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WoodRat
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Thanks Kyle,

Of course that is good advice. I am actually interested in pointers to technique and sleights... and good sources of material to practice.

As you can guess, I already have some good *basic* sleights for concealment, production, etc... but I haven't spent much time on flourishes or any advanced handling.

Cheers,
WoodRat
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Bill Palmer
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As an aside -- Al Sharpe learned how to do multiplying Billard Balls without the gaff. One evening he was visiting the Magic Circle of London,(he is a member) and they were having one of those "grab bag nights," in which each performer or group is given a bagful of props and has to come up with a routine. Well, they gave him a bag that had some billiard balls, but no gaff. So he did his multiplying balls routine. They thought he had cheated and rung in a gaff, but he proved that he had not.
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KSMagic2007
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WoodRat, Get the Jeff McBride 3 video series titled: World CLass Manipulation:Essential slight of hand techniques with coins balls and thimbles. I bought these videos about 3 years ago and have been hooked on minipulation ever since.

KYLE
WoodRat
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Thanks everyone for the great ideas and offers.

Kyle, thank you for the offer to help. After I have a few more sleights under my belt, I may take you up on it!

Bill, the Al Sharpe routine sounds grand.

KYLE, I'll check into the vids you mentioned.

I wonder if anyone has ideas on books?

WoodRat
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EddyRay
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Books-

Now you see it, now you don't
It is full of sleights for balls, cards, coins and various other types of props. There is a second volume of this book also.

Tim Wright has a nice video also on multiplying balls, however the McBride series as Kyle mentioned are superb.
Ronin
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Woodrat,

One of my favorite resources is Richard Kaufman's "Balls! Lessons in Sidearm Snookery"--it has a couple of non-gimmick routines, and a good number of moves I haven't seen elsewhere. His thinking on using the gimmick in a more subtle manner is excellent.

The book is out of print (in fact, it was the very first book Kaufman ever published), but I do see it around here and there.

I also started studying the Alan Wakeling routine from "The Magic of Alan Wakeling" by Jim Steinmeyer. It uses a four balls and gimmick set, but again, the routine and use of the gimmick are quite elegant.

I use Fakinis, and love them. However, given your financial choice (balls or cups), I'll throw out this thought: I used to use a 1 inch wooden set and loved 'em. A few years ago, I got the Fakinis, and I love 'em. But as I use them, I think from time to time how the old masters (Cardini, Buckingham, Devant, Hermann, etc.) used wooden or ivory balls and seemed to fine. With that idea in my head, I have a feeling that one day I'll start working with wooden ones again (although they're not so cheap, either).

One last option for cheaper balls: I remember seeing a post on the Café about a year ago, where a user suggested taking wooden balls, spraying on some adhesive, then rolling them in fine craft sand. Let dry, and then paint. I haven't tried it myself, but it could be good way of making a set of wood balls with a good grip.
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Lee Brown
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Frank Garcia had a very large set of Fakini balls. I think they were 2 1/4 inch balls. He did a very nice act with them.
magic4u02
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It is best to try out different sizes and determine what fits your hand the best and what is most comfortable for you. I think a lot of people use the 1 3/4 size more then anything else.

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alibaba
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As for books, Hugard's Magic Manual has a chapter on "Magic With Balls" with extensive and very well-written descriptions of the the ball moves, productions, fluorishes, vanishes etc. along with pointers beginning and finishing up billiard ball multiplication routines.
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maxzve
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I just tried to order fakini balls from Denny & Lee and got a message that they where out of stock :-(
They sent me a mail and told me that they will be back in the mid-october. That's a very long waiting sometimes...Isn't it strange that so popular balls is out of stock? It was the 1 and 3/4" I ordered, white.

For the moment I use 2" german wooden balls and it seems that I have to keep on with them for a while. No place here in Sweden sells the fakinis, only the gorilla grip. I have used the gorilla grip balls and I don't think that the shell is so slippery that some people says.
Christopher Rinaldi
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What about Vernet balls? They have some pretty cool gimmick balls to go with the original silver balls. I've looked into 'em and the prices are pretty fair at some online shops, the balls have a special grip texture and are nearly unbreakable from what the ads state.
videoman
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Quote:
On 2009-09-25 16:01, maxzve wrote:
I just tried to order fakini balls from Denny & Lee and got a message that they where out of stock :-(
They sent me a mail and told me that they will be back in the mid-october. That's a very long waiting sometimes...Isn't it strange that so popular balls is out of stock? It was the 1 and 3/4" I ordered, white.

