I'm want to start working on Okito box routines. I'm considering getting David Roth's Ultimate Coin Magic Vol.2 or Reinhard Muller's Okito System. Is there overlap between the two? Is one significantly better than the other for someone starting out with the Okito box? (I'm competent with the basic coin sleights.) Any advice is appreciated.

Check with Dave Neighbor's -- many things available.

The nature of the box makes some video moves hard to see clearly -- that is why the effect works so well.

So, you might consider also having written instructions of basic moves along side of the video as you learn.

The real value of any of the great DVD sets is to have complete confidence in the basic handling before plunging in.

You cannot watch the video and your hands at the same time, so make sure you don't have to look at your hands at all.

Your goal should be that the audience remembers the magic and not the box or you.

Just some thoughts.

Thanks man!

most of my Stuff Is with A Bostom Box ( WITHOUT A coin stuck To the Bottom! ) P.M. me for More Info!

P.S. I have A DVD comeing Out On the Magnetic Coin box! IF they every get around to puting It out!!!

My part Was dome Years ago!

Http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......&forum=3

David Roth also goes in depth on subject of coin boxes in his book, Expert Coin Magic.

I appreciate all the information, but I was wondering if anyone can comment directly on the two videos I mentioned by David Roth and Reinhard Muller. Do they cover the same material? If so, does one do a better job than the other? If not, does one have more advanced or effective (deceptive) material? Pros and cons of either?

Sorry, I thought I was answering that. Dave's DVD covers material these two do not and explains the material better. You can gain from all of them when the basics are mastered.

I thought that was your objective. I prefer the Roth one, but that has nothing to do with the info on the Okito Box.

I prefer to have a spectator hold the box for most effects. That is not covered in any of the DVD's

I have the Muller DVD. Truthfully, I found it a little hard to watch. It was produced in 1986 with a narration. It is well filmed and shows most of the basic moves along with a few different routines than
you find in Roth material. I think David goes though a lot of material on DVD, not sure it's all on one though, although I could be getting confused with the NY Coin Seminar DVDs. On the Ultimate #2 he covers a ton of moves and has a few routines in there also. Probably the best investment to start off with. You have to also decide if you're going to get a slot box, or a set, etc.

That's an interesting idea I've never come across before.

I agree -- having the spectator hold the box IS an interesting idea. There are a couple of routines in the Okito box section of Bobo where the spectator is given the box to hold. Anyone know of other sources for such routines?

I have several created as an extension of my Sway Methods with coins, and other for use with a Collapsible Cup (pill box).

I try to use of volunteer assistants in many magic effects, both to engage the audience and increase the apparent naturalness of props. The astonishment of the VA can sell the show.

I also have new effect using a Rose Purse that is similar to using an Okito Box in many ways, but far more versatile.

The key is recognizing that the hand is a container and that using a VA's hand is "not your hand"

The Roth Material is pretty inclusive. I know you asked for video instruction however Roth's book contains some killer Okito Box material. The Muller material is fantastic as well. I think it's worthwhile to explotre all of it to get a feel for how to handle the box, Roth has a specific touch and it's wise to not learn from one source as it tends to color the way the box is handled. That's the main reason I like books since you can get an understanding of mechanics without the exact mimicry of the "feel"... if that makes sense

I have a book of coin box routine being proofed as I type this. Most of the routines require no table;performed all in the hands. There's two contributions from Bill Citino. And possibly a few things from Craig Ousterling, one of which is the coolest idea I've with the box and sound I have ever seen. Watch for the banner here on the Café.

David Roth's coin box routines do not use the basic Okito move (the T.O. Shhh!)that started out with the box. I've hardly used it myself since trying to learn David Roth's material. These are great pieces but are definitly in the advanced end of the spectrum of coin box material, much of it butchered on u-toob. I would encourage reading books for the same reasons stated above. You should at least read what Bobo has on the coin box. It won't take long and is worth it. The Boston Masacre and many related routines are also worth consideration.

I've read recently that shopping around for opinions on where to devote one's limited time (in this case the study of chess) before making the choice is really a waste of time. One should be submerging oneself in all the work to be found. Some will cling and some will repell. As such that -you- in there will find the best fit. In looking for the "best" to start with you are asking permission to ignore someone else. In time you will need to see it all.

What you will need to find is not instruction but inspiration. So read and watch everything to find the CB routine that does it for you. Then go from there. Enjoy