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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The spooky, the mysterious...the bizarre! » » Sharing ruins it for everyone... (13 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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London, UK
887 Posts

Profile of LebanonCircle
Some of you may wonder what has happened to The Mystic Menagerie. Well, since Freddie and I discovered that more copies were being distributed freely amongst the community than purchased we've decided to stop producing the magazine.

You can only find yourself as a free download on a torrent site or private magic forum a few times before it takes the wind out of your sails (and sales!).

However, all is not lost. Freddie and I have put a lot of effort in the magazine over the years so we are just going to migrate to another format that can't be pirated and best of all it will be free! More news to follow so watch this space.

And just to prove what snakes lurk in our small and supposed loyal community I had to make this announcement on Kickstarter this morning....

It saddens me to write this to the point it makes me want to puke but within 72 hours of me sending out private links to the workshop digital download it has already been shared with non-backers.

That's right, some folk who backed the project have already given it away to other non-backers to watch for free. This not only discredits my hardwork it also destroys the whole spirit of Kickstarter and the supposed loyality of backing a project.

The links have therefore been taken down for now.

If someone missed the download from the download only backer level then I can send a private one time link however, all other backers will unfortunately have to wait for the DVD.

The reason I discovered this is because a good friend actually paid me for a copy as he was sent a free copy by a backer!

I appreciate the integrity and loyalty of everyone who has downloaded and not shared but to those who have I have no choice but to blacklist them from all future projects, Lebanon Circle and Pyewackett and Pecke.

Darkly (very Darkly indeed)

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Inner circle
Mallorca (Spain)
5944 Posts

Profile of george1953
Sad news if ever there was, I used to enjoy the menagerie :-(
By failing to prepare, we are preparing to fail.
Lord Freddie
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Inner circle
1093 Posts

Profile of Lord Freddie
It is sad George, but there is so much piracy within magic it hardly makes it worth it for us to produce the magazine any more. We put a lot of hard work and effort into creating each issue only to find people uploading it to torrent sites or sending a copy on to their friends. It's stealing and something which is rampant within magic. We tried to produce a high quality magazine as cheaply as possible so it was accessible and vainly hoped the cheap price would deter pirates but nope - people still copy it. The bizarre community is not as large as the general magic one and I innocently thought those within that field would appreciate what we were doing and would be loyal, we even printed editorials in some issues stating what had happened but people still did it.
We will continue in another form which will be announced soon but the magazine, as it was, has come to an end.

Anyone reading this who sent a copy to their friends, uploaded it to a sharing site or downloaded it from one - you can look at yourself and see one the people to blame for this. We had some great stuff to come in future issues which will now never see the light of day, but the piracy within the magic "community" is destroying it. No one in the industry is bothered about fighting piracy other than creators and authors.
For a project that was a lot of work but due to the low price yielded little profit, it's no longer worth Dan and I carrying on just to have people spread free copies to their friends and across the web. If you are reading this and you did any of those things, please don't bemoan the magazine's demise - you caused it.
The Curator
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Beware Vampire, I have
3800 Posts

Profile of The Curator
Another solution is to produce an exceptional quality publication on paper. I've done that with Compendium Sortilegionis and Fabula Hermetika.
Copying such a book is simply stupid. It doesn't have to be cheap.

One page from Fabula Hermetika.

Lord Freddie
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Inner circle
1093 Posts

Profile of Lord Freddie
It doesn't matter, people will still scan these books in an upload if they can put they time in (and they do this a lot). Yes, it makes it harder than an ebook but it doesn't prevent it. It just astonishes me how many parasites there are within this community.
Eddie Garland
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Inner circle
Hells Kitchen, New York City
4204 Posts

Profile of Eddie Garland
I have found several of my videos re-uploaded to Youtube and monetized.
Not long ago I discovered an entire website of content hand drawn by me but credited to someone else entirely.
It is frustrating.
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639 Posts

Profile of horus1
Dark days indeed.
As most magicians are probably also
Creatives of one sort or another, this a particularly
sad and ironic turn of events.

We have seen a universal devaluing of art and creativity
fueled by the notion that the internet and content within
should be free and accessible to all.

NAPSTER was the first horseman of the creative apocalypse
and it fueled a sense of entitlement among the plebeians.

I'm very saddened to read of the disrespect shown Dan and Freddie.
I'm particularly dismayed by Dan's post regarding the kickstarter faerie videos.

