I enjoy reading tarot cards. When someone asks me to read the cards for them the first thing I tell them is that its for entertainment purposes

only. Then they look at me disappointed and ask why its only for entertainment. Ive been asked that whenever I want to read the cards "for real"

that I can contact them. This happens ALL the time. I find that a lot of people get upset when you mention that mentalism and readings is just for

entertainment. At least it is for me.

Ive heard time and time again from people that say "Why would anyone get into this field if it was just for entertainment?"


Does anyone else here go through that with people you come in contact with?

Why don't you do it for real?

I suppose I like to keep the subject matter light when doing readings. Its nice to talk and discuss things with people over a cup of coffee or a drink and read the cards. Some people enjoy that I can do readings and it adds to the conversation as both parties interpret the symbolism in the cards together.

But a lot of times the questions get way too heavy for a reading. Then I put the cards aside and just talk and discuss what is bothering them.

I don't feel right using the cards for heavy type subjects.

For example a lady was going to court the next day and wanted a reading about how it was going to go. Now that to me is not something to discuss

with cards. Just like to keep things light.

Never give legal or medical advice...... You aren't paid enough !

Its also like when you do a personality profile when someone picks a card from a regular card deck. Then they start asking you questions about how many kids they are going have,or what kind of car they are going to drive 1o years from now.

Ive heard from many mentalists on here that they claim what they do is not real. Just wondering how they deal with folks that don't like the fact

that mentalism is just for entertainment. I run into a lot of people that don't understand why someone would be a mentalist just

for entertainment. Maybe for a movie or play. But they don't understand why someone would live their life as a mentalist or be on stage and

just pretend.

I am always upfront that I cannot tell their future, or contact their dead. This is not a science, but an intuitive art. But that is as far as I go. I never say it is for entertainment purposes. I just tell them that I cannot help with the deep questions. That seems to satisfy everyone.

Of course as human beings we can help with the deeper questions, but it is not what we are there for.

If you are not charging money for card reading then have fun with it. You don't have to say it is for entertainment - you can simply say you are unsure of the mysteries of the universe.

If you are charging people money then I see the conundrum. If you don't believe it yourself you don't want to feel like a swindler.

"Since I am not a licensed counselor, I only do light readings. We can do a reading on what influences you can expect in the week ahead, or how you can prepare yourself for your court date, or what things it would benefit you to be mindful of when you go to visit your family. But I do not want to get into the territory that is best reserved for a psychoanalyst or a lawyer. They have malpractice insurance and I don't."

"I do read tarot legitimately according to the meanings and correspondences in the cards. So I am doing it for real. However, I do not charge enough to make it worth carrying all the baggage from in-depth readings about deep-seated personal issues. For that reason, I limit the subjects in the readings to the sort of things you would normally be willing to ask a group of friends."

"Different people read tarot differently. In my case, I approach the cards from the view that each card is a reflection of an archetype or an archetypal situation. From that perspective, I am not telling the future, but offering a different framework from which to view your life. The value of this is to gain a completely different perspective on your situation and perhaps get some new insights into your life."

You don't ever have to say you only read for entertainment. You can explain what you mean without ever using the "e-word."

-Patrick

Part of the problem with Tarot cards, is that real magic works best when the wizard creates his own cards, or better still, invents a completely new divination system.

The personal energy that goes into creating the cards/system means that the system will work, if created properly.

And what that means, is to create a system which makes sense to you, which you feel will give you the tools to undersand people in a certain way.

Using printed Tarot cards dilutes the magic enormously - a bit like the difference between eating a real orange, and drinking juice.

Although a faint trace of the original magic still attaches to the cards, it's the original hand-made prints which carry the real power.

If you don't believe me, just try making your own set of tarot cards, and see what a difference it makes to your readings.

No matter how crudely made, a set of your own personal Tarot cards will be far more efficacious than a bought deck.

And you will then be able to tell folks that your readings have a high degree of accuracy, because that will happen......if you know your stuff.

You might like to remind people that the tarot is nothing but a game...it was only from the mid/late 18th century that they started being used as a divinatory device...they switched because that's how the world was around that time...

When you are reading the tarot, you are reading tiny works of art, no more, no less...nothing magic in them..thats in your own words...

