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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » What do we think about? (10 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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John C
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Eternal Order
I THINK therefore I wrote
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... Selling magic, good magic, on Amazon? I mean I suppose it's inevitable but if it's there it's something I wouldn't buy. Just my philosophy.

http://www.amazon.com/Knockem-Peter-Nard......082JHVVW
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DWRackley
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Personally I’d rather we still lived in the days when you had to travel to a brick & mortar shop, where the guy behind the counter would size you up before he would sell you anything beyond “slum magic”. But that’s not where we are, and it’s up to us to deal with it.

To answer the question I think you’re asking, no I wouldn’t use anything that was too readily available to the masses. I make it a point to “change up” anything I get anyway, but performing something that’s gone “mainstream” is just asking for trouble.
...what if I could read your mind?

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Amirá
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Offering magic/mentalism secrets on public spaces has obviously different ethical points of view, but whats the difference of this and read magic books on a local lybrary? Or a open magic shop?
I don't see myself buying a book in modern dance arts because I don't have interest in learning those topics. Normal persons thinks the same.

Some close persons, relatives and friends knows that I publish material for other performers, but they don't buy it.

We are in a digital era where information moves quickly and open. I still believe that our secrets are safe.


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mastermindreader
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The problem is that many mainstream dealers (who sell effects they get from wholesalers) also sell their wares on Amazon. Potentially, therefore, every effect and book could be available there. Even used copies of privately published materials show up from time to time.
Scott Soloff
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Quote:
On Jul 13, 2014, DWRackley wrote:
Personally I’d rather we still lived in the days when you had to travel to a brick & mortar shop, where the guy behind the counter would size you up before he would sell you anything beyond “slum magic”. But that’s not where we are, and it’s up to us to deal with it.


When I was a boy I went to Jack Chanin's magic shop every week (about 12 years old). Took the train into city by myself (wouldn't dream of letting my kids do that when they were growing up). It was more like a studio than a store. Leather chairs and sofa and oriental rugs. Paraphernalia and posters and books everywhere. You didn't go in and tell Jack what you were looking for. First, he would entertain you with some beautiful sleight of hand. Next he would go over and pull something down and demonstrate it for you. That's what you bought. The following week I had to show him the progress I made before he sold me anything else.

Boy, do I miss those days. Unfortunately, there's no going back.

Best wishes,


Scott
'Curiouser and curiouser."
mastermindreader
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Elaborating on my previous post, the effect mentioned in the OP is sold on Amazon by Wizards Headquarters, an online magic dealer who sells and ships the item as a third party. That dealer alone has 160 pages of items on Amazon.

See: http://www.amazon.com/gp/aag/main?ie=UTF......V59JIT58
Tom Cutts
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In what way is Amazon not the equivalent of a back of magazine advert in the 1960's.
sandsjr
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If you were someone interested in learning magic tricks you'd google, "magic tricks." Look at what shows up on the first page... Penguin, ellusionist, theory11 etc.

In 99 percent of the cases, if people have a strong enough desire to learn a secret, they can find it online somewhere.

You can't worry about it or you'll drive yourself crazy. Google, "cheap magic tricks." Follow the links to your hearts content.


I think Amira got it right...
Quote:
I don't see myself buying a book in modern dance arts because I don't have interest in learning those topics. Normal persons thinks the same.

The Forgotten One
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This discussion sound very familiar. It was discussion what happened when internet and Wikipedia become more popular. Before internet, people memorized a lot more every kind of small details and information and if you wanted to check some information, you needed book for that. It could be your own book or book from library. But it took little bit more time than now days.
Now in internet times, we can just reach to our smart phones and Google pretty much what ever we might want to know. And some people belittle information what come from internet, even if that information come originally from book what they respect a lot. How information or knowledge become more bad because of the source? (if we assume both sources are as trust worth!) Or because it is more widely available? someone could say that everybody can write facts on internet, but same goes with books now days... There is a lot false information available in books too and you always have to be thinking critically if you trust the source or not.

Now days information is spread widely and are right away available. Same goes with magic. I understand that effect suck if your audience understand how it is done, but that is the world where we live now. I dare to say that pretty much all magic is mainstream now days, there just isn't a lot of secrets/effects/sleights what are hard to get in your hands. This is the true at least what come to books and dvd's.
And honestly, I truly believe that if someone is interested, he should be able to study/learn/buy what ever he wants. Of course now days there is a lot of tricks revealed also, but luckily, not everybody are interested about magic or how it work.

