculptor
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Be fondly remembered.
Head Case
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On Apr 17, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
You might have worded your OP differently if this was just intended as a game.

Because all too often we see people here who seem to believe that a commercial all-purpose mentalism show suitable for any venue can be done by anyone who buys the right self-working tricks.


It would just be nice that people wouldnt catagorize me into the insta-youtube magician catagory off the bat. Iv probably done more shows than most the other posters (Excluding you Bob) I am just flinging out ideas, Im very idealistic, and like to try and find material to create shows just for fun. I am not talking about my professional routines.

I want to find effects that resemble the way PVP is done. You can do it almost impromptu (Grab a few envelopes and some cash, It can be done for 10 or 100 people, There is not real slights in it, etc) Its a purely presentation effect. And that is what I am trying to find more of. So please excuse my OP. And all following replies to posts. I do get annoyed by condescending replies, they do no support the magic community, the art, and are not constructive. Its almost as bad as trying to tell someone you are going to kick their ass over the internet. Completely useless. haha.
Head Case
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On Apr 17, 2014, C.J. wrote:
I don't understand the hostility. I said that I could interpret your question one of two ways - the cynical way, or the "answer the question" way. I then answered the question, assuming the best, that this was in fact a genuine hypothetical question. I then highlighted for those who might question the simplistic nature of my choices that straightforward, entry-level DVDs can contain potent stuff if they are handled right. Then your angry response tries to correct me by saying exactly what I just said. So I'm very confused.

The confusion is compounded in that you chose to attack me when I'm the only person in this thread who actually spent their precious time answering the question. I accepted your challenge, mentally built a show from three DVDs, and then posted the names of the DVDs the effects were drawn from. But by doing so, I am told that my answer is invalid because I dared to say that a good show can come from basic sources (even though that's a premise you've just completely agreed with), and I'm told that my answer is in fact "condescending advice".

This is a lovely place. Thank you.


Sorry for the hostility, It was in the heat of the moment. It would be nice to maybe have someone ask questions to get a better understanding, then read 30% of posts just mocking you... Sorry to group you in with the rest.

Thank you for your replies sir.
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On Apr 17, 2014, Derek Castillo wrote:
... I do get annoyed by condescending replies, they do no support the magic community, the art, and are not constructive. Its almost as bad as trying to tell someone you are going to kick their ass over the internet. Completely useless. haha.


We save our best discussions and community support for other, less-public forums. Smile
Connor Jacobs - The Thought Sculptor
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Be fondly remembered.
Head Case
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I am going to post up a new thread trying to ask the question in a better way.
mastermindreader
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On Apr 17, 2014, Derek Castillo wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 16, 2014, twistedace wrote:
Bob is100% correct. I didn't even think of it this way.


I have NEVER had positive feedback from Bob. He is one of my favorite performers. Almost an idol. However not some much with the way he talks to people in these forms. Or at least specifically any post I have ever written that he has replied to. No disrespect. He is absolutely one of the greats. His drunken penguin lecture was amazing.


If you thought that was "drunken" you've obviously never drank with me.

Next time I'm working the Castle (this June) come by and I'll buy you a drink. You'll see that I'm not such a bad guy.

But I'd love an example of the "way he talks to people in these forums."

I genuinely try to be helpful, but I must admit I can get a bit annoyed when I feel that the art is being trivialized. If your original post had been worded a bit differently (as in your new thread) I wouldn't have responded that way. But it genuinely sounded like you were looking for an all-purpose, all-occasion act of self-working effects that could be purchased on a DVD.
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Also please it is sleight-of-hand. One of my big pet peeves.

Bobby - Henry Hay's second chapter in "Amateur Magician's Handbook" is titled "Hard Easy Tricks and Easy Hard Tricks". That and the first chapter "The Magic State of Mind" are pure gold. Should be read by every aspiring performer multiple times. All of the students I've ever accepted had to be conversant with those two chapters before we ever began.
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Bdekolta-

Nice to know someone else has the same peeve.

I agree that "Hard Easy Tricks and Easy Hard Tricks" should be required reading. When I was just starting out Hay's book was my Bible. I can probably recite large portions of it by memory.

There is a very good reason that it is the first book I suggest in my "39 Steps to Mentalism."
Head Case
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On Apr 17, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 17, 2014, Derek Castillo wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 16, 2014, twistedace wrote:
Bob is100% correct. I didn't even think of it this way.


I have NEVER had positive feedback from Bob. He is one of my favorite performers. Almost an idol. However not some much with the way he talks to people in these forms. Or at least specifically any post I have ever written that he has replied to. No disrespect. He is absolutely one of the greats. His drunken penguin lecture was amazing.


If you thought that was "drunken" you've obviously never drank with me.

Next time I'm working the Castle (this June) come by and I'll buy you a drink. You'll see that I'm not such a bad guy.

But I'd love an example of the "way he talks to people in these forums."

I genuinely try to be helpful, but I must admit I can get a bit annoyed when I feel that the art is being trivialized. If your original post had been worded a bit differently (as in your new thread) I wouldn't have responded that way. But it genuinely sounded like you were looking for an all-purpose, all-occasion act of self-working effects that could be purchased on a DVD.


I'm sure your a wonderful guy in person. Id love for you to buy me a drink Smile When I said drunken penguin lecture I meant cus you kept pulling out the alch. I thought it was funny as hell. One of the more "entertaining" lectures iv seen haha. I agree that I could have worded the OP differently. I tend to write out a post without thinking when I'm on my phone. I always forget that I need to choose what I saw wisely, especially in the mentalism threads. lol
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Dan Harlan and I thought it would be funny if we openly poured rum into our "coffee" cups during the lecture. I didn't think they'd let us do it.

At my next lecture maybe I'll put a bong on the table...
dmoses
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I don't know who said it originally, but Andrew Gerard reminded me of it last week:
"We need better problems"
"You're a comedian. You wanna do mankind a service, tell funnier jokes."
TPR by Dave Moses and Iain Dunford
Head Case
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On Apr 18, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Dan Harlan and I thought it would be funny if we openly poured rum into our "coffee" cups during the lecture. I didn't think they'd let us do it.

At my next lecture maybe I'll put a bong on the table...


HAHAHAHAHA
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