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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All in the cards » » Do you think the Cross cut force fool someone? experiances? (21 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mentalmagicgerman
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Hi

What are your experiances with the cross cut force?

...and what is a good out, if it does not work? ...should I jump to another Force-or does it seem weird?

thank you
merlin2812
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Hello,

The cross force is really good for Anyone who doesn't altready know it... You need to avoid calling attention to it, and with a little Time misdirection , it Will work just fine!

Best,

Merlin
warren
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As long as time delay is used wisely it works very well and I can't really see an out as being needed as you can't miss with this force unlike the classic force.
george1953
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Never had a problem with it and I use it a lot.
By failing to prepare, we are preparing to fail.
BeThePlunk
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I agree with the above, but for an out, explore the possibilities of a key card as a back-up.
jimgerrish
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The cross-cut force doesn't fool anyone. YOU, as a magician, use it as a tool to fool the fiddlesticks out of everyone, including other knowledgeable magicians. It's all in your presentation and style.

I suppose a clue is in order. Don't cross the bottom stack on top- instead put a shot glass on the top half and separate it with the bottom half (but not crossed). Believe it or not, this has fooled many magicians who should know better. You can also use the card box for separation, but the shot glass adds a concern of "danger", especially if it is full of liquid, that befuddles the mind from a card force to something else. The force comes later, when you ask a spectator to carefully lift the cards off the glass, peek at the card "to which they cut" and take a drink from the shot glass.
Atom3339
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I disagree. I have used the Cross Cut Force hundreds of times fooling spectators and magicians. Like most things in Card Magic, it depends on PRESENTATION.

And........

Time.......misdirection.
TH

Occupy Your Dream
ianchandler
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The magician makes the rules and performs the actions. The spectator follows. The cross-cut force, like many other principles, relies on the magician's authority and surety.
alicauchy
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In one occasion I had a spectator who only cut the top card . . . but even in that case the force worked well !!!

Quote:
On May 24, 2015, jimgerrish wrote:
I suppose a clue is in order. Don't cross the bottom stack on top- instead put a shot glass on the top half and separate it with the bottom half (but not crossed). Believe it or not, this has fooled many magicians who should know better. You can also use the card box for separation, but the shot glass adds a concern of "danger", especially if it is full of liquid, that befuddles the mind from a card force to something else. The force comes later, when you ask a spectator to carefully lift the cards off the glass, peek at the card "to which they cut" and take a drink from the shot glass.


Nice suggestion !!
So much to do, so little time . . .
Kabbalah
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Quote:
On May 24, 2015, jimgerrish wrote:

Don't cross the bottom stack on top- instead put a shot glass on the top half and separate it with the bottom half (but not crossed).


Sorry, but, I disagree. By using the shot glass you are calling attention to the deck exactly when you do not want to. And, what is the motivation for using the glass? It is not needed to keep the halves separated.

See Liam Montier's take on this force in John Bannon's effect, BAN-NIHILATION. You can find this in Bannon's latest book, Destination Zero, pp. 48-49.

The final picture in the spectator's mind is a freely selected card protruding half-way out of the center of a ribbon-spread deck.

It is the best touch I have ever read, and I have read many in the past fifty years.
"Long may magicians fascinate and continue to be fascinated by the mystery potential in a pack of cards."
~Cliff Green

"The greatest tricks ever performed are not done at all. The audience simply think they see them."
~ John Northern Hilliard
jimgerrish
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Exactly the effect I am looking for. You are so worried about what that glass is doing there you focus all attention thinking and worrying about it, even when we are just discussing it hypothetically. See? It works. You now think of it as the "trick with the glass" or as a "bar bet" or something other than a card trick. Don't knock it if you haven't tried it.
magicfish
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Quote:
On May 23, 2015, mentalmagicgerman wrote:
Hi

What are your experiances with the cross cut force?

...and what is a good out, if it does not work? ...should I jump to another Force-or does it seem weird?

thank you

I'm guessing you haven't studied many books.
JBSmith1978
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Jim Gerrish

Great idea for a variation on Bert Allerton's effect.

Thanks,
Jed
Timtom
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As new to card magic I use it and it works great for me, no one have said anything. I just pause and say something before going back to the card and it works great.
jimgerrish
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Don't be afraid to "think outside the book."
magicphill
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If your woried about the deceptiveness you could always use the Marlo ruse from one of his magazines and also described under a Randy Wakeman effect in Apocalypse. You demonstrate what the spectator is to do by X ing the packets but then proceed to square the cards after the demo. This also throws magicians
Gregor Von G.
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Cross Cut has always worked for me.
The key, as many has already stated, is timing and misdirection.
You can be creative with your presentation, but the only thing to keep in mind is to draw the spec attention away from the decks.
And be relaxed/nonchalant
RLFrame
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Gregor,

I believe you are correct. And I 'll share some in hopes that this thread will continue. I have recently added a line for psychological cover. As the guest sets the cut cards down and I am reaching for the other half I look up and say, "I need to apologize to all of you..." followed by a pregnant pause as I lock eyes briefly with several of them and as if I am going to admit something difficult to admit. By this time, the deed is long since done and I continue on with "I am only getting this right 75% of the time and this may be a waste of time for all of us..." or any number of things peculiar to the routine.

People are quite sensitive to the possibility that they might have been or are about to be wronged in some way so offering an apology grabs their attention. It also provides the time lapse between the action and the guest peeking at the card.

I am also working on redefining what the positions of the packets are in a very subtle manner, as has been suggested. For example, I don't set the packet across the middle, but rather set it down on the edge of the now lower pack so that the much of the back of the card now on top of the lower is showing. My story involves my attempting to do for real what others are faking. As part of that I say, "They don;t allow people to shuffled the cards like you did, then by looking at the tiny markings on this card (he points to the top card of the now lower half) he knows what that card right above it is...." Pointing to the card sitting crossways above it.

Getting too long, but the idea is to A) To drive home that there is no way to know what that card is with a borrowed, shuffled deck. B) to subtly redefine top, bottom, above and below to enhance the force. And C) My wanting to point out those little markings provides a good reason to set the cards across in that manner.
Bill Palmer
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The late Ted Lesley was a close friend of mine. He used the cross-cut force any time he needed to do an absolutely sure-fire force as part of a larger presentations. He covered the use of this rather obvious (to us) method by appearing to be nervous about some other part of the piece he was presenting. Naturally, the part he appeared to be nervous about was the critical part of the piece, which had already been completed, so to speak, by the time the spectator needed to cut the cards. There was plenty of "time delay misdirection" involved as well.
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

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Adrian Deery
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I have used it for years and it works and just as everyone has mentioned time delay and presentation are key when using the force.
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