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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Cleanest coin switch ever? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Mark_Chandaue
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Hi guys, here's a video of a coin switch I developed around 35 years ago. It's finally going to be released shortly. I've used two slightly contrasting coins otherwise nobody would believe there was a switch.

The Chandaue switch in action
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnNL540LI9g

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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funsway
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Not clear what you are attempting to accomplish here.

If it is to "Switch in/out a gaff" it could be very impressive.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Mark_Chandaue
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I'm attempting to accomplish the basic purpose of a coin switch, to switch one coin for another without appearing to have switched it. I thought the use of contrasting coins in the video for demonstration purposes would make that obvious.

Pretty much as might be done with the bobo switch or any other switch. It could be used to switch in or out a gaff such as a copper silver coin, switch a borrowed coin for one with a known date for a date prediction or to switch a straight coin for a bent coin. Realistically it could be used for any of the multitude of reasons a coin worker may wish to secretly switch one coin for another.

Over the years my most common uses for it have been to perform tricks requiring gaffed coins using "borrowed coins", during my copper silver routine both for ringing in the copper silver coin and to switch the copper coin for the silver and vice versa and for coin bends. The switch is usually performed in the act of taking the coin from a spectators hand rather than from the table as in the video.

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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John Long
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I think coins of greater contrast(like a Chinese with a hole to a half) would better make your point
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J-Mac
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Mark, with the similarity of the coins and the narrow (iPhone?) video window, it is difficult to see just what's happening.

Thank you.

Jim
funsway
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Thanks for the clarification -- and I support what you are trying to do.

For years I have played with effects in which a coin (or other object) changes form before a spectator's very eyes.
or example, when a coin is my left hand it is copper and silver when tossed to my right hand -- then back and forth.

For the observer they "switch" rather than transform, just as a person switches personality for various settings.

I found that the "change" is not always obvious even when the appearance is obvious to me. This is possible the fault of predictive vision.

Thus, finding a "cleaner switch" may not matter to an audience in most cases.

Yet, I am excited about any new "invisible switch" method so that I can vary my method during a routine, because repetition can be revealing or suspicious.

Even misdirection or "directed focus" can fail if a lot of switches are made in a routine or show.

I want to see more. As teaching method, though -- oversell that change in form so that we can understand what is happening.

Not on a public forum, of course.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Mark_Chandaue
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Quote:
On Jul 25, 2015, J-Mac wrote:
Mark, with the similarity of the coins and the narrow (iPhone?) video window, it is difficult to see just what's happening.

Thank you.

Jim


Jim the similarity of the coins is to demonstrate how invisible the switch is in action, the slight difference in coins is to prove a switch actually took place. The point is that there is absolutely nothing to see because the switch is so clean. I don't know of any other coin switch that an experienced coin worker would need contrasting coins to spot when a camera is burning the hands and the fact that a switch is being performed is openly stated. It's nothing to do with the iPhone camera, it's just as invisible face to face.

When performing a coin bend with a pre-bent coin a switch is the obvious solution unless the switch is so clean as to completely rule out the possibility of a switch. Likewise for a date prediction. In fact my date prediction rules out a switch by firstly allowing the spectator a completely free choice of the denomination of coin to hand me after the prediction has been written and then using this switch to ring in my a coin with a matching date thanks to an index.

Here is an example of the switch used as a coin bend. The switch isn't quite as smooth here because I was too busy focussing on holding the camera.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS5JY4_I2jw

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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Mark_Chandaue
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Just to give a little history to this switch. Many moons ago Eddie Gibson put out a coin to impossible location that had them sign a coin and even though the coin never left their sight it managed to appear sealed inside a case that was on display before the coin vanished. It relied on a gaff that allowed only the signed part of the coin to be stolen while the rest of the coin remained in full sight. I was a pureist back then and so wanted to be able to achieve it without gaffs. So I needed a switch so clean that the spectator absolutely believed that they were actually looking at their coin right up to the moment it vanished. This was what I came up with and it did the job well.

It had the added benefit that at conventions I could have fun fooling other magicians performing a full copper silver routine apparently with only a borrowed copper coin and a borrowed silver coin. Items that are in abundance at a convention. Never once did anyone call me on ringing in a copper/silver coin although Michael Vincent and John Carey and one or two others were in on the secret because I shared the switch with them. Other than a few close friends I have kept this for myself for over 30 years. I am finally releasing this in my book that is being released later this year. The switch is actually relatively easy, if you can classic palm a coin you should be able to perform this switch with only a reasonable amount of practice. This isn't one of those moves that requires knuckle busting moves that take years to master.

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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Jonathan Townsend
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Most of us understand the difference between an effective secret switch and a transformation.

How's the get-ready and how often do you use the apparent action in your style of coin handling?

Would you use that switch to clean up after the climax of a cigarette through quarter routine? Or coin in bottle?
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Mark_Chandaue
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The get ready is almost instantaneous you simply have to get the coin you want to switch into classic Palm. These days I only do Mentalism so I only use the switch for a date prediction, a coin bend and to ring in a double tailed coin. However when I was doing coins my main uses were to ring in and then clean up gaffed coins. So I would use it for a cig thru quarter by borrowing a quarter and performing the switch as I took the quarter from the spectator (although here it was a 10p piece). I might use it also to clean up but more commonly I used it to ring something in rather than out. Because the switch happens the moment you take the coin and your hands are seen clearly empty it takes the heat right off the coin so switching it out is easy. To ring in my copper silver coin I would hand them the half dollar to look at (not examine) because in the UK it is an unusual coin, I'd hand it to them commenting on what a beautiful coin it is. I'd then take it back performing the switch as I handed them the penny asking if they remembered them (when I was a coin guy old English pennies had only gone out of circulation in the last 10 years). While they looked at the old penny I'd openly transfer the c/s coin silver side up to my left hand. Now when I took the penny from their hand I'd switch the penny for the real half dollar whilst opening my left hand to show the c/s coin penny side up. Instant transpo and the half dollar could immediately be seen both sides.

Watch that switch and imagine we don't have the slight difference in coins, when my hand turns palm up the spectator is absolutely convinced they are still looking at their coin. From this point it is important to handle it in such a way that it never leaves their sight. Push the cig through the coin and as far as they are concerned you just pushed the cig through the coin they just handed you. Now let's look at the effect I designed the switch for, they take out the coin and sign the heads side, the coin is on their palm heads side up so the sig can dry. You take the coin as in that vid and it is now on your palm up hand tails side up (that was one of my criteria, the switch had to logically result in the opposite side of the coin showing at the end). Even though the