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Nestor D Special user France (Paris) 830 Posts |
If would like to get rid of the containers in pseudo psychometry
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Chaz93 Inner circle Texas 1754 Posts |
I would (and do in all cases that I can) get rid of the visible comprimise. This leaves most of my effects looking like nothing was written down, even if it was. In general though, I agree with Insight that propless nothing written down mentalism tends to approximate the real deal better. In one-on-one or small intimate performances I will use the propless stuff as there is no way to backtrack. On stage, I use paper, notepads, whiteboards, chairs, envelopes, etc. But, if we were really doing this for real we'd not need anything written down. Also in my experience with PS work I have found the same effect will get different reactions depending on whether I PS the information and hide that fact so it appears to be completely hands off, or get the information in real-time with a p**k or something.
The thing is people like to defend their own particular views as if they're carved in stone and handed down from on high. Go with what works for you, what entertains your audience, and what fills your bank account. Whether that is a stack of blank business cards, or no props at all. Either way, in someones eyes, your choice is gonna be wrong |
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maggus New user Barcelona 60 Posts |
I always explain what will happen. That's a big difference with magic. Mentalism provides you the tool to tell them what you are going to do... This is, in my opinion, what makes mentalism so strong, so believable.
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Chaz93 Inner circle Texas 1754 Posts |
Why explain what would happen, rather than let them experience it and then re-frame it? I've always considered the before-the-effect speech of "this is what is going to happen" to be a bit like a spoiler, and fear it serves to make the ending less powerful. If you tell them at the start that you're going to divine the word they're thinking of surely it loses the punch when you do, as they expect it.
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
I see your general point, Chaz, but when people come to see my show they pretty much expect me to reveal thing's they're thinking about.
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Chaz93 Inner circle Texas 1754 Posts |
They expect me to dance around in a clown suit. I'm not sure why, but it's a totally unrealistic expectation to have of me.
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bdekolta Inner circle Texas 1636 Posts |
Nestor - if you eliminate the containers in that routine then you are doing psychometry. Just do it.
Quote:
you must admit that propless mentalism has major advantages over things like billets. Why would I "admit" that. I don't believe it and think taken too far it actually has major disadvantages. I know I started some of this discussion with Jerome and I's "Propless Gaffless" workshops. But - in our definition a piece of paper, a pencil, etc. still fit. We have explained this in depth on our free Preview recording. Not trying to toot my own horn but I can do a good 20 minutes with nothing more than myself and some participants. But I prefer not too. And for an interesting study in the level of discourse on this forum go back about 12 years and see who was posting. Then look at who is not posting now. Why did the big names stop? Why are more wanting to stop by the day? |
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hashtagmagic Regular user 140 Posts |
Quote:
On Mar 25, 2015, mastermindreader wrote: Have you found billet work to be as powerful in a one on one setting as it is on stage? |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18012 Posts |
My friends swear by billets .. I say no.... Not in the traditional sense ... not for me .. Knock yourselves out. I feel it is much stronger if it is never written down. Like the movie FOCUS...
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Hashtagmagic-
I find billets to be just as effective in one-on-one situations as they are on stage. But good billet work is difficult to do well and requires a lot more practice than most casual performers are willing to do. And, like all mentalism, it also requires the utmost in showmanship and nerve to present convincingly and entertainingly. |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18012 Posts |
Good billetless work is difficult to do well and requires a lot more practice than most casual performers are willing to do. And, like all mentalism, it also requires the utmost in showmanship and nerve to present convincingly and entertainingly.
Dave Koenig Just for fun...
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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insight Inner circle 3095 Posts |
I agree and say no too. I feel that an effect that requires no writing is better suited for an intelligent audience. Take one of your radio effects, for example. That is much more powerful than say billet work, even if performed by a living legend.
Regards, Mike Quote:
On Mar 26, 2015, Slim King wrote: |
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Seethings Elite user 435 Posts |
This is not a thread about billets or not. Please read the original post!!!
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
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On Mar 26, 2015, insight wrote: Billetless usually means extra process and method to be hidden. Nowhere near as direct and IMO can raise more suspicion than a well justified billet. |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18012 Posts |
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On Mar 25, 2015, Seethings wrote: Having the volunteer secretly select a tarot card and then doing a reading for that card over the radio/telephone without having touched the tarot deck, not even being in the same state .... Telepathic Tarot. Is that the kind of thing you are talking about?
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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backinblack Special user 910 Posts |
Quote:
On Mar 25, 2015, mastermindreader wrote: don´t see the prob.. the comment was on topic and not offending on a personal level.. |
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Chris K Inner circle 2544 Posts |
I think we are all in an interesting situation. As performers (most of us) or collectors (the rest?), we have opportunities to see these things in action the way other people don't.
I go on a lot of cruises. I perform NOTHING on the cruises (I'm on vacation for spaghetti monster's sake!). However, I enjoy watching all the shows and performances, both on the ship and the performers in ports. <I'm about to generalize, stay calm, I admit now I am generalizing> What have I found? That method doesn't matter. Writing, no writing, props, no props, sexy assistant, fat guy from audience helping. It all boils down to having a well flowing, engaging presentation. This goes for big stage magic, more close up magic, and mental magic (haven't seen a true "mentalist" yet). The most successful weren't performing the technically most difficult, i.e., "hands off" effects. An over the phone effect like Slim's, as powerful as they are in the right situation, would fall flat in that specific kind of situation, for example. Now, as the mastermindreader himself, Bob Cassidy pointed out in another thread, I don't know if they left thinking the mental magic guy was psychic or a magician or ... and I didn't ask. I did know that everybody talked about it at breakfast the next day. Making effects stronger is a good and noble cause but, frankly, I don't see that as being the issue for 99.9% of the people here (sorry, but true, and I coun't myself in that percentage just to be clear). So, to me, making an effect stronger starts with you, not methodology. And definitely not trying to get into a billet/no billet circle again. Best, Lem |
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backinblack Special user 910 Posts |
Well, of course it is a lot about the presentation/you.. but if you start to plan an act it bases on the routines you want to use.. so: if it is the same strength of presentation/audience management: what methodology makes the performance stronger? I really do not see the prob if different pplz have different opinions in this issue and communicate their opinion.. freedom of speech - challange accepted..
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E.E. Inner circle Look mom, I have 1533 Posts |
Hey Seethings drop me a line would ya?
Professional mentalist and digital artist for mystery performers. check out my work at www.facebook.com/EverElizaldeArtStudio
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Chris K Inner circle 2544 Posts |
Quote:
On Mar 26, 2015, backinblack wrote: Yeah... no. That is a specific question, with a whole different set of issues that one has to discuss (which methodology...). If you actually look at the original post, it says, quite clearly, "'If you take a standard effect in mentalism and you change the physical conditions around, the effect will become much stronger." Physical conditions are not the same as methodology. You can use the same method with different conditions and different conditions with the same method. Oh, never mind, what's the point... |
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