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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Gaffed & Funky » » Okay Invisible Deck Mavens Answer This! (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Stefan Rupar
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Same gripe applies to Brainwave.

My hump with this trick has to do with when the spec names a card which you have to reveal as one of the first two or three cards or one of the last two or three cards in the deck. This just looks hincky to me.

In fact, to me, the best reveal of the named card would be in the middle two thirds of the deck, but of course with a freely named card this is not always, in fact maybe seldom, possible.

I've thought of some solutions using several decks, but you can only whip them out after the card is named. Bummer. How do you working pros feel about having to reveal the named card very early or very late in the deck?
JBmagic
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Good question

I used the ID in a restaurant for 2 years 5 nights a week. Probably on average of 15 times a night.

I honestly don't think it matters.

I understand your concern, but I really just feel that it doesn't matter where the card is found in the deck.

I pay a lot of attention to the reaction of the crowd as I adlib a lot. I never saw anyone even flinch at the fact that the card is found near the top or bottom. People are equally blown away regardless.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I feel, through a lot of trial, that this effect is extremely strong and commercial IF performed smartly, and it isn't weakened in the slightest by the location of the reversed card in the deck.

Don't run if they aren't chasing you Smile

Smile
Jay Buchanan
Platt
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Have spec, in his mind, flip the card over in the deck. Then have him shuffle the deck in his mind. The turned over card could then reasonably be anywhere in the deck.

Another thought is to have the aces and face cards on the ends. Tell the spec to think of a card, but nothing obvious like the ace of spades or queen of hearts. Something you could never have thought of in advance. Trust me, after that they'll never name an ace or a face card. This actually serves two purposes in that if someone did name a top of mind card, they could easily say, "oh everybody must say the queen."

IMO, the invisible deck will always be the most startling effect you can do with a seemingly innocent deck of cards. To a layman there is absolutely no explanation. I generally do it two or three times for the same person. By the third time they're frightened.
Sugar Rush is here! Freakishly visual magic. http://www.plattmagic.com
Greg Arce
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I agree with both answers here. If you are very paranoid then go with the set up of having obvious choices such as ace and court cards towards the front. But I go with the 'don't run when no one is chasing you.' Other than that let me add a touch I had on this that I posted way back: Sometimes people want a repeat of this and you know it can be done easily... but don't do it too easily. Take the deck behind your back or under the table as if you are trying to figure what is the next card they will call out. Then here is my touch: As they call out the card let's say Six of Hearts say, "Okay, let's try to find it easier this time so put it right next to that Seven of Spades so we can find it." You mime looking at that spot in the deck and now when the reversed card is revealed there will be an extra sublte trick on how did he place it right next to the seven of spades.
Greg
One of my favorite quotes: "A critic is a legless man who teaches running."
dukenotes
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I agree with most of the posters here. It doesn't matter where the card is. I had someone pick Ace of Spades (the very first card) doing BW the other day. As I pulled the deck out and revealed the card really fast I think they thought I was some sort of sleight of hand expert!

Either way they were impressed; and even if they thought I could turn a card that fast, how would I know which one I was turning face up?

I say it doesn't matter.

Just my 1.25 centavos,

Duke

Smile
cardguy
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Greg,

I like that little subtly when you repeat the trick. Little things like that breath new life into effects.
Frank G. a.k.a. Cardguy
Paul
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Interesting that you repeat it Platt. I, personally, would never dream of repeating it. I would have thought you were increasing the risk of people wanting to look at that deck, since the deck is pretty static, (never shuffled or cut.)

Do you perform it on a regular basis that way? I may be wrong, (and I can be)but I'd suggest quitting while you're ahead Smile

There are some strong presentations for the Brainwave/Invisible deck, certainly for a mentalist a quick repeat would dilute the impact.

As for the reversed card being near the top or bottom, I'm not that keen on that scenario, but it doesn't matter at all to lay people watching.

Paul.
Geoff Williams
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As to where the card appears - anywhere is fine. Actually, if it shows up very near the top, that's not all that bad. There's possibly less chance of people thinking you "fiddled" the card face up into that position since there literally wasn't enough time or hand movement.

As to repeating the effect - I'd hesitate doing that. Too much heat on the deck.
"Saját légpárnás tele van angolnák."

