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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Parents of Child Killed in Boston Marathon Bombing Don’t Want Tsarnaev to Face the Death Penalty (5 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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LobowolfXXX
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On Apr 27, 2015, TonyB2009 wrote:
Danny, an opinion is like an a&s - we all have one. I haven't seen anything from you to cause me to change my mind. Just stating your opinion forcefully, which is all you have actually done, doesn't cut it with me. Sorry.


Funny you should mention it...
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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I was thinking the same thing.

Odd how I was stating facts nottt opinion. Tony is the one with the differing OPIONION that things are not as they are stated. Yet Tony you offer no proof of what you claim. You want to call it a myth and so forth. I don't think you spent ANY time with maximum security prisoners in America yet you tell those who have they are wrong.

Since it is so well documented as you claim please provide that documentation. Otherwise you are writing fiction again.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
RNK
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Quote:
On Apr 27, 2015, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 27, 2015, TonyB2009 wrote:
Danny, an opinion is like an a&s - we all have one. I haven't seen anything from you to cause me to change my mind. Just stating your opinion forcefully, which is all you have actually done, doesn't cut it with me. Sorry.


Funny you should mention it...


Exactly. And your google opinion when it comes to America doesn't cut it with me. To funny....
Dannydoyle
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And funnily enough to use that analogy because an opinion can often make on3 look like an...
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TonyB2009
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Funny, Danny, how we both quoted the same amount of facts here. None. You stated an opinion. I stated an opinion. And you haven't succeeded in changing my mind.

Maybe if you can tell me a few instances of when gang-aligned paedophiles were targeted by their gangs (for the paedophilia, not for other reasons), then I might change my mind. You will appreciate it is more difficult for me to cite examples of people who weren't picked on, because they weren't picked on. If I am wrong prove me wrong. Don't just blow hot air.
Dannydoyle
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Ok a giant raccoon farted several billion years ago and set the big bang in motion. Price me wrong.

YOU are the one making the assertion that people are not picked on and calling it a myth that they are. Prove your claim.

Why is it with you that if you use Google to do research something it is a fact, and other peoples actual life experience is an opinion? http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=90004
Now YOU post something that shows it is a myth for us OK?

Make no mistake I am not trying to change your mind. Not possible. No matter what you are going to think whatever you do because you know better. Even with NO experience and being told different by someone with significant experience you don't change a bit. Never will.

Here this might be interesting for you to see.
http://www.vice.com/read/why-sex-offende......sons-218

Straight from the article that won't change your mind one bit. "But one rule holds true across the board: One race doesn't put hands on an inmate of another race, even if the con in question is a pedophile. "Every group takes care of their own," Kilo says. "Once the blacks find out [someone is a pedophile], the Bloods and Crips take care of it. Once the Hispanics find out, the cholos take care of it. Once the whites find out, the skinheads take care of it.

So prison politics come into play when it's deemed time to take out a perv. But why are California sex offenders out in the open—relatively speaking—even after the state established separate housing units for vulnerable inmates?

"The police don't like to try to discriminate despite the fact that they got those charges in their background," Kilo says. "That's a choice they got to make if they want to go to a Sensitive Needs Yard. Some of them try to slide through to the mainline [the general population] until somebody exposes them or hears about their case or whatever. And once they get exposed, it's all bets off."

Even though gangs may disagree on various things, they all agree that sex offenders deserve rough treatment, Kilo tells me.

"When it comes to those type of guys, every race is going to get them," Kilo says. "The chomos don't get a break, period. The only relief they get is if they go to protective custody [PC] and some yards are all PC." And, according to Kilo, if a sex offender makes it out of protective custody, the guards sometimes give the convicts a heads-up."

Bit TONY says it is a myth and it is not true and blah blah blah. Now Tony, how about YOU provide something other than an opinion and saying I only have an opinion and provide back up for your assertion. Till then YOU are the one full of hot air.

As I said I am talking about AMERICAN prison and AMERICAN prison gangs. Lord only knows what you are talking about.

And here is the last line of the article that won't change your mind. (I doubt you will even read it.)
"What can't be dismissed as a trend or passing fad is that when child molesters get exposed in American prisons, they're targeted—and sometimes even killed."

It matches up with my personal experience. Which was what I said before.

Now again I ask you to provide your research as to this being a "myth" please.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TonyB2009
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Danny, thanks for posting those links. Two interesting articles.

In the face of the evidence I will move my position. It now seems obvious that paedophiles are targeted in some US prisons. The articles both however made it clear that it was not universal. I have interviewed prison officials in US jails, but not in Californian jails. I was basing my opinion on what they had told me. Obviously I need a larger sample to interview.

The situation in Europe is as I outlined, but I stand corrected on some American prisons. And definitely on Californian prisons.
Dannydoyle
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Well that was exactly my personal experience. The enraging part is you telling me my personal experience is just somehw wrong in light of a couple of interviews.

Also pretty much no behavior is universal. Nobody said it was. We simply said it was not a myth. And that you are ignorant of the American prison system and its gangs. Less so now.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TonyB2009
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Point taken Danny. If we were speaking face to face it would go better!
Dannydoyle
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Well someone was 100% wrong about you changing your position on the matter.

Let me check the thread and see who that was. .. oh wait all I had to check was the mirror. Sorry. The sarcasm was not needed. My bad.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Destiny
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Found an interesting article on the lawyer - she's representing him because she is against the death penalty, which I think is admirable, though I disagree with what seems to be her reasoning - that all these murderers do things because of brain injuries or horrible things that happened to them when they were younger. I tend to think that there are a few among us who are just evil.

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2015/03/j......v-lawyer
landmark
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I think there are people who are just evil--they delight in the suffering of others. They have no moral code. They kill for the thrill of it.
I don't think Tsarnev fits that category.
He believed, incredibly, that he was doing the right thing. He was weak-minded and egged on to do a horrific thing.

But, frankly, I am far more interested in the victim's parents' state of mind than in Tsarnaev's. As I said in the OP, I don't think I could be that generous. I am very interested in how and why they came to that conclusion. I want to know more about who these people are. They seem fairly remarkable to me.
Dannydoyle
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There are the people you speak about. I have met them.

Because we live in a Yin/Yang type of world there are also the polar opposite type of people in existence. There are people who are just so good that it is hard to imagine what brings them to that place and how in the face of the world they can possibly be so good. Almost as tough to understand.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, landmark wrote:
I think there are people who are just evil.


I'm pleasantly surprised!
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, landmark wrote:
I think there are people who are just evil.


I'm pleasantly surprised!


To be clear I am interpreting this as you are surprised he would admit this, not that these people exist.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, landmark wrote:
I think there are people who are just evil.


I'm pleasantly surprised!


To be clear I am interpreting this as you are surprised he would admit this, not that these people exist.



I'm a little surprised to learn that Landmark shares my belief on this point. Not everybody does.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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Spend a few weeks investigating child crimes. The viewpoint tends to be agreed with.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
LobowolfXXX
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And in other venues, it tends to be disagreed with.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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For certain.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TonyB2009
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Quote:
On Apr 30, 2015, landmark wrote:
But, frankly, I am far more interested in the victim's parents' state of mind than in Tsarnaev's. As I said in the OP, I don't think I could be that generous. I am very interested in how and why they came to that conclusion. I want to know more about who these people are. They seem fairly remarkable to me.

From my reading of it they are concerned that their lives will be taken up in endless appeals if the death penalty is chosen. They are seeking life imprisonment to end this thing and move on with their lives, not out of compassion. I may be wrong, but that is how I read it.
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