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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Reading body language (2 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

dd123
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I am currently studying body language (before moving onto Lorayne's Superpower Memory), just out of personal interest more than anything else. However it has got me wondering if anyone uses such a skill as part of their mentalism act at all? If so, how useful is it and how is it best put to use? I have obviously read the muscle reading section in 39 Steps, however I feel that this is a little different. But please correct me if I am wrong.
Many thanks, Duncan.
mastermindreader
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Body Language is often used as a premise, but only rarely as an actual method. You'll learn a much more practical and real skill by reading Lorayne's book.
MatthewSims
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Body language is extremely useful in mentalism, if for no other reason than to be familiar with it for when the subject comes up in discussion. Many routines rely solely on body language for them to work. Patrick Reford's Prevaricator and Jerome's Thought Channel are testaments to this.

A wonderful and classic text on non verbal communication in regards to mentalism is Banchek's Psychological Subleties.

Now bear in mind, a lot of what is out there on the subject has to be taken with a grain of salt. A lot of it is hype. Things like eye accessing cues in NLP...there is just no evidence for this. Yes someone may break eye contact and go into a "mental search" for information...but all that is telling us is that they are thinking about something.

As for the difference between muscle reading and body language, they are both forms of non verbal commuincation. However, they are different in the sense that muscle reading involves making contact with someone's body (usually the wrist) and allowing them to reveal thoughts or hidden objects by utilizing the ideomotor response.

In regards to body language reading, you do not have to be in contact with someone's body in order to deduce what they might be thinking, or hiding. Law enforcement officers for example, can tell when someone they have pulled over is possibly guilty of something from reading "nervous cues"...and of course skunky odors emanating from their vehicle Smile
MatthewSims
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*Update*

Bob beat me to it. I would for sure dedicate more time to training my memory than by trying to read up on body language. A much more applicable skill, as Bob said.
dd123
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Indeed, I am reading up on it so I am able to demonstrate it as a premise whenever it comes up in conversation. For example using a simple card f@rce and revealing their card after asking questions where I study their body language when they give their answers. Petty basic I know, but I wanted to have the associated knowledge to back up my patter.
george1953
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I have had the Lorayne book for a long time and use the methods given. I sometimes do a demonstration of memory in my show, if you want to see how effective this type of thing is watch Harry Lorayne do it, I saw him on a video tape doing his me,ory act on TV where he recalled the names of everyone in the audience. I can't tell you how impressive it was, and if you learn it its something you always have with you. I would tell you the name of that show but I CANT remember ;-)
By failing to prepare, we are preparing to fail.
Harry Lorayne
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George: 24 times with Johnny Carson on The Tonight Show - 20 of those times I did the audience names and faces thing. Also, many times with Merv Griffin, Mike Douglas, Dinah Shore, That's Incredible, Good Morning America, Jack Paar, Ed Sullivan, and on and on. And in Australia, England (Paul Daniels Show, The Parkinson Show, Holland, and more. And there's an hour of me doing the memory stuff for a lay audience on Vol. 4 of my 4-volume "Best Ever" DVD set. HL.
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]

http://www.harrylorayne.com
http://www.harryloraynemagic.com
Bill Cushman
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Harry, how in the world can you recall all of those details? You must have one superpowered memory!
Ben_cardall
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I like to try and use as much genuine reading skills in my act as possible sometimes more than effects to be honest.
george1953
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Harry, I watched that tape over and over, I showed my son who is reading your super memory book, he was totally flabbergasted at your performance, as we all are.
By failing to prepare, we are preparing to fail.
ganesubu007
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Can anyone say any program that teaches body language cues to be incorporated (mainly) in their act. Like Patrick's Prevaricator.
mastermindreader
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On May 29, 2014, ganesubu007 wrote:
Can anyone say any program that teaches body language cues to be incorporated (mainly) in their act. Like Patrick's Prevaricator.


Seeing as this is your first post, may I ask if you perform mentalism and, of so, how long have you been doig it?

(It's customary for new members to introduce themselves before asking questions. We like to have an idea about who we're responding to.)

Thanks.
ganesubu007
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Thank you Bob,
I've been practicing mentalism for roughly two years now. I am a certified NLP practitioner and Hypnotist.
I started mentalism initially with tricks but somehow lost interest (even though I got good response from people) and wish to incorporate hypnosis, NLP and body language in my act.
I don't know the custom here. My bad! I would make a new post telling above info and ask for some recommendations in the field I am interested at.
mastermindreader
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The fact is that NLP and body language are generally used as themes in mentalism, not as actual methods. The late Ned Rutledge referred to this as "using five senses to create the illusion of a sixth."

Over the years many mentalists got away from the more traditional telepathy/mind reading premise and adopted the Rutledge approach. It became very popular when Derren Brown came on the scene and claimed to use such psychological techniques. Copycats literally came from out of the woodwork, trying to be the next Derren and many newcomers thought that the road to mastering mentalism began by studying NLP and body language.

The fact is, however, that traditional methods are still the ones that most professionals (including Derren) use. There are very few effects that actually use NLP or body language as they are hardly reliable.

As a theme,or premise, though, they are very effective and many, but not all by any means, believe them to be more plausible.

When you reach fifty posts you'll be able to access Inner Thoughts, where the actual methods used by mentalists are more openly discussed.

Good thoughts,

Bob

BTW- What's your name and where are you from?
swamister
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The underlying problem (for me) with the whole influence/persuasion thing - is that indirectly you are saying "i can manipulate people's behaviour, in a cognitive and emotional way..."

when you start thinking about that, and you are playing it for real - I find that somewhat creepy and sinister...as it means that on a daily basis, in your relationships and so on...you have the opportunity to do that kind of thing...not the sort of person I'd want to be around or watch...(unless they manipulated me into doing so obviously)...

its why out of the two major ways of presenting things, thought reading is almost playful in a way "i can only do this with your help, with your permission, because you enable me to do so by focusing on xyz"

there's an extreme for both sides, and I wonder what an Alexander type character would be like these days? Probably more like Van Praahg or John Edward maybe? But with more consistent hit rates..
ganesubu007
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As Bob mentioned, I began my search for real stuffs in mentalism and as many guessed, I believed such things exists bcoz of Mentalist's fake explanation for a trick Smile Now I realized that its one of the beauty and trickery of mentalism. Its not that real mind reading via body language doesn't exist, but its rare and methods are unreliable. I am interested in that small skill building area.
Any recommendations of products in such area will be appreciated.

BTW, I am Subu, Indian and currently living in USA.

Cheers
Doc Ben
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Quote:
On May 27, 2014, george1953 wrote:
I have had the Lorayne book for a long time and use the methods given. I sometimes do a demonstration of memory in my show, if you want to see how effective this type of thing is watch Harry Lorayne do it, I saw him on a video tape doing his me,ory act on TV where he recalled the names of everyone in the audience. I can't tell you how impressive it was, and if you learn it its something you always have with you. I would tell you the name of that show but I CANT remember ;-)


I have fond and amazed memories of Harry's demonstration of this feat with Ed Sullivan show more than once...! Caused me to buy both the Roth Memory text and the Lorayne books. Smile
"Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" (the original F. Baum)
backinblack
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Rick maue: imagine
dd123
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So I have just finished reading Joe Navarro's book, What Every Body Is Saying, which is a very insightful read in itself. But I am only 4 chapters in on Harry Lorayne's Superpower Memory and already feel that I have learnt new skills and processes. I cannot wait to get into the real workings of this book, and I really think that this could be a game changer for me. Fingers crossed.
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