Dan has been so generous with his blog and the sharing of ideas.
Joshua J
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665 Posts

Profile of Joshua J
Well very sorry to hear, but not surprised. I know both of you had talked about this being on the cards. The material in each issue has been great. Quality routines at a bargain price. The presentation is superb and I've loved seeing my own routines in issues. I suppose I'll have to follow the trend of sticking my material in shoddy overpriced ebooks instead. Our community is a close knit one, making much of the pirating pointless, people uploading and downloading who will never end up reading the material. Much like people who talk about how much music they have on their hard drive, but couldn't tell you who half the bands all.

As for the fairy project I'm dissapointed that someone would do this jeopardizing future projects. I still look forward to receiving my hard copy of the kit.
Lo Pan
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Haven't slept in weeks - but I now have
726 Posts

Profile of Lo Pan
This is sad news indeed - an amazing resource, a pleasure to read at a bargain price and its gone like so many before it. Dan and Lord Freddie, I am so grateful for all your hard work and love of the craft of Bizarre Magic - I wish you both all the success and happiness that you work so hard to attain. I had looked forward to many rainy afternoons pouring over your publications and I am hopeful that you will find a way to release your material in a form that is profitable and true to your craft. I am saddened but I also look forward to following you both and doing my small part (by continuing to purchase your wonderful creations)to help support you on your new path.
Tony Iacoviello
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Eternal Order
13144 Posts

Profile of Tony Iacoviello
This is the very reason Oracle stopped.
It is very sad, especially since it is being shared by those we trust.
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889 Posts

Profile of Perkins
Sit nihil sancti

Sorry to hear it, fellas.
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Inner circle
1457 Posts

Profile of Darkness
It really is a shame. Yes, anything can be copied, DVD's included. Paper absolutely.

I heard you can imbed your name in a watermark that only shows when you print it or simply apply it small in a corner? Then we would know the source.

They do it with film sides and scripts.

There are ways to automatically stamp/watermark every pdf with the user's name and order information upon download.

Sample site I'm sure there are better tools:

Basic info Adobe TV is great:
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Zombies beware! I have your heads on
587 Posts

Profile of TH1
This is really a shame. At such an extremely reasonable price, it would seem the pirates were doing it merely for sport or to be malicious, rather than to really save anyone any money. A pox upon those pirates, their personal creations, and derivative rip-offs of other people's work!
Beware of evil spirits...and depleted batteries! Smile
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Special user
882 Posts

Profile of steven-gibson
I bought every issue. If everyone that owned a set of MM could say that, we would have more issues to look forward to. It's a shame and it kind of ****es me off.
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Regular user
The 18
135 Posts

Profile of MagisterFreud
Makes you want to go back to the secret society model...
Lord Freddie
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Inner circle
1093 Posts

Profile of Lord Freddie
One of the problems is there are people in magic who collect information regardless as to whether they'd actually use it and it's these people that are sharing it but it obviously originated from someone in the bizarre community who bought it from us. It's hurtful.
For a while we tracked down those who were freely distributing our work and getting them to stop but it keeps happening and Dan and I are both too busy to be playing Internet piracy police all the time. If anyone reading this has received a copy from one of their mates or bought one and sent it on then they can thank themselves for this happening.

On a lighte note, Dan and I are working on a new form of the Mystic Menagerie which will be announce soon which I'm sure you will all enjoy and will be FREE!
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Inner circle
One day I will die leaving behind
2424 Posts

Profile of Silvertongue
On Oct 1, 2014, MagisterFreud wrote:
Makes you want to go back to the secret society model...

If only...
For as long as space exists,
And living beings remain in cyclic existence,
For that long, may I too remain,
to dispel the sufferings of the world.

Engaging in the Conduct of a Bodhisattva
Wizard of Oz
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Inner circle
Most people wish I didn't have
5223 Posts

Profile of Wizard of Oz
The short-sighted idiocy of these small-minded thieves would be laughable if it weren't so tragic for so many. One person may save a pittance, but the greater loss can be priceless.
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
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649 Posts

Profile of Winks
I also bought every issue. P***es me off too.
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534 Posts

Profile of viktorbc
I agree with a printed format might be best. Even though some might scan them, you would see a lot less of that than sharing a digital copy.

The Magic Community at is best is perfecting illusion. Some times secrets need to be shared, but the intellectual property of creators should be protected. It is one thing to share with a protege or assistant, it another thing just to pass around that property to everyone with the creator's consent.

Bizarrist, Hypnotist and Paranormalist

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