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IAIN
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...just finished the first disc, I have a different view to others talking about it elsewhere...

the mention of using actresses is explicit in the routines - the best parallel I can draw is using the undertaker in derren's (in)famous presentation of a certain "thing"...it was context specific, as is the scryer ones...

the first disc covers two presentations, and then its 20-30 minutes on each, with andrew talking through each effect, what he did and WHY he did it...what I thought was good, was that he really went for it in each presentation...completely committed to the moment and delivered in a subtle yet generous way...

the cemetery presentation has given me lots of ideas...

i think (and could be wrong) that some have read some Scryer work, and because it is short and to the point, they have not filled in all the little nuances that an individual can place within...

now, I can hear some say "well, why didn't he tell us these nuances in the book?!" - I shall return that with the following - "how many times have those self same people also talked about how important it is to add your own personality to everything you perform?" - and I agree (and I realise that has all taken place in my own brain)...

but its true...i have two pages of ideas just from the cemetery presentation, and I am genuinely smiling broadly at where I can go with it...

btw - I should point out that I paid for my copy of these dvds...

for me, if I buy something, its in two definite camps, I buy something not caring about the method (and whether its appropriate or suits me) because those points can be overcome with some thought - so I buy something because the premise and presentation angle(s) interest me...or, if something covers a technique I really like, I will buy it purely to study the technique knowing I will eventually develop my own presentation(s) for it...

so basically I care either about technique or presentation, and its rare to find both in the same product...(for me, anyways)...

in this case, its definitely a mixture, I really liked how Andrew fleshed out and made the presentations HIS..rather than just copy verbatim from out of the books, I thought it was great to see a full on pro go about his business in such a laid back yet confident manner...

i get and accept that Scryer isn't for everyone, that is a good thing, because I don't see the point in trying to convert anyone - its good that those who say it isn't for them, know themselves that well...so if you have read a couple of Scryer books and thought its not for you - so be it...i'm not out convince you otherwise...

for me, I am looking forward to the second disc...this was a little present to myself (along with a nice tweed blazer, a pendulum and a poker chip and a couple of games and books) - so I shall report back after I've watched the second disc...

so far its an 8.5 out of 10...i don't think I would ever give anything 10/10 just I'm quite a mean person...

however, I am grateful that this project was undertaken, I will be contacting scryer and andrew in the new year with one idea which came from a sentence that andrew said which set off a chain reaction in my head - and if they're ok with it, I'll share it...

what else? nicely shot...as someone else said, in a vague tv style, worked for me, didn't feel cheated - I would say though, that the set is not for the beginner, even if the methods are somewhat simple, as basic knowledge is required..which is no bad thing in my book.

very enjoyable so far...
Gorgeous
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Thanks for that great review! I'm going to pick this up when I get a chance.
George Hunter
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I received my DVD's today, but have not had the chance to study them yet. In response to Iain's reflection from the first DVD, two comments come to mind:

1. The fact that most of the teaching of effects in the Scryer books are "short and to the point," with nuances omitted, is NOT one of the top ten reasons why some have not found the books to be as great as his acolytes tell us we are supposed to experience them. The cogency of the writing is one of the books' obvious assets; our reservations are rooted elsewhere.

2. The first post then confused me. It says that it was Andrew's "fleshing out" of the effects he performed (presumably that involves adding nuance to the bare method) that Iain found very valuable.

So I am wondering, "Which way is it?"

In any case, I look forward to studying the DVD's for myself.

George
IAIN
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Both.

In the original context they are great because they are short and to the point, letting you add your own twists and take on the material.

The dvd is great because you get to see how a full time pro and consultant for many other mentalists has added their own particular twists and turns.
George Hunter
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Thanks, Iain: That makes some sense.

Though I have now viewed the first of the two DVD's. I appreciated it, but would appraise it as a little south of "great."

George
IAIN
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Well, that's the beauty of opinions isn't it!
IAIN
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Watched the second disc now...

i preferred andrew's style personally - however, these are clear and straight forward explanations - the people he performs for (at a single big table) are very much into it all...especially the intuition based presentation with the cards... personally, I really liked "spinner" - thought that was a smart little warm up kind of thing...it involves the entire table, is fun, easy to do, and has a nice straight forward feeling to it...

the other main effect was very clever method wise - just a single little "thing" done, and again, though it focuses on a single person from the table, everyone can take a turn if they want to...getting people to become aware of time and space is an interesting jumping off point in my opinion...

personally, I wasn't too keen on the pen effect, but I liked the thinking around it and the additions that Richard went over...

