On Nov 15, 2014, R.S. wrote:

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On Nov 15, 2014, JoeJoe wrote:

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On Nov 15, 2014, R.S. wrote:
I don't know... maybe she didn't have much of a choice to begin with. Maybe she grew up without privilege and had to scrape for everything she got. Maybe she works full time as a babysitter because she'd rather do that than sit at home and collect welfare. Maybe she contributes to society in other ways. Maybe the rest of us neglecting people in that situation ultimately leads to us footing more of the bill when they end up in the hospital because they couldn't afford insurance and therefore had inadequate healthcare. Meanwhile, the Paris Hiltons of the world inherit their wealth and live a life of excess. Maybe if the top 1% contributed a little more then society as a whole would reap the benefits. Maybe. Something to think about anyway.

She has options. America is full of options. The world is full of options. I was homeless for six years and now I own my own house paid for in-full, you can't tell me there are no options.

And by the way ... Paris Hilton's grandfather is donating 97% of his wealth (over $2 billion dollars) to charities for the homeless, so to say she "inherited her wealth" would be inaccurate. She earned her money, and is supported by the fact she is worth $100 million verse her sister's mere $20 million.

-JoeJoe

I'm glad your situation turned out well for you... good on you for that! America may be full of options, but does everybody have equal opportunity when it comes to pursuing those options? Does a poor child born to no-name parents on a farm in Mississippi have the same opportunities as he/she goes through life as a child born to wealthy and well-connected CEOs/Doctors/Lawyers in Massachusetts? And don't forget the "luck" factor. Ambition, skill, and desire can only get you so far. Even the highly successful had some lucky breaks along the way. Furthermore, not all low income workers are lazy bottom-feeders, while not all the wealthy are models of integrity, industriousness, and virtue. I'm just recognizing that simple fact.

I don't begrudge Paris her millions. What she "inherited" was much more opportunity than the average person. MUCH more. And in the end, that may count for more than anything.

It's great that the elder Hilton plans on donating to charity. But he is said to be embarrassed by the behavior of his socialite granddaughter and believes it has sullied the family name.


Ron

Joe, you know what? I'm happy that you made your way up from homelessness. Really. That's an accomplishment. You understood the system that is in place and you worked it to your advantage. Congratulations. But you know what? Just because you worked the system to your advantage, it doesn't mean that it's fair, rational, equitable, or the measure of goodness, smartness, or yes, usefulness. It just is what it is. And it most certainly is not a law of nature. Laws of nature are relations that have existed since day one and have never been changed. That's just not true about "market" systems.

On Nov 16, 2014, JoeJoe wrote:
Nature. It's her law, not mine.

-JoeJoe

On Nov 17, 2014, slowkneenuh wrote:
Of course anyone can do better by working diligently, but "better" is a relative term."

"In the United States, wealth is highly concentrated in a relatively few hands. As of 2010, the top 1% of households (the upper class) owned 35.4% of all privately held wealth, and the next 19% (the managerial, professional, and small business stratum) had 53.5%, which means that just 20% of the people owned a remarkable 89%, leaving only 11% of the wealth for the bottom 80% (wage and salary workers). In terms of financial wealth (total net worth minus the value of one's home), the top 1% of households had an even greater share: 42.1%." The gap has even increased more over the past few years.

Realistically most people can only move within the bottom 80% and that's still not an easy life.

Does everybody have equal opportunity?

On Nov 18, 2014, landmark wrote:

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Does everybody have equal opportunity?

No. Plain and simple.

On Nov 18, 2014, landmark wrote:

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Does everybody have equal opportunity?

No. Plain and simple.

On Nov 18, 2014, acesover wrote:
Now tell us where the bottom 80% begins and ends and your numbers might mean something. Get this through your head. There will always be super wealthy people. There will always we extremely poor people. Is that fair? The answer is yes.

On Nov 18, 2014, JoeJoe wrote:

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On Nov 18, 2014, acesover wrote:
Now tell us where the bottom 80% begins and ends and your numbers might mean something. Get this through your head. There will always be super wealthy people. There will always we extremely poor people. Is that fair? The answer is yes.

It is strange when someone tells you 80% of the people are poorer than the other 20% as if they expect you to be able to do something about that (duh).

For those that don't understand the economy ... the differences in wages is the result of inflation; the higher the inflation the greater the difference will be. It is simple basic math. If you have $1 and $10 ... and then let inflation sink in, you end up with $1.50 and $15 dollar. The higher inflation, the greater the difference.

The problem is not that poor people don't make enough, or that rich people make too much ... the problem is inflation distorting the numbers.

On Nov 18, 2014, slowkneenuh wrote:
it's not quite as simple as you portray it

On Nov 18, 2014, JoeJoe wrote:

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On Nov 18, 2014, slowkneenuh wrote:
it's not quite as simple as you portray it

Are you referring to my math? If you have $1 and $10 ... and then let inflation drive the cost of a dollar up 50 cents, you end up with $1.50 and $15 dollar. The higher inflation, the greater the difference.

That is it in a nutshell. If the value of a dollar goes up through inflation (you have $1, and it is now worth $1.50) and someone has 10 of them, that person now has the purchasing power of $15 whereas you only have the purchasing power of $1.50. Thus, the higher inflation goes the more wealth people with wealth gain.

Which is why despite all the great intentions, the rich keep getting richer and the poor keep getting poorer.

You act as if I am making some cold decision ... no, my emotions and feelings are completely irrelevant to the numbers on the ground. None of your feelings matter either. If we keep borrowing money that doesn't exist to pay for things we don't really need, the economy is going to collapse. All the fuzzy bunnies in the world won't stop that.

Don't you get it? By increasing minimum wage, you increase inflation, thus rich people's money will be worth more. You will gain 50 cents, they will gain $5 dollars. Six years later, you do it all over again expecting different results. Don't you realize all of your historical references you cite about how evil rich people are only confirm exactly what I'm telling you? Wise up and break the cycle already. Rich people are sticking it to you in the back and you are doing all the heavy lifting for them.

-JoeJoe