(Hungarian for "My hovercraft is full of eels")
blurr
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another solution is to simply cut the cards if yu dont see the card near the middle. With the words "you could've named any card" you spread the deck and look for your key card, if you don't see it in the middle, simply cut the cards. Then spread and look for it. Personally, I only use this occasionally in real life. I mostly save it for when I goof up, and can't find the card. Or have someone outright lie. Which has only happened once. A lady lied to me that I didn't find her card even though I had. I knew she was lying. So I brought out the invisible deck and asked what card she "really" chose. I then showed it reversed in the deck. She then admitted to the crowd that she had lied! I then hopped on the opportunity to say, that I knew all of this before hand, and thats why the card was reversed. This just killed everybody even more. Because now they thought that not only did I find her card, But I knew she would lie and found the lied about card as well!

Blurr
"Someday men will look back and say I was the start of the 20th century."
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Kaliix
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If you handle the deck very fairly and openly, which you should because there is no reason not to, it shouldn't matter where the card is revealed. I've done the invisible deck for years and no one cares whether the card is on top, bottom or middle.

I will say though, that if it is near the top, that you actually continue on through the deck to show that there is only "One" card reversed in the deck. I do that no matter where the card is. But I can tell you that that is almost unnecessary as once the card is revealed upside down, most people are focused on that and nothing else.

Another tip I've come up with is instead of asking someone to pick a card (if you use the standard "Invisible Deck" routine), ask them to fan the invisible cards in front of them and to "name aloud, any card you see". This gets away from having to ask someone what there card is (and them saying, "You tell me" Smile ) and can set you up for a couple of invisible card jokes.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel J. Boorstin
Platt
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Great story Blurr.

As for my repeating ID, I've never felt heat on the deck. After all, they're seeing apparantly all the faces of the cards and even personally removing the one face down card. I steer them to the logic that I'm implanting a card in their head with the conversation that precedes their selection. And If there is any eyes on the deck, I'll have a clean deck ready to switch out immediately. And to the working pros, when I say generally, that means casually around the office. That's where I generally perform. In a formal paid performance setting, I'd agree, quit while you're ahead. Same goes for the floating hamburger. Smile
Sugar Rush is here! Freakishly visual magic. http://www.plattmagic.com
Jay
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Jeff McBride, at his lecture 2 weeks ago, said to use the 'heads-up, hands-up' approach to the Invisible Deck. Meaning, have the card they selected FACING you as you hold the deck up near your eyes. That way, you don't have to do the 'math', and you can spread right to its back. Also, this gets your face in the shot for when you have your own TV special Smile

Jay Smile
Paul
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Quote:
On 2002-06-18 10:05, AnOctopus wrote:
Jeff McBride, at his lecture 2 weeks ago, said to use the 'heads-up, hands-up' approach to the Invisible Deck. Meaning, have the card they selected FACING you as you hold the deck up near your eyes. That way, you don't have to do the 'math', and you can spread right to its back. Also, this gets your face in the shot for when you have your own TV special Smile

Jay Smile


???
I thought that was the way everyone used it, that was the way I was shown it 32 years ago Smile
shomemagic
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I just recently found a great routine in a Darwin Ortiz book " At The Card Table" called "Do As I Did " page 140. Now theres a great reason to show a card reversed. Check it out.
Magically,

Mike King - Sho-Me Magic

You can e-mail me at: shomemagic@gmail.com
Kaliix
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Quote:
On 2002-06-18 10:05, AnOctopus wrote:
Jeff McBride, at his lecture 2 weeks ago, said to use the 'heads-up, hands-up' approach to the Invisible Deck. Meaning, have the card they selected FACING you as you hold the deck up near your eyes. That way, you don't have to do the 'math', and you can spread right to its back. Also, this gets your face in the shot for when you have your own TV special Smile

Jay Smile


It took me a while to figure out what you meant. I wouldn't want to do it that way, it makes the trick very angly. I think it would seem like I was looking for something. I always liked that about the invisible deck, that you can look at the cards with the spectator and spread right to the "correct" card.

I guess for a controlled television shot it would be okay though.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel J. Boorstin
Dennis Loomis
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This is an old debate: the Up position as opposed to the down position. I believe that Jeff McBride is absolutely right... in whatever situations that you can get away with it. For platform and parlour shows, where you have your back to a wall, you can usually do it this way.

The point of getting your face into the picture has nothing to do with television. It has to do with the fact that you are the performer, not your props. All routines should end on you as much as possible. Charlie Miller said it. Gene Anderson says it. Jeff McBride says it, and I'm repeating it.

