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troy16 New user 59 Posts |
Does anyone find that the use of billets now appear to cause some members of the public to question mindreading (and the performer) since the arrival of Derren. As an example, around 5 weeks ago I did a charity dinner event (walk around type scenario) and included some billet work in a very small set. On two separate occasions when asking the spec to write down simple playing cards, words, numbers etc I was asked in very similar ways - why do we need to write anything down as DB never asks people to write things down on TV?
As a follow up, last week I did a wedding reception and was asked almost the same type of questions. This time I was doing an ACAAN. I was doing a version similar to that of Boris Wild but at the end of the routine was asked if I could do it like DB without ever touching the cards or the case - as had been shown on a Channel 4 TV show for cancer a few weeks ago. It appears, in the UK anyhow, that the specs now expect mindreading to be almost done naked. The intro of props, even for legitimate reasons seem to cause most to question the reality of what you are showing them. Maybe in a stage situation props may be accepted more easily but in small groups I find it only causes scepticism. Your thoughts would be appreciated. |
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Vincent V. Loyal user 204 Posts |
Never been questioned about my props; not even when I initiated as magician.
It is a matter of attitude, framing, scripting and a lot more. |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
May I ask how long you've have been performing mentalism?
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
And sometimes you just get awkward or inquisitive people...or argumentative ones...
"ah yes, tv and stage performers are brilliant arent they...let me show you something that I do.." Or pull their ear very hard and walk off...taking their drink with you... "I'm different from derren, and I'd love to entertain you..this is what I do.."
I've asked to be banned
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
I have heard from very well respected performers in the UK, that they have had calls from people wanting to book them for private events, telling them "can you do stuff like that Troy or Dynamo?" and that's despite them having very clear promo vids where it is nothing like either of those two...
I've asked to be banned
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troy16 New user 59 Posts |
HI Bob,
I have been doing magic as a hobbyist from around 15 years but mentalism as a part time income for around 2 years. In the 90's I did some stage hypnosis. Troy |
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troy16 New user 59 Posts |
Yes, must say Iain that the people who have booked me have been fine, as have the people I have performed for, it's just I am quite amazed at how so many people seem to use DB as a sort of plumbline to gauge mindreading effects and what should / should not happen during them. No one has ever been rude (and they have all written on the billets etc) but the questions have been asked.
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Personally, in every billet routine I do I provide a very clear and logical reason why I want something to be written down. I've never been questioned on it.
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troy16 New user 59 Posts |
Thanks Bob,
As an honest question I don't know the answer too - Is DB popular in the US? |
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phillsmiff Inner circle UK 1794 Posts |
"Well they couldn't afford him, and when I'm as good as Derren then you guys won't be able to afford me either, until then, write the d*mn name."
The new Elysian Duets, marked cards featuring my unique Optical Marking System:
-+: https://phillsmithcreative.com/products/elysian-duets :+- |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 21, 2014, troy16 wrote: No. He had a very brief TV series here on the SyFy channel, but it didn't last long. The average person here has no idea who he is. |
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
I think its natural to an extent, their only experience of mind reading is probably derren, in the UK at least...so they join up the dots...
Its why I'm very keen on personas being unique...cos it shifts the context of everything else along with it... I had a small gig recently, just two half hour segments at a house party, I just did doodle readings, drawing replications and psuedo psychometry for groups of 3-5 people at a time, at a table..i drive everything via the imagination, and all actions/motives support that idea...
I've asked to be banned
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Cervier Inner circle France 1274 Posts |
Fubn story Well, not for you, obviously, but I like it in the way it shows how mentalism can be popular. No one in France has achieved what Derren Brown did in the UK with his TV shows. There have been some short-lived attempts, but here, when you say "mentalist", people picture Patrick Jane and expect you to solve crimes
So, of course, maybe the questions you get come from gaps in your presentation and I would proudly reply *I* never (never, I promise ) get such questions). But I believe it's just a matter of making you stuff look slightly different, or to say something like what IAIN suggested in his first post. Direct advice is very valuable! If you're on your own, then a forum is a makeshift solution, but having someone knowledgeable who can watch your performance and give his or her opinion is very valuable! I have a friend who's a magician -not a mentalist, but that doesn't matter: he knows about performing, entertaining, about using secret methods, etc. We tak together about problems we encounter, and I hope I help him as much as he helps me. I think if I didn't know him, I would let in the know another friend of mind, who doesn't know anything about magic nor mentalism, but knows about stage work and entertaining people.
"A friend is someone who know you well but loves you anyway" H. Lauwick
The Lynx Deck, http://jmmaries.free.fr/cervier/ Grapheeteez, on GooglePlay Telemos the peek envelope, on SkywardMagic Telemos en Francais sur TheMysteryStore |
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Martin Pulman Inner circle London 3399 Posts |
Of course, Mr Brown asks people to write stuff down in his stage show and no one thinks any less of him. It is all a question of routining.
Inevitably though, a proportion of any audience is going to be suspicious if you baldly ask them to think of something then write it down. Audiences aren't stupid. You have to outwit them! |
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troy16 New user 59 Posts |
Thanks Guys
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NeilMcCauley Regular user 102 Posts |
The more importance you give something, the more important people perceive it to be.
"Why must I write it down?" *Said quickly and with barely a pause* "We may need some proof later of what you're thinking." Of course, you also may not ever mention the paper again! Or, "So we have evidence of what you have in mind, and so that later people don't think you're just saying yes to help me out...I want you to jot the name down. It'll also help lock it in your mind." Watch any of Derren's live shows, especially The Gathering (on YouTube) if you want to see how a pro quickly justifies the writing down process and sells it as a positive, rather than a negative. He has two main approaches. In one he asks them to write something down then, while they do it in the background, distracts the rest of audience with something else--so they barely remember much later on that anything was written at all. In the other, he puts emphasis on the writing down process and stresses just how fair it (seemingly) is. You can see this in The Gathering. He says "And please, so everyone knows, you cannot see through that bit of paper, correct?" and so on. He does this so much and so well that, I think, the audience actually feels very relaxed about the writing down stuff after it's happened. Almost like, "Ah good, that was fair! Now we have evidence of her thought!" |
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David Numen Inner circle 2072 Posts |
It's all about your own attitude. If you are concerned about justifying billets then there will always be those in your audience who will pick up on such things.
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Mifune Loyal user Spain 266 Posts |
In an effect with ESP symbols I talk about test conditions and the Alpha Project, so to avoid the spectator helping me (as NeilMcCauley said) they must write his thought in a card to later provide a proof. I say that the spectator could be so nice that didn't correct me if I'm wrong. I don't use the Bob Cassidy aproach (that they can change their mind and make me look stupid) because I think that with my personality it can be seen as a challenge.
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Mister E. Regular user Germany 189 Posts |
Hector Chadwick, co-writer for Mr. Brown, has a tiny but effective chapter on why things are written down in mentalism in his book "The Mental Mysteries of...". Of course this is only one of the many fantastic things in the book.
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Demitri Loyal user 296 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 21, 2014, phillsmiff wrote: Just had to say - this is hilarious. |
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