And in the other hands. I'm very tired to see how magicians do same tricks years after years and copy each others. This new era of widely available information also challenge us to develop our own effects what don't be in books or revealed in Youtube. IMHO we should be doing it anyway! Developing our own magic.
I have studied a lot of coin sleights. And I have seen to many matrix and 2 or 3 fly's... Why not study the sleights and then start thinking what else we can do with those sleights than those couple ready made tricks or variations of them? Our own imagination is our only limitation. We should be using our own imagination instead of copying what others are doing.
From my point of view, I don't really mind that magic is available to anyone who want to learn. (of course I do mind people who break magicians code for example...) I consider books just as basic structure. it is something where you start to build your own effects and magic. It isn't the whole magic, it is only the start.

Also country where I'm living, I don't known that here would be even one single brick and mortar magic shop anywhere! There is couple online shops and at least couple brick and mortar banter device/gadgets shops what also sell couple cheap effects for kids... And truly, that is pretty lame! For me internet shops and internet shopping is way of the living, and without internet I would be not making magic at all. And I would not be seeing magic too much either.
So internet is good opportunity to people like me. Internet make bad things happens, but also a lot of good things. So in my scale, Amazon and other shops are Ok.
And anyway! Who go to the milk shop and let shopkeeper to tell that "today you don't buy milk, but instead of sugar!" We would say F word to that man and walk straight to the other shop who sell us what we want. So why we should be tolerating that in world of magic and let shopkeeper decide what we should buy or what is available for us?
IAIN
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Pretty much every online shop, even ones owned by bricks and mortar magic shops happily display photos of sw**is and so on...
ELDEMONIO
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Quote:
On Jul 13, 2014, Amirá wrote:
Offering magic/mentalism secrets on public spaces has obviously different ethical points of view, but whats the difference of this and read magic books on a local lybrary? Or a open magic shop?
I don't see myself buying a book in modern dance arts because I don't have interest in learning those topics. Normal persons thinks the same.

Some close persons, relatives and friends knows that I publish material for other performers, but they don't buy it.

We are in a digital era where information moves quickly and open. I still believe that our secrets are safe.


Best


Amira put it best I think. We live in the digital age of information and everything is readily available. The good thing is that there's tons of other non magic information online to keep laymen busy. I think the curious layman will at most buy a few tricks perhaps some books and shortly after stop pursuing magic as it takes a lot of effort. The curious layman will then become our biggest fans as he is in the "know" because he learned a few tricks. If anything we have gained a new appreciator of magic in my opinion.

There's also sooooooo much magic available that there will always be those hidden gems throughout the literature that aren't online. We can be assured that we will always be able to mystify audiences for ages to come. Doesn't worry me one bit. The real secrets are not available online, the real secrets are in how you perform and make people feel.
Waters
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In this day and time, it is true that (lay)people's apathy is the only thing protecting secrets.
jaizon
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Some sell their wares on Lybrary.com, which in the realm of mentalism is no different from selling it on Amazon, nor is selling it from your own website. That is not a judgment, just an observation. I've seen a few websites have a "special code" you have to enter before you can see what they're selling, a famous magician's name, for example, to get it, but that's hardly any real protection from the hoi polloi.
Anthony Jacquin
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I find that many lay people have no idea you can buy magic from a magic shop. It has never crossed their mind. They never thought of it since their first kids magic set.
Anthony Jacquin

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george1953
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As an example, Davenports magic shop is in a very busy railway station, with literally thousands of people passing by every day. It's obviously a magic shop yet how many of those thousands actually stop and go in ?
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George Hunter
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Wizard is the seller, and they now do much of their marketing through Amazon. More and more sellers of an incredible range of products are doing this. Amazon did not becoming a giant by selling books alone.

George
Syndrome
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I think the increase of online opportunities is a good thing for everyone. It has the effect of evolving the art faster. More people buy, more people think, more people invent.
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mastermindreader
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Not sure I like what the art seems to be evolving into.
Jamie D
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More people buy the more people expose IMO. I personally don't like it which is why I perform mostly using techniques not sold as single effects, rather taken from what I've learned from years back.
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Martin Pulman
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Quote:
On Jul 14, 2014, george1953 wrote:
As an example, Davenports magic shop is in a very busy railway station, with literally thousands of people passing by every day. It's obviously a magic shop yet how many of those thousands actually stop and go in ?


Davenports is tucked away in a barely used underpass. I actually can't recall seeing anyone pass it!
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