Richard also gave a breakdown on what you can do with his a-z psychometry, brief insight into pendulum work and how to apply the a-z thinking to a card revelation - if you are used to these kinds of things, you probably won't get too much from that little bit - but even so, nice to see Richard in action, smiling, calm, affable and friendly man that he is...

so overall, is it worth the £61.99 I paid for it? yes...absolutely, I tend to feel that mentalism is too cheap these days, part of me doesn't like it that things can be bought for near enough pennies, not that I want to keep it for myself or the usual claptrap people say - but purely from the point of view that if you pay good money for you are more likely to treat it with a little more respect...you don't wish to scuff the toe of an expensive set of shoes if you can help it, and those shoes you would hope would make somewhat of an impression as an extension of you too...see what I mean? yet if we all wear the same trainers...

i'll stop with the stupid shoe analogue...

i see the stuff paul performed as the opener, and the lighter group involvement kind of stuff where everyone gets to be involved in the fun...and andrew's take on the material to be the more indepth, harder hitting, intense side...light and shade, drama and entertainment...i think both are equally important in what we do...

while I'm here - I have noted some animosity from some people towards the scryer work, ever since it was released in fact... in a way, its good that it provokes such strong emotions in people, and that others maybe even dismiss it out of hand without actually performing it - what I don't get, are those that try and change their minds on it! if you think its not for you, or presses the naughty button on your own moral front door - then fine, leave it alone and move on...however, its kinda strange that people continually pick at it, and want to tell everyone how much they aren't interested in it over and over again... why not talk about the stuff you love instead? far more constructive and possibly enlightening... I don't go to restaurants and tell other people why I don't like tuna or salmon and why they shouldn't eat it and its wicked and painful for the fish...

anyway...overall, I found this a productive and interesting dvd set...listen to what the guys have to say on the effects, listen to their own personal processes, watch the people's faces who are involved the presentations - they are genuine...they are "into it"...

i'll give you a quick example, the intuition based card effect - a woman is sat down, and either side her friends who have seen the card place a hand on her shoulder each...she deals down one card at a time and stops on one...this woman was so into it, she looked upset/bothered/disappointed in equal measure as she dealt through the entire deck and didn't get any special feeling about any card...she was sorry, she was paying attention, she cared...she got it on the second run through... I thought that was great, she cared that much...

so my score still stands 8.5/10. Maybe a couple more routines could have been added, a pendulum one maybe and another - but overall, if you are interested in this genre of mentalism, then its definitely worth your consideration if you've already read a couple of the books...
Martin Pulman
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Quote:
On Dec 25, 2014, IAIN wrote:
while I'm here - I have noted some animosity from some people towards the scryer work, ever since it was released in fact... in a way, its good that it provokes such strong emotions in people, and that others maybe even dismiss it out of hand without actually performing it - what I don't get, are those that try and change their minds on it! if you think its not for you, or presses the naughty button on your own moral front door - then fine, leave it alone and move on...however, its kinda strange that people continually pick at it, and want to tell everyone how much they aren't interested in it over and over again... why not talk about the stuff you love instead? far more constructive and possibly enlightening... I don't go to restaurants and tell other people why I don't like tuna or salmon and why they shouldn't eat it and its wicked and painful for the fish...


Yet another demand by a fan of Scryer's work that those who don't like it should limit their comments. It seems to be a recurring theme.

I think the Café was a healthier and happier place when people were free to give their opinions openly and as often as they wished. I have had PM's from people telling me they feel they have been bullied off of certain threads for expressing anything less than a glowing tribute to the (self proclaimed?) "most influential mentalism since Annemann".

If you love the work, feel free to comment. If you don't love the work, feel free to comment. Let's get some of the old original life-blood back in the place.
ParaLabs - Thomas
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Martin, I tend to agree with this part of your deliberations: "If you love the work, feel free to comment. If you don't love the work, feel free to comment."

But it is a huge difference from my point of view between providing your opinion and creating the impression of being on a crusade.

If one gives his opinion not once or twice but over and over again without adding anything new substantial and content-related, then there is no real value in a comment. Obviously this is for both directions.

If I would post here over and over again how much I appreciate Neal's work and don't offer any new aspects and information apart from the fact that I love his work, than my post would be both redundant and superfluous.

So I think each reader of this thread understood meanwhile that you for example or George don't like Neal's work that much; and it has become obvious as well, WHY this is so. So, I can't see new pieces of information in repeating this fact over and over again.

On the other hand, Iain for example apparently appreciates Neal's work. And yes, Iain mentioned his appreciation before as well. BUT reading Iain's deliberations one can clearly see that he offers new information in his posts indeed: he explains exactly and differentiated WHY he likes the particular Scryer work in question and WHAT exactly he appreciates.

After all, if one isn't able to add something new to a discussion he should rather exercise restraint from my point of view. And this isn't 'censorship' at all. This is discussion culture, politeness and unobtrusiveness.
Otherwise one's comments would be rather seen as a crusade as mentioned ... or intrusive missionary work. And both are 'communication strategies' that I personally don't appreciate at all.

