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Scott Soloff Special user Philadelphia, PA 960 Posts 
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Thank you.
'Curiouser and curiouser."
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sandsjr Special user 840 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 4, 2014, Engali wrote: Engali, in what way is talent overrated? I agree, having an anxiety issue is NOT indicative of a lack of "talent", of not being "cut out" for (insert occupation). A perfect example is Van Cliburn. He had to stop touring for a long period because of his nerves. You're not going to find too many pianists in the history of the world who are as talented as he was. However, my opinion FWIW, if you are considering going into a field and must seek professional help to take the first step, you might reconsider. That's all I'm saying. Now, if you are IN LOVE with what you want to get into, GO FOR IT! Yes a person can overcome. In fact, those are the kind of stories that make me very happy to hear about. I still disagree with your idea of failing on purpose. I don't think that's the answer. But it's just my opinion. Try it and tell me how it works out. I think a better idea would be to join Toastmasters as I stated in another post. Talk is talk though. So like Nike says, JUST DO IT! |
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 3, 2014, IAIN wrote: That's because the vast majority of people that go to conventions aren't really interested in that aspect of their hobby. In terms of the business side it's really only pros that care about tax, PRS, PLI, etc and there are so few of them (there is a Facebook group for genuine professional mentalists to discuss this kind of thing that requires proof of status to get in. It has five members....... I absolutely agree that lectures on stagecraft, persona etc would be tremendous value at conventions but again, in the world of mentalism at least, there are very few people qualified to lecture on the topic and very little appetite from the average convention attendee. Of course persona & stage craft is of very little use if your main audience is your friends and the folk down the pub. What you need is a steady stream of new tricks. Based on what my experience tells me verses what I've seen lecturers say, I would stake my mortgage on the percentage of lecturers I've seen at mentalism conventions who perform more than three stage shows a year in a ticketed public (I.e. Non magic club/magic world associated like The Magic Castle) venue at less than 20%. Real world experience is thin on the ground. I've just remembered another convention I attended run by Gary Jones which was about doing corporates. There were three lectures: Chris Dugdale did a talk on the psychology of the performer which was moderately useful. Marc Paul did a proper grown up presentation (which I believe you can buy a DVD of) on how to launch a trade show business which was outstanding. Seth Kramner & Michael Bailey both lectured some tricks and told some anecdotes about corporate bookings they had. Which was of little use. The latter two lectures were the most popular with the attendees though. Of the ones I know/knew none of them went on to become pros. Quelle Suprisè. The same guy who sits at the front row of every UK lecture with his glasses on a chain asking far too many questions was there, obviously. You know who I mean. He represents a caricature of the average conference attendee. They go because for them it's fun and it's their hobby. Michael Bailey |
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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Quote: On Aug 4, 2014, Suffolk wrote: |
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Rolyan Special user I'm fencing in my land; so far there are 590 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 3, 2014, IAIN wrote: There was a lecture at the Northern Magic Circle Convention several years ago on exactly that, the business side of table hopping. it was called 'Table Hopping with both feet On The Ground'. It was all about the business side, how to run the business, close the deal, increase fees, approach tables, etc etc etc. Apparently it was as well received as those by John Archer and Greg Wilson! Those types of lectures (and the accompanying lecture notes) are very few and far between, but seem to go down REALLY well when used. I only wish more convention organisors would do them, the attendees certainly seem to like them. |
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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Apologies. Writing this on an iPhone has made my above post look weird. It should read:
Quote:
On Aug 3, 2014, IAIN wrote: That's because the vast majority of people that go to conventions aren't really interested in that aspect of their hobby. In terms of the business side it's really only pros that care about tax, PRS, PLI, etc and there are so few of them (there is a Facebook group for genuine professional mentalists to discuss this kind of thing that requires proof of status to get in. It has five members....... I absolutely agree that lectures on stagecraft, persona etc would be tremendous value at conventions but again, in the world of mentalism at least, there are very few people qualified to lecture on the topic and very little appetite from the average convention attendee. Of course persona & stage craft is of very little use if your main audience is your friends and the folk down the pub. What you need is a steady stream of new tricks. Based on what my experience tells me verses what I've seen lecturers say, I would stake my mortgage on the percentage of lecturers I've seen at mentalism conventions who perform more than three stage shows a year in a ticketed public (I.e. Non magic club/magic world associated like The Magic Castle) venue at less than 20%. Real world experience is thin on the ground. I've just remembered another convention I attended run by Gary Jones which was about doing corporates. There were three lectures: Chris Dugdale did a talk on the psychology of the performer which was moderately useful. Marc Paul did a proper grown up presentation (which I believe you can buy a DVD of) on how to launch a trade show business which was outstanding. Seth Kramner & Michael Bailey both lectured some tricks and told some anecdotes about corporate bookings they had. Which was of little use. The latter two lectures were the most popular with the attendees though. Of the ones I know/knew none of them went on to become pros. Quelle Suprisè. The same guy who sits at the front row of every UK lecture with his glasses on a chain asking far too many questions was there, obviously. You know who I mean. He represents a caricature of the average conference attendee. They go because for them it's fun and it's their hobby. |
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts
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I thought that guy was some kind of audience interactive spectre...
I've asked to be banned
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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New act. Right there
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Davidzajac New user 63 Posts
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Here's an update. I've now performed several times. They were all great. Thanks for all the support from this forum. P.s. My one friend who I met in a coffee shop couldn't stop laughing historically he said that's scary good. And it's because of all you wonderful mentalist that I have elevated what I do from tricks to something greater. I'm taking all your advice seriously and I intend to practice some new tricks over my somewhat short summer break. Thanks.
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Rolyan Special user I'm fencing in my land; so far there are 590 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 4, 2014, Suffolk wrote: You would be surprised how many ARE interested, given half the chance (see my post above). If more organisors did it the more they would realise how popular it was. I gave Michael some feedback on this re the Minds convention and he's giving it serious consideration for next year. |
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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Roylan - I've offered to lecture on this before. No one was interested
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Rolyan Special user I'm fencing in my land; so far there are 590 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 4, 2014, Suffolk wrote: I blame the organisers and their shortsightedness; many 'normal' performers would be pleased given half a chance. |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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The sad fact is that, outside of the PEA, most people that go to mentalism gatherings want to learn "new tricks."
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Davidzajac New user 63 Posts
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What is PEA?
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Suffolk Veteran user 400 Posts
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It's a kind of legume.
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harris Inner circle Harris Deutsch 8812 Posts
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Same in magic.
Some people call some magicians, Lay people with a business card. Sewiously yours. Harris Formerly known as The Phoenix. 70's The Mime over Matter - 80's Nearly Normal Magician - 90's to 00's
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com music, magic and marvelous toys http://magician.org/member/drlaugh4u |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 5, 2014, Davidzajac wrote: The Psychic Entertainers Association- the oldest and largest society of mentalist in the world. http://www.p-e-a.org/ |
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robwar0100 Inner circle Buy me some newspapers.Purchase for me 1 Gazette and 1747 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 3, 2014, IAIN wrote: There was some of this at MagiFest in Columbus, Ohio, this year. But, as someone else has mentioned, conventions attract a lot of the hobbyists, who want magic, magic and more magic. Richard Osterlind has a book about the business side of magic. Bobby
"My definition of chance is my hands on the wheel," Greg Long.
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Davidzajac New user 63 Posts
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That sounds interesting. I think membership has definite perks.
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Posted: Aug 4, 2014 05:44 am 
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