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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » I.S.I.S. (17 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mastermindreader
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How about this, Lobo, which was what I was referring to?

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/immigra......-n152216
LobowolfXXX
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Ohhhh you didn't specify that you meant Ebola and Dengue Fever; you just said "diseases." So then you don't dispute that illegal immigrants from those areas DO carry diseases like chicken pox and T.B. - diseases that would bar applicants for LEGAL immigration from entering the country - and are permitted to remain and recieve treatment at taxpayer expense?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
mastermindreader
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I was, as you surely know, referring to the lies being spread by fear mongers as described in the NBC story I cited.
LobowolfXXX
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So, it's true that communicable diseases are being brought by illegal immigrants from south of the border. It's true that current policy benefits illegal immigrants by allowing them to remain in the country and receive subsidized treatment for diseases that would keep applicants for legal immigration out. But the racist fear-mongering is that although some of those reports are true, some of the specified diseases are false.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
mastermindreader
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The racist fear mongering is that illegal immigrants are bringing Ebola into the United States. Coupled with the evidence-free allegations that ISIS is sneaking in through the Mexican border, the pandering to the right wing-extremists is obvious.

Nothing like a bit of xenophobia to stir things up in an election year.
LobowolfXXX
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We have no idea whether ISIS is sneaking in through the Mexican border. Given that millions of people HAVE successfully done so, it hardly seems like a stretch to think it's happened.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
mastermindreader
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Surely you'd agree that it's fear mongering when the allegation is made with no evidence whatsoever to back it up.
LobowolfXXX
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I think it's speculative - an unproven allegation. Which doesn't mean it's false, nor does it mean that it's probably false. I think it's a valid concern in a country where rewarding past illegal immigeation is prioritized higher than preventing future illegal immigration.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
lunatik
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Bobs new name is Mongrel. He's infatuated with the word mongering, so he shouldn't take offense Smile
"Don't let your Dreams become Fantasies"
mastermindreader
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That would make my nickname Monger. But you can call me Mongo if you like.

lunatik
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Mongo bongo! Smile
"Don't let your Dreams become Fantasies"
mastermindreader
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Don't mess with Mongo

lunatik
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Oh schnaaaaps! That's an auto win for you in my book haha
"Don't let your Dreams become Fantasies"
landmark
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Quote:
On Oct 10, 2014, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On Oct 10, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
And I have no doubt that a large part of the anti-immigrant fear mongering in this country is fueled by racism.


Most of what's commonly referred to as "anti-immigrant" is in actuality "anti-illegal-immigrant."

Just lost a long post replying to this but its essence is this:
Most? No I disagree. I'll buy "some" but not most. In fact what I think is true is just the opposite: that most of what's commonly referred to as " anti - illegal immigration" is "anti immigrant. "
Dannydoyle
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Proof of same landmark?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
landmark
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Fair comment. I can't offer proof, but I do offer these observations:

1)In NYC where I live, theoretically one of the more liberal parts of the nation, scarcely a day goes by where I do not hear some variation on the following about some of the people who live in my neighborhood:

a) Why don't those people learn to speak English!
b) They are all on food stamps and welfare.
c) They ignore Americans in their stores and serve their own kind first.
d) They are criminals.

BTW I hear all these comments about the Russian immigrants in my neighborhood. Now you will notice that none of those comments has anything to do with the legality of their immigration status. The essential complaint is not that they are illegal, but that they are different and plentiful and weren't here before. I don't think it unreasonable to think that the same kinds of conversations happen all over the US.

2) In many municipalities where laws and enforcement policies have been implemented to ostensibly target illegal immigrants, the dragnet fairly indiscriminately causes immense hardships to all immigrants regardless of legal status. It breaks up families, it puts people in a constant state of fear, it creates situations where racial profiling can't help but happen. I submit that we would not let this kind of hardship be allowed to happen to any other group of innocent people in the name of upholding the law. I think law enforcement and politicians get away with it, because immigrants from some countries are considered de facto second-class citizens.

3) In my neighborhood again, there live many immigrants from the Soviet union who were given visas for political reasons. No question that many under the Soviets suffered and deserve to go to the country of their choice. But why does the same logic not apply to the people of Haiti? Compared to the political terror that the Haitians have endured, the Soviet immigrants were leaving a paradise. No, instead, the Haitian immigration into the US for many is basically labelled "illegal" and those people are viewed as criminals. They have done nothing wrong except try to flee to a place where they can lead a better life. But there is a double standard, and again it is not about the legal status but about discrimination against the people themselves. A similar case can be made for El Salvador and Honduras where masses of people are living under terrible political conditions. In Mexico, many of the intended immigrants are families whose livelihoods have been destroyed by US trade agreements. If your family's business was suddenly wiped out, you would try to feed them as well. No one wants to cross a desert at night and leave their home to go elsewhere.

4)If the President and Congress said tomorrow that immigration could continue unrestricted--that is all immigration would now be legal--would people now be satisfied? After all, there would no longer be illegal immigrants. The argument "but they're breaking the law" would no longer exist. And yet I think we would both agree that there would still be anti-immigrant movements. Maybe even more. Clearly there is something more than the abstract legal status of immigrants that is troubling to many.

Anyway that's a few points to ponder.
tommy
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In the 1930s the people who planned the mass mixing we see today pondered. Way back then they perfectly understood it would cause culture clashes and trouble. They said that they could get over it by calling it racism. Nothing new in all this, no nations, no borders, one people, one world government idea. You are an old man. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zI5hrcwU7Dk
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
landmark
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For one who is so obsessed with the Nazi Muslim brotherhood, I find it fascinating that you uphold their theories about race and culture mixing. Good job, young man.
tommy
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It's a matter of fact, not opiniom old boy. You can read their report and if you don't like it, you can lunp it.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Jonathan Townsend
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Quote:
On Oct 11, 2014, landmark wrote:...most of what's commonly referred to as " anti - illegal immigration" is "anti immigrant. "


We have a process. Not following that process and then protesting for additional rights raises some eyebrows. Agreed there are additional economic and political issues that can cloud the basic questions about the immigration-naturalization process.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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