Merry Christmas Smile
Th.
Martin Pulman
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People should be free to comment as and when they see fit. I don't see anyone repeatedly posting for crusading reasons - I see people responding to posts that comment on their earlier posts. Seems to be a good and healthy approach to me. Certainly much healthier than the cyber-bullying approach that others have complained of.

Let's return the Café to its origins as a place of healthy open discussion among mentalism performers and creators -not a thinly disguised marketing forum for creators and friends to push their various wares.
IAIN
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They are very rarely healthy open discussions martin, they are personal viewpoints that do not often genuinely relate to the subject in hand, and are often warped perspectives that reflect the poster's life view...so rather than them staying on topic, it becomes some kind of strange six degrees of separation...

Why not start a thread stating the reasons why you don't like it, then others can agree or disagree, you seem to want to debate certain points - lets do it...

This is a review though, in the review section, so lets stay on topic please...
IAIN
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And its easy to say I've received a pm from so-and-so, anyone can say that...if they feel bullied, they need to report it...

I would like to emphasis the 'healthy' aspect of any discussion though..
ParaLabs - Thomas
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Quote:
On Dec 26, 2014, Martin Pulman wrote:
People should be free to comment as and when they see fit.

People ARE free to comment.
But to be free to comment means as well that you are not forced to comment.
You not only have the freedom to comment ... you have also the freedom of exercising restraint if there isn't a new aspect to add to a conversation.

It seems to me that "freedom of speech" is quite often mistaken as "duty of speech".

Merry Christmas anyway. Smile
Martin Pulman
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Let's not start being silly, Iain.

My post was a direct reply to one of your posts. I included your comment as a direct quote in my reply. Are you the only person to be allowed to go "off-topic"?

If you wish to keep the comments on topic I would suggest you stick to simply reviewing the product rather than veering off to attack the behaviour of others as you did in your original post.

And if you want to run to the moderators to have my posts removed, as you have done before, at least have the decency to ask them to remove your own off-topic posts, which in this case would involve much of the contents of your posts on this thread.
IAIN
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Ooooooooooooooh!
IAIN
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What's the old saying? don't do as I do, do as I say?

You need to revisit the English language, as I haven't "attacked" anything, I'm merely expressing an opinion, something apparently you are massively in favour of, unless it doesn't support your own opinion apparently...
George Hunter
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I have now studied both DVD's of the Scryer project. I agree with Iain that, on a 1 to 10 scale, the project would be graded about 8.5, or almost that.

The first DVD presents only two effects--each with a single spectator. This DVD does a good job demonstrating how an effect can be made more emotionally meaningful for the spectator. The explanatory discussions between Andrew Gerard and a colleague are not particularly well organized, somewhat rambling discussions. As a teaching video it does not fully deliver; as a sensitizing video it is better.

The second DVD features Paul Romhany, with "extra" input from Richard Webster, and features performances and discussions around six effects. In regard to two effects, "Spinner" and "Last One Standing," it helped me perceive more potential in the effects than I had picked up from reading them alone. Unfortunately, Webster kind of blew his performance of the haunted pen; they could have videotaped a second take!

I regret that I have not made my earlier views from what I have read of the Scryer literature sufficiently clear. I have appreciated learning from what may be the leading reflective-practitioner from the "psychic" side of Mentalism. I have found several effects and insights especially helpful. I have no reason to join the bandwagon of people who see it all as unspeakably wonderful; that does NOT mean that I am against it. Iain's score of 8.5, or almost that, seems about right.

George
IAIN
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Personally, I am as far away from psychic as you can be...but I have found (from the scryer stuff I have) to be very useful to me, I've tried out a fair amount of it (of those things that have appealed to me) - in different settings and with different presentational slants...a few that have remained in my brain have been slowly transformed a little (there is one coin thing in carnival of secrets that I absolutely love) that is always with me, I've changed it - but I wouldn't have thought of it without the original scryer presentation...

in recent years, I've gotten more usual and long-term ideas and presentations out of the scryer stuff than anything else... it doesn't mean I present it in a psychic way, I present it in a way that suits me far more...which I thought was what we should be doing with mentalism, make it personal and suit "you" the best you can...

i've not enjoyed absolutely everything I've ever read of scryer's but I have enjoyed thinking about why I've not liked one thing, but loved another...
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Dec 26, 2014, George Hunter wrote:
it helped me perceive more potential in the effects than I had picked up from reading them alone. Unfortunately, Webster kind of blew his performance of the haunted pen; they could have videotaped a second take!


It is for this reason I enjoy DVDs, even of previously released printed works. So many additional bits, nuances and extra things are always picked up in DVDs.

Thanks for the reviews and insights guys.
Tony Iacoviello
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Iain:

Thank you for your comments.

I found it listed on Amazon and had almost enough left over on giftcards from my last birthday.
So late birthday gift, or late Christmas gift, it is on the way. Smile
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