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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » What do you consider mentalism? (11 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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ummer21
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So I have been performing magic for over two years now. Christmas parties, school for my middle school age students, friends, family etc.basically anyone who is willing to give up the minutes of their lives to watch me perform. I have a few tricks that I consider "reading their minds" tricks like "A Word In A Million" And some card tricks. Would you consider these tricks pure mentalism out just entry level magic?
E.E.
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Mentalists don't do "card tricks"
I shall see you on the other side.
mastermindreader
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There is already a lengthy thread on this (and many old ones as well) that is ongoing:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......forum=15

Short answer- a single mental effect presented amidst a program of card tricks or magic tricks is not mentalism.
JayFredericks
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If what you are presenting displays some kind of uncanny mental ability, you're ONLY doing effects that display some kind of uncanny mental ability (whether or not cards are involved), and you are presenting yourself as someone who has some sort of uncanny mental ability, then it's mentalism.
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Dec 3, 2014, ummer21 wrote: I have a few tricks that I consider "reading their minds" tricks like "A Word In A Million" And some card tricks. Would you consider these tricks pure mentalism out just entry level magic?


Surely not mentalism. Mentalists don't do tricks. Mentalism is much, much more than just mental-based "tricks." If anything what you are referring to is simply mental-magic.
Sensio
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Mental magic and Mentalism are separated by a thin line.
This is the first IMHO crucial step of appreciating what Mentalism can be defined as.
The next step is to understand what the higher state of mental abilities could be on many levels from more humble memory demonstrations, quick calculations etc to more psychology attached ones like lie detection, influence, NLP etc to even more impossible like mind reading, clairvoyance etc and lastly to spooky ones like communicating with dead etc. Of course, the list is endless but I just included some basic ones.
When this step is appreciated, the performer should then define which claims he wants to carry with him by being socially responsible and comfortable with himself.
And then just stick to these claims and not getting seduced by new claims that may seem sexy or just have this cool method behind.
To be congruent in other words...
Then the journey becomes really exciting and the performer becomes a true performer of mentalism without trying to be a real mentalist which is a dead-end journey...
Pakar Ilusi
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How about someone who does an actual legit memorization of a full deck of cards?

Is that considered Mentalism?
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
Pakar Ilusi
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Or something else altogether?
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
mastermindreader
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I consider it to be mentalism because I present it as an illustration of the visualization techniques I mastered as I learned to read minds.

(Yes- I do the memorization legitimately, as well as my version that incorporates a s***k.)

All of this, along with an entire history of the effect as well as several of my variations, appears in my latest eBook, Master Card Memory.

http://marketplaceofthemind.com/products/mastcard/
Pakar Ilusi
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On Dec 4, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I consider it to be mentalism because I present it as an illustration of the visualization techniques I mastered as I learned to read minds.

(Yes- I do the memorization legitimately, as well as my version that incorporates a s***k.)

All of this, along with an entire history of the effect as well as several of my variations, appears in my latest eBook, Master Card Memory.

http://marketplaceofthemind.com/products/mastcard/


Thanks Bob... Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
Rolyan
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Quote:
On Dec 3, 2014, ummer21 wrote:
So I have been performing magic for over two years now. Christmas parties, school for my middle school age students, friends, family etc.basically anyone who is willing to give up the minutes of their lives to watch me perform. I have a few tricks that I consider "reading their minds" tricks like "A Word In A Million" And some card tricks. Would you consider these tricks pure mentalism out just entry level magic?

Without knowing what these card tricks are it's an impossible question to answer.

Even though some are trying to.
mastermindreader
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Roylan- That's because "some of us" include those who don't feel that a mental effect sandwiched in between "some card tricks" constitutes mentalism in any case. It's clear from the OP that he primarily performs magic. ("For over two years now.")
Sensio
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On Dec 4, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I consider it to be mentalism because I present it as an illustration of the visualization techniques I mastered as I learned to read minds.

(Yes- I do the memorization legitimately, as well as my version that incorporates a s***k.)

All of this, along with an entire history of the effect as well as several of my variations, appears in my latest eBook, Master Card Memory.

http://marketplaceofthemind.com/products/mastcard/


100% agree.
Rolyan
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On Dec 4, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Roylan- That's because "some of us" include those who don't feel that a mental effect sandwiched in between "some card tricks" constitutes mentalism in any case. It's clear from the OP that he primarily performs magic. ("For over two years now.")

But what are those 'card tricks'? I've seen (and I'm pretty certain you have) many mentalists over the years perform a series of effects that concentrate on cards. It worked for them. Although I suspect that the poster is doing magic tricks it could be how he's phrasing it.

So I would prefer to ask him what those 'card tricks' are, then we can offer an informed opinion rather than the usual 'mentalists don't do card tricks' that is trotted out time after time. Finding out what he's actually performing, rather than giving him all the usual platitudes, might answer the question he asked.

It's a clever man that can answer the question "would you consider these tricks pure mentalism" without knowing what those tricks are!
kasper
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The 13 steps to Mentalism has a complete chapter on card tricks. The chapter is titled "CARD TRICKS." Those are ones that mentalists can perform.
mastermindreader
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Roylan-

The OP clearly stated that he's a magician and only has a couple of tricks he thinks might be mentalism. So he himself makes it clear that he doesn't do "pure mentalism," and isn't even sure what mentalism is- hence the title of the thread.

A good rule of thumb is that if someone asks "what is mentalism?" what he's doing probably isn't.
hashtagmagic
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Bob Cassidy is mentalism.
george1953
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Not bad 23 posts in the last hour or so, soon be up to 50.
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hashtagmagic
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On Dec 4, 2014, george1953 wrote:
Not bad 23 posts in the last hour or so, soon be up to 50.


Thanks! You're being too kind, my friend. I've only done about 10. I've been lurking around with these questions for about half a year. I'm actually very far behind!
Rolyan
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Bob - as ever I respect and admire you, not least your longevity in a business that soon sorts out the men from the boys. But that doesn't mean I have to agree with you. On this, we'll have to agree to disagree.

He has given no indication whatsoever what his tricks are, so no one can answer whether or not they are mentalism, pure or otherwise. What if one of his card tricks is a full deck memorisation?

I watched a performer at the local pub a few nights ago. He performed several card tricks. Would you like to tell me if they were pure mentalism or not.
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