For the moment I use 2" german wooden balls and it seems that I have to keep on with them for a while. No place here in Sweden sells the fakinis, only the gorilla grip. I have used the gorilla grip balls and I don't think that the shell is so slippery that some people says.


Since you currently use 2" wooden balls I would get the 2" Fakini's if I were you. IMHO, the 2" appear so much larger than the 1 3/4". It just makes the trick so much more effective and amazing. In fact, I would love to be able to use the 2 1/4" size as they appear enormous, but they are just just too large for me to handle. When it comes to BB routines, the old adage is true...bigger is BETTER.
maxzve
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[quote]On 2009-09-27 03:24, videoman wrote:
Quote:
Since you currently use 2" wooden balls I would get the 2" Fakini's if I were you. IMHO, the 2" appear so much larger than the 1 3/4". It just makes the trick so much more effective and amazing. In fact, I would love to be able to use the 2 1/4" size as they appear enormous, but they are just just too large for me to handle. When it comes to BB routines, the old adage is true...bigger is BETTER.


Yes, I agree with bigger is better. I think that training can compensate lack of handsize (...and english is not my first language). The ability to spread your fingers is one thing, but not the only thing. Strength helps when the balls begin to slip and will increase your controll over the balls. I think that SilverFoxx had some exercise ideas in a post somewhere. Maybe I will try the 2 1/4" fakinis. But it's the double price (nearly).
videoman
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Quote:
Yes, I agree with bigger is better. I think that training can compensate lack of handsize (...and english is not my first language). The ability to spread your fingers is one thing, but not the only thing. Strength helps when the balls begin to slip and will increase your controll over the balls. I think that SilverFoxx had some exercise ideas in a post somewhere. Maybe I will try the 2 1/4" fakinis. But it's the double price (nearly).


But keep in mind that it is not only being able to hold the 4 balls between your fingers where size is a factor. The other problem using large balls is the angles start to get really bad when palming them if you have smaller hands. You have to consider all the angles that are involved during your routine and what venues you wish to perform in. I can hold four 2 1/4" balls between my fingers but I cannot conceal one ball in my hand very well. What if you need to conceal 2 balls in your hand during your routine, could you do that? Those are considerations as well.

Bill
maxzve
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Quote:
On 2009-09-28 16:18, videoman wrote:

But keep in mind that it is not only being able to hold the 4 balls between your fingers where size is a factor. The other problem using large balls is the angles start to get really bad when palming them if you have smaller hands. You have to consider all the angles that are involved during your routine and what venues you wish to perform in. I can hold four 2 1/4" balls between my fingers but I cannot conceal one ball in my hand very well. What if you need to conceal 2 balls in your hand during your routine, could you do that? Those are considerations as well.

Bill


Yes, that's right. And yes, I can conceal 2 balls (2"). But it's risky and I don't do that in my routine. But also there it helps with training the muscles in your hand and also the forearm muscles. Of course you cant train up a bigger handsize but the training will give a feel that you can place the ball(or balls) in more than just one place in your palm. The area for classic palming will feel bigger (and also safer). I don't know if that will be enough for you to handle bigger balls. Training the muscles in my palm made it possible to handle four thimbles (palm them in a line from the thumbpalming and down).
Oliver Ross
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Hello everybody,

I've found something very interesting written in a german magic book, one of their bibles in magic.
Concerning the Billard Balls the writer and magician explaines how to find the right and best size of Billard Balls for the size of your own hands.
Here the way how to do and what he writes :

The minimum diameter of the balls is 40mm, but they can always be larger.
To find the right size of balls for your own hands you hold the four balls in your hand.
Maybe a little bit difficult in the beginning, but the hand will get the habbit.
Now you take away with your other hand the ball which you were holding between your for - and middle finger.
Now You move your middle finger in the inside of your hand, in the manner that your middle finger tip can touch the middle of your thumb.
Having done this, you stretch your fingers out again.
If no ball (of the three) is falling out of your hand, try the same thing again with larger balls.
The largest balls that permit the correct and fluent movement of this excercise are the right size for your hands.

Well, try this out and tell us if it works for you.

Oliver.
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