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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » So you just handed an indifferent card to the spectator... (2 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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frankie5aces
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They think it's their selected card. because it's face down.

how do you keep them from turning it over out of curiosity before they put it in the deck/fan/etc?

any audience management techniques y'all use during those very dangerously guilty moments?
Ray Bertrand
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Audience control is key. Have them place their hand face down on the face down card. Then you tell them what you want them to do.

Ray
Mentalism in Ontario.
daffydoug
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Key here is your own belief and confidence. It will telegraph to them. They will pick up on that. Don't give them time to think about it. Move briskly into the next step. Have them cover it with their other hand. Emphasize how "secure" it is with them covering it that way. "You are now holding that card securely in your hand and their is no way I can get to it!" (Lol, you don't need to, because it's already changed!) but you are now misdirecting their brain into a different chain of thought. )

The strongest effect I perform in this genre is Jon Allen's "Double Back". In this effect they actually SEE the other cards faces in your hands before the transpo takes place. They SEE two kings in your hand, further convincing them that they MUST be holding the fives. Very strong, to quote Boris Pocus. Very strong indeed.

I highly recommend this effect to you. 
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
motown
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In a moment I'm going to ask you to ______ . (Card sitting on table)

In addition to the spectator putting their hand on the card, you could put another object/ prop depending on what you're performing.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain
djurmann
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The more you do the effect the more relaxed you will be about it and the less it is a problem...don't try to rush it....if you are rushing you are tense, and if you are tense it will tell; go at a natural speed. If the card is being signed you can loosen but not remove the cap as you hand them the pen. Then both hands will be busy...one with the cap and one with the pen (a tip by Doc Eason in his anniversary waltz routine).
magic_man_jim
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Agree entirly with daffydoug!

Its all about how you direct your audience. With effects like Chicago opener or any where an already swiched card is in there hand or out in the open you have to give them a reason to not grab for it or turn it over. This comes from your body movements, your subconscience thoughts, and routining. Audience control is a hard thing to practice watching yourself in a mirror practicing. But it does come easier the more performances you do.

For the most part I have to say you need to know in your own mind that the card in there hand is unimportant. They are just holding that card for a moment. To direct the audience mind you need to create the focal point elsewhere. So your own internal script in your head would need to be along the lines of..."oh well that's not your card, hold that for a secound while I look for the card here." This is what you would naturaly be thinking in that situation and would cause your body language to react the same. Then when you have gone through the deck and cant find there card, or there are no other backs of that color, or whatever your routine is the shock value now will really hit them hard when they turn it over and its there card!

In my experience having them hold a card at there finger tips lightly as a afterthought... to here just hold this for a second, rather than playing it up and having them secure it with both hands and make sure I can not get to it... makes them forget about that card even more and hits them harder in the long run. But you have to convience yourself with the movements you are doing. Try thinking about an actual frame around an area you are wanting the focus instead of forcing someone to forget about whats in there hand.
Magic is not to fool...but allows you to believe!

Jim Boothe
www.jimboothemagic.com
jim@jimboothemagic.com
daffydoug
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Somehow , I don't know why, Slydini keeps coming to mind, here. Help me out, brothas!
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
1KJ
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I think this is why scripting routines is so important. The words you use and the confidence you have will determine the outcome. When I place a card in their hands that I don't want them to turn over, I have to give them a reason to not turn it over. Having them sandwich the card between their hands is very good, but you still need to give them a reason to not look at it. Your script could say something like "Hold onto this card real tight and don't let me touch it." This sort of script gives them a reason to keep you from getting at the card.

KJ
daffydoug
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I use that line a lot. Let them think or IMPLY that I intend to maybe vanish the card. If I plant that bee in their bonnet, they are going to hold it all the more secure so that my "fast hands" can't steal it. And when they are holding it tightly and securely, it becomes impossible for then to look at it.

Sneaky devil, aren't I?
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
Zephury
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Divert their attention. Misdirection!

