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mindmagic Inner circle London 1740 Posts |
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On Oct 20, 2014, IAIN wrote: Yes, I'd agree with that. Her presentation was fine. |
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Stefmagic Special user 529 Posts |
Let face the fact; she's a better performer than 95% of the member of the Magic Café!
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
As for her looks, all I can say is she's no Mark Salem.
But seriously, what's missing from this show is how she feels about all this. They're so busy catching the audience reaction, we don't know how she feels about having these cool powers. And what kind of delight does she take in displaying them? That's what people are picking up from Derren when they say he is a "showman." He has a definite attitude towards his minor miracles.
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, Stefmagic wrote: I hope you include yourself in that statistic..
I've asked to be banned
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, landmark wrote: I honestly think it comes down to believability. That for me is the "x-factor" of mentalism performance, especially on TV or in close up environments. When Blaine introduced the concept of TV street magic, a massive part of the appeal was his utter strangeness: if anybody could levitate on the street, that weirdo could. Same with Derren: he exuded a kind of intriguing authority that made you believe he really could influence your behaviour if he wished. In my opinion, this performer is missing the believability factor. It is nothing to do with her gender either (for me, Colin McLeod doesn't really have it-in his original incarnation at least). I would be delighted to be made to look an idiot though and for Mind Games to take off and grip the nation the way Derren did. He needs some competition |
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DynaMix Inner circle 1148 Posts |
I think the *intriguing authority* comment hits the NAIL on the head.
Some people just SEEM like they are being themselves and NOTHING more. Its hard to describe but you KNOW IT when you see it. |
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
Anyone who was lucky enough to see Derren Brown perform close up in his pre-TV days just knew he had IT. You can't buy it and you can't sell it -you've just got to have it.
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rowland Inner circle 1524 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, Stefmagic wrote: That got to be one of the most ridiculous comments I have ever seen on here. |
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Myke Phillips Inner circle Myke Phillips 1213 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, Stefmagic wrote: Iv'e never seen most of the members of the magic Café perform so I couldn't say this is fact. Katherine is missing something in her performances for sure but I can't put my finger on it. She will get better, that's going to happen as she gains more confidence in her character. I really want her to do really well but I think that this is proof that anyone can do it, regardless of talent, but you have to want it and then go get it. Myke X |
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
A wise man once said, "Talent is not enough: you have to have a talent for having talent."
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DynaMix Inner circle 1148 Posts |
I think what makes Derren so incredible is his ability to master all venues (at leas to the naked eye, I've never seen him close up)...
How would David Blaine do on Stage? Or Katherine Mills? Derren seems comfortable strolling, at the card table, on the street, on stage, whatever... with that said, I do hope well for all performers on TV, I'm sure its a nightmare performing under those conditions... |
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kasper Loyal user 253 Posts |
I predict that if you show this thread to a lay audience they would probably think that mentalists are a sorry and pathetic lot.
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DynaMix Inner circle 1148 Posts |
Probably true, but they'd also admit they like DB over KM, they just might not be able to articulate why...
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, kasper wrote: Why's that? |
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kasper Loyal user 253 Posts |
I don't say that comment to be rude. It just reminds me of a time I went to visit with mentalists and magicians at the local club meeting. It was held in the basement at a restaurant and bar.
When the club stormed into the bar the people laughed at the club members and they felt sorry for them being so cheesy and obnoxious. I know some won't like this post because some folks will defend mentalism so much that they treat it like they are a member of a cult. This lady has HER show and you have YOUR. So just enjoy it. |
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Galileo Elite user Somerville MA 431 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, kasper wrote: It may have not meant to be rude, but it certainly came off that way. Yes she has her show but people are allowed to express their opinions and explain why they don't like it. The same way people don't like certain types of music but still express why it doesn't appeal to you, so I think you calling your fellow magicians/mentalists "Sad and Pathetic" is pretty un-called for. |
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
It would appear, in the world of some Café members, to critique the content and presentation of a (relatively) big-budget television production is "sorry and pathetic", but calling magicians and mentalists "cheesy and obnoxious" places you among the angels.
It takes all sorts, I suppose. |
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10795 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, Martin Pulman wrote: Actually talent is of little consequence if you can't/don't get booked.
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CThomas Loyal user 272 Posts |
This is a topic where an ignoramus lay person can make a real contribution; hence, I'll chime in. I suspect that a deep knowledge of methods can affect one's degree of appreciation of mentalism performances. First of all, you guys are going to be less impressed by a very common performance that you've seen 1,000 times than a lay person, to whom it may be fresh. Also, I suspect that your appreciation of a particular performance can be affected by your knowledge that the underlying effect is either extremely innovative or technically difficult, or on the other hand very easy and basic. I've already seen this in my own small way from exposure to a family member who is obsessively interested in mentalist techniques -- it's a little hard for me to separate my appreciation for technique or innovation in those few areas I happen to know about from a raw aesthetic reaction to the performance. All this is by way of claiming some degree of paradoxical authority for expressing a view from the perspective of a lay person who can appreciate these performances with perhaps less jaundiced eyes.
I think that the problem with Mills is a combination of the main two criticisms discussed in this thread. The effects are not well designed to foster the lay audience's ability to suspend disbelief, and the persona and character of Mills are not authoritative enough to sustain the illusion of plausibility. The problem is that when you combine these two deficits together, it's really problematic for the viewer to try to enjoy the program. That said, I'll now alienate everyone by expressing some puzzlement about the high regard that Derren Brown seems universally to enjoy around here. I wonder again if Brown's popularity here may be magnified by the fact that you can see that he's really talented in some ways that might not be obvious to the lay audience. My exposure to Brown is limited -- I've watched a few programs of his but haven't seen his full library (let alone been exposed to his pre-fame acts). Don't get me wrong -- Brown is obviously far above Mills in the quality of his performances. But he just comes across to me as a lay person as fairly mediocre. He comes across as a little too slick for my tastes. The limited performances I've seen or listened to by several on this board (Cassidy, of course, but a number of others) are far more impressive and entertaining to me than Brown (and certainly Mills). I would pay more to watch Slim King than to watch Brown and Mills together on a double bill. Obviously the marketplace values Brown more highly than I do so I'm probably an anomaly I guess. |
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
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On Oct 21, 2014, saysold1 wrote: Sorry SaySold, I don't follow you? |
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