If you are doing strolling or restaurant close up, angles will be a much bigger factor. Often, your choice is to do it in the down position or not at all. If the trick is good enough, then do it in the down position, but somehow contrive to bring attention back up to you at the moment of climax or very shortly thereafter.

Here's a good example. A very effective final load for Chop Cup or Cups and Balls is a shot glass of liquid. When you lift the cup, the shot glass is on the table. But, I wouldn't stop there. The solution, in this case, is to pick up the shot glass, propose a quick but positive and witty toast to your audience. Then down the booze. You and your personality becomes the climax of your routine, not a prop sitting on a table.

Yes, I know... for non drinkers you don't do this... or if you're a non drinker yourself. It was just and example, guys.

To take it back to the BW or Invisible deck, get to the card in the down position if you must, but then, pull it out of the deck and hold it up for all to see. (In front of your face.) Best thing would be to have your other hand raised as well if you have a reason for it. In this case, hold the deck in one hand, the selected card in the other. Both hands raised is a universally accepted applause pose. Don't shy away from giving applause cues. Many audiences are just waiting to applaud if you just let them know when. Acknowledge applause if it comes, and then, under the applause, lower your hands and the props while maintaining good eye contact with the audience. This will subtly remind them that they are applauding for you, not for a deck of cards.
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
bdormer
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Eye level is certainly McBride's stype - I can visualize him doing that. And, on stage, you can certainly get away with it. Close-up is a different story.

I've never even thought of doing ID with the cards up at eye level. That just seems too... "ballsy". You obviously can't show the audience the "bottom" of the deck - and if you look at it, they might want to.
francis farrell
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I've really enjoyed this thread but am a bit confused aobut all this up and down discussion. The way I was shown the trick, and the way I've always done it, is to remove the deck, hold them up to the spectator to show one side of the deck. Ad I spread through I say something or other about all the cards being generally mixed up. Then I split the cards at the chosen card to reveal it. Yes, angles are a problem like this so I have to pick my moment.

I'd love to read about another way of doing the trick (we are talking about the ID not the brainwave here, aren't we).

I liked the idea about using the ID when somebody lies. I almost wish somebody would so i could do it!

Here in Manchester, England, a magician called Andrew Normanstall has a book (Zen Magic) which uses a deck as part of a prediction routine with two other decks. Great routine, though there is a definte risk factor involved.
DoctorAmazo
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Francis,

My preferred method is "down", with the deck held near waist level, and everyone looking at the same side. The "disadvantage" (if you want to call it that) is that you have to find the "mate" to the selected card. That's what the "do the math" comment was about. Actually, with practice the math becomes automatic anyway.

With the "up" method, your view let's you simply look for their card and spread it, of course. You don't even have to keep the coded pairs together if you don't want to.

If you practice both methods regularly, you can do it "standing up or laying down" Smile depending on the situation.
David Fogel
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My solution to the initial post is to put the "obvious cards" - the aces, Kings and Queens -- toward the middle. This almost always works out correctly.

Incidentally, one of my worst experiences in magic came about as a result of putting the ID deck of cards into the pack the 'wrong' way (I always have the odd cards facing up). Of course, when I pulled out the deck, the chosen card was staring the audience right in the face. And I was being video-taped for a cable program!! it wasn't pretty.

By the way, I write on the inside flap of the card case: "D-C/H-S" in light pencil. I don't want to take any chances of pulling out the wrong suit! Does anybody else do this too? Or am I the only 'cheater' in the group?

Finally, I always put the cards in a crisp, brand new paper bag (lunch bag size). I reach in and pull out the invisible deck, and throw it out to the audience to have the card selected. After going through the selection process, I invite the spectator to throw the cards back up to me, while I hold the bag by my thumb (on the outside) and first two fingers (on the inside). This makes it easy to snap your fingers through the bag. It looks and sounds like the invisible cards are dropping into the bag. The kids scream when I do this!! In kids shows, I've even had other kids ask me if they could try throwing the cards in the bag too. So I take the invisible cards out, toss them to other kids, and repeat as many times as they like. But I vary my "catch" -- sometimes pretending that the cards were thrown really high (looking up at the ceiling and waiting for them to drop), and sometimes pretending like the kid threw them directly at the bag (snapping it immediately after they threw it) If you don't use this, try it. Kids absolutely love it!
davidfogel@attbi.com



"I'm not a praying man, but if you're up there, Please save me Superman!"

Homer J. Simpson
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