Someone mentioned the chicago opener..

I do the standard handling (Shown in Michael Ammar's Easy to Master Card Miracles)
For the first phase, being the first card to turn opposite color, I set the card down and say "WATCH" I'm going to do this again.. Never once have I EVER had anyone pick up that card to look at it. They think they're about to get the chance to "catch me" this time. Your wording is IMPORTANT. Influence your spectators and MANIPULATE them to behave EXACTLY like you want. Careful thought and a bit of practice and that can be mastered.
daffydoug
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There are just so many nuances for the beginner to learn. I hope we don't overwhelm them with so much that they blow a fuse!
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
frankie5aces
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Thank you so much everyone!!
i'm working on a sandwich routine where I want to get the spec to put the indifferent card in the deck as I spring the cards/dribble them.
i'm sure it's an actual trick that has been taught by and created by someone..
although I don't know who..
i have the handling down, I just need that one guilty part to go perfectly. and sadly I've failed a couple times already.
i was thinking of placing it facedown on the table and asking the spec to push it off the table into my dribble.. but it just seems too unnatural that way.

do any of you know the name of the trick I'm working on?
kekoa1
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Frankie5aces, I think we'd need a little more information regarding the routine you are doing in order to correctly identify it?
daffydoug
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True.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
frankie5aces
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Ok let me give you the rundown.
(spoiler alert)

jokers are pulled out.. card is chosen by spec with a riffle.
placed on the top of the deck *casually* facedown.
jokers steal the chosen card, sandwiched..
and then I obviously place the sandwich (apparent 2 face up jokers) in the deck about midway
then hand the top card (face down) (making sure to remind the spec that it's his/her card)
and have him/her jam it into the deck as I riffle..


i then spread the cards and it's revealed that he/she put the chosen card right between the two face up jokers . ta da.


there's of course patter to make this more interesting.. but I need some patter to keep the spec from flipping over the card out of curiosity but still hold it freely to do the riffle placement.

any ideas?
daffydoug
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The pater may not always be necessary. Part of the secret comes the hard way: learning to read a persons face, body language and propensities. That can not be taught in a text.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
realErdnase
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Look at pop haydn's chicago surprise and he talks about how to make them think it is a mistake and wrong card

you just have to misdirect them from thinking about their hand and the card so keep their attention on other things such as the deck and your presentation
daffydoug
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That's pretty much it in a nutshell. Spectator managenent.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
E.E.
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If they think is their card, they don't have a reason to want to turn it over. It all relys on how you handle the audience, I can give you a few tips:

a) Act natural. If you don't believe that the card you hand them is their card, they will not believe it either.

b)never mention the card you just hand them. That will only cause suspicion.

c) ask them to put their hand with the back palm towards the floor to hold the card (between the thumb and the index finger)hard to explain, I can PM you a photo if you want.
this will prevent the espectator turning the card over most of the time since is uncomfortable.

d)make the patter of your trick in such a way that is imperative that the spectator must not see the card (like in the Three card monte routine)

Any question you can PM me, I will be pleased to help as much as I can Smile

Ever
I shall see you on the other side.
David Fillary
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Always give the spectator something to do, then they don't have a chance to think about looking at the card.
In chicago opener, get them to watch as you "repeat" the trick slowly for them. They're no longer thinking about the first card because if they are they will miss the second trick!

In your routine, hand them the card and say immediately "stick the card in whenever you feel like it" and immediately riffle it for them to place it in.
Don't mistake what I say here as me advising you to rush it. Just remove the dead time so they are straight away thinking about the task they have to do.

Also remember that some friends and family will always look. Seriously. My brother would always look - always! It's very different performing for strangers and people who love magic.



As a separate note on your routine, it would be more powerful if you could switch the card and leave it on the table before loading it into the jokers. Just something to think about for the long term. For now stick to your routine, but as you become more proficient think about how you could achieve this.
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