I was reading Lee Asher's "Hand Jobs," and was struck by the boldness of his "Losing Control" method of getting a card to the top of the deck. I tried it on a few family members and it seemed to work okay. However, because of the boldness of the "move," I am hesitant to try it in public. Although I primarily use two excellent controls to get a chosen card to the top of the deck (Vinny's Top Gun and the Wow Control), I am curious if anyone uses Asher's Losing Control and what your experience has been with it.
Thanks.
Richard

I will be honest with you: I love Lee's stuff. I think he has a very creative mind, and has created great sleights and effects for the magic community these years.

But (and I hope Lee doesn´t get angry with me) I don't like this sleight at all.

I must confess that maybe this could work in the real world (I've never tried it), but I don´t like it. I don't think this could be real done in the real world. Of course, with misdirection sure, but with misdirection also I could load an elephant from my jacket.

But if you are looking for an in-the-hands card control, you had the best one (Vinny's) or you could try also one of the best out there: Tamariz's Perpendicular Control.

Also I would like to hear others' thinking about Losing Control. Maybe I am wrong and this is a great control, but I don't like it.

Just my opinion, not good, not bad, not right, not wrong, just what I think.

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero

If you would see Losing Control performed prior to assessing it, you would love it. It will drill you. I had Lee do it for me 4 times before he explained it at a lecture. I wanted to see if it would "stand up in the real world." Never picked up on the methodology. Of course it's silk in his hands. It is rather difficult to learn the sleight. Not that the mechanics are hard, but to get your hands to work backwards is difficult. By the way, the best version is Alan Ackerman's adaptation to it with the selection outjogged; similar to a convincing control. So don't bash it if you haven't seen it done, it realllllllllllly is good!

Hi Pablo,
Do you have a reference for Tamariz´s Perpendicular Control?
Thanks.
Richard

I have seen it, and in Lee's hand, so what are you talking about?

Richard asked for opinions and I gave mine. As I told before, please read my post again. I LOVE Asher's stuff; I think he is one of the best creative minds in card magic these last years, and a very great person too. He helped me a lot when I tried to find some decks for magic.

But my honest opinion, after seeing this control in his hands, is that I don't like it at all. Just this.

On the other hand, Richard I will pm you later about TPC (Tamariz's Perpendicular Control).

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero

I use this control frequently.
Yes, it most certainly does work in the real world.
It's great because it's one of the few controls in which no break needs to be held.
I've never had anyone "catch" me doing this and it's flown by people even when they were burning my hands.
(In fact I'd recommend it when performing for those types of people because they are looking for the 'move.' The losing control has no 'move' as such and is therefore tension-free.)

Highly recommended.

I agree with Pablo.
I saw the demo clip by Asher and thought this was a joke. I don't doubt that this could really work well, but I, personally, only use moves which I can believe myself. This very one doesn't fool ME at all, so....
Again, it's a question of perception. I would probably use other moves that fool ME, and which other people would say that they don't like it for the same reasons.
Sorry, I build my sentences like french ones... I hope it is understandable.

Jonathan.

I am no flicker by any means, but this is the main control I use. It is bold, it is direct & it is simple. I have showed this to some magicians as my pass & it has blown past them. To spectators I am doing nothing. Between this & pulp friction I can get through an evening.

I have to chip in here. I too saw the demo on Lee Asher's site and after he did it I thought, "Right, now he'll apparently lose it and control it." But I was wrong. I had just watched the move and frankly was not all that impressed. Having said that though, I do think that video demos on the web have a tendency to let you in a bit more than in actual performance. I'm 100% sure that Lee himself kills with this, magicians and all, but presented on video it just seems too bold and obvious. For me to be interested in a move I have to be fooled or at least be questioning how it was done and in the case of 'Losing Control' I was neither.

As Pablo said earlier, just my opinion, nothing more.

Dave.

Actually the demo doesn't do justice to the move at all.
I have also changed the timing of the thing to make it more deceptive (PM me if you are interested). I even fooled Daryl with it three times in a row and use constantly it for laymen, so it works in the real world.

Juha-Matti

I agree.
A taped demo can never do the move justice - you lose the retention of vision aspect that makes this control deceptive.
I promise that if you had seen this performed rather than just watched it on a demo clip you would have scratched your head and frowned quite hard.