Tarot works but not in the way most people think...

If people are disappointed in your disclaimer, then so be it..you are doing the right thing...

Part of my talk before I use them, is the simple idea that if we could tell the future with them, then why don't we use them for every decision? Do they want to live a life devoid of free thinking and choices?

The answer is usually no, no they don't...because it absolves them of making hard decisions..thats not what life is about...

I would love to see "real" tarot readers using little home-made cards. It would add to the intrinsic comedy of the whole situation.

Paul Draper had a real nice live Event at Penguin Magic about this. Although most of his talk was about cold reading, he explained his ethics about it.

My opinion: I wouldn't call it entertainment (although it is) because people assosiate entertainment with not real. However, acrobats are doing real dangerous things for entertainment, jugglers are doing real difficult things and there are plenty of other examples where entertainment is also serious and very real.

When I do readings (I do palmreading) I distance myself from it, tell what the lines say based on what I've learned from my masters. So sometimes I say "This line here says you've had a strong pull towards *fill in gap*, but personally I'm not sure, it's just what I've learned." This has 3 advantages:
1. Either I'm right or the reading is right (which gives me credit)
2. I tell them to not take it too seriously as nothing is certain in live

And when I do get more difficult questions I just give them supportive advice through the reading: "Although your palm doesn't show a real answer to your question it does show you have strength and a discipline when it comes to these areas and that with the right mentallity you will come out better from this"

my 2 cents

Phren,

If you don't mind me asking, what qualifications do you have to be giving complete strangers advice of any sort?

Although I don't believe anyone needs qualifications to give others positive support and a good peptalk, I'm a qualified social psychologist. This doesn't make me a therapist, but again, I believe being positive to strangers doesn't do harm.

I'm sure people will disagree, but I'll leave that to a different thread/topic

Personally think it would be weird to start with "this is for entertainment purposes only", because it creates a weird dynamic. In an informal setting I would use language like "I'm not a pro so I'll do this reading but it's just for fun OK, you're not to sell your house or quit your job on the back of this, promise?"

Phren's advice seems pretty good - using the tool of the reading to *empower* the readee to resolve their own problems. I guess it might not be as immediately satisfying as just being told what to do but it seems like it would be more uplifting and positive in the long run.

Phill

As much as any other human? What gives anyone the right to give advice .. and who can question it ..Everyone. I've know people with "degrees" that can't solve their own problems let alone someone else's.

But on another side .. Does anyone use Docc's Ritual? I missed the whole thing....

Human beings are deeply biased and flawed creatures...there no 100% in life in philosophical contexts at least...

People cant always control their own life, let alone be fit to offer advice to others...

But at the same time, both sides of the fence should not sneer at their neighbour...


This thread will implode by page three, easily...

I dunno why we even debate it, you wont change a belief online...

By the way, my post should not be taken as advice...

While I'm here, I have read for psychologists, therapists and even a few scientists...very interesting experiences...

I have even played games with them, where if they felt I was being vague, asking questions or using broad statements - they raised their finger and we'd stop and clarify...

Then I would ask for a percentile rating, and we'd discuss the reading itself...

Readings aren't for everyone, certainly shouldn't be done by anyone, and I am certainly in the anti-advice camp...and with nearly three years of counselling training and a few other things...

Readings need to be less mystical and more realistical (made up term #42441)

"As much as any other human"

Except that "any other human" is not invoking a magical power to support their advice, nor do they normally offer life advice to complete strangers, nor do they normally charge for it-unless they have a recognised qualification.

Name someone's childhood friend, their pet, their pin code, the card they will choose, the envelope they will pick, the hand they are holding the coin in: you are performing mentalism. Start offering advice, start claiming you have real powers which have been maximised by using home-made cards, then you are doing something else. And I fail to see what that something else has to do with a forum dedicated to magic and creating the illusion of psychic power (an academic discussion of the origins of effects and how they can be featured in a mentalism context is something else entirely and is always fascinating).

There are plenty of forums for people to discuss how to make money from strangers by invoking "magick" powers. I continue to be bemused as to why those who feel they have real powers have need of p***s, b***** s*******, c*** r****** etc. why don't you just do it for real?