I believe Juha-Matti when he says that the move fooled Daryl three times in a row.
It is that good.
Then again, I enjoy employing bold techniques; they are most enjoyable.

As I said, I think the main advantage this control has over others is that it is completely without tension which can make it more indectectable than a well executed pass.
Gosh, how controversial...

The first step in evaluating something is to try it.

That means giving the thing a go with real people.

The thing is what it is. If it works for you... great.

Well stated Stephen! No one has mentioned the Ackerman addition to this move. It really moves it into a nice arena.

I agree with 10cards. I have used the move outjogging the card which makes it even more deceptive, but I had no idea that it was Ackerman that added that subtlety. Thanks for the info!

It's all about timing!

Cheers@

Hi,
I think this is an excellent control, and use it in the real world all the time. When performed without hesitation this move is a non-move. The video most definitely does not do this justice. The first few times I witnessed it live......well I didn't witness it, I was simply blown away by how my selection was now on top. If you are nervous about performing it, it will show in your tension, body language, and by the desire to "overprove" that it really is going into the middle. However, if you honestly believe you're just lowering the cards from their gaze and closing up the pack, they will believe it too.

-Oz

Lee was just here a couple of weeks ago, and performed his control for the group. Our group that night numbered about 45, and all were just blown away by Lee's Losing Control. Pablo, I have read your posts elsewhere, so please believe that I respect your opinion. Mine differs, and though I haven't got the shameless presentation that Lee gives, it still gets by just about anyone. Lee is so bold, he almost dares one to catch him, but there is nothing to catch! I think he is a great card guy with a bright future (not that he's doing too badly now). I know he can count on me as a customer.

Please, don't misunderstand me. I like Lee Asher's work a lot. I have most of his writings and I think he is a brilliant talent in card magic, with a lot of great ideas.

What I only said is that in my opinion, I don´t like Losing Control, and I hope Lee could sorry me, but that's how I think.

Maybe it is because (even if it sounds pretentious) here in Spain the level in card magic is very high, maybe one of the top in the world. So here in Spain you could learn variations and so on of controls in the hands, far much better than this one, and more deceptive of course.

But of course, it is just my little opinion. I am not Marlo to say what is good or bad in card magic. I am only a little apprentice in card magic who didn't like this control.

I understand all of you who like it. As we say in Spain, "Para gustos los colores" (translation is more or less: "if you are talking about what likes or not, look at the colours; everyone has a different one favourite.")

But I will give a second opportunity to this control, I promise it.

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero

I guess the intelligence level of spectator's in Spain is so much higher than America? Right. C'mon, poor analogy. It's all right as your own "personal preference" if you don't like it, but don't insult our intelligence.

Oh my god! Please don't get angry with me, but could you read my post again?

I've never had a problem in this forum. And you are the one insulting my intelligence. I said: "level in Spain in card magic." I wasn't talking about spectators; I was clearly talking about magicians. If in a magic forum, we are talking about the LEVEL in card magic... are we talking about magicians or about birds?

Magicians? YES.

Then what I said is that in Spain, most magicians do ONLY card magic since for a lot of years, Spain has been a great school in card magic. We think in card magic different than in other parts of the world: more like an art than a way of having fun with friends, and in Spain the card magic is at a very high level (I am talking about magicians). This is why I said that here some people--sorry, magicians--had reached a high level in card magic so I/you/we could learn here in Spain more deceptive in-the-hand controls similar like Lee's but much better.

What happens with this thread?

I said at least three or four times that I LOVE Lee Asher´s card magic (and it's true, I am honest, I love his creations and his magic style) but I don't like his control.

I have my opinion, you have yours. Everything right. But why do you place words in my mouth that I've never said?

Please carefully read what I write before answering. All of this message could be deleted if you had read my message better.

Take care.

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero

Peace in the world.
No need for this to blow up.

This control is something that either people hate or people love.

Personally I love the idea of the control. I been playing around with this idea and I had mixed reactions about this move. I find layman dumbfounded by it, and some that say I am retarded. I get magicians that get fooled by it and I had to explain it to them 5 times before they understand and I get magicians who see right through it.

I think there is more about this control than the mechanics of it.

Keep playing with it. Just because it's obvious (to the person who knows the techinque) doesn't mean it's not powerful.

Tony C.

P.S. Try to do something else with this! Like try the prophecy move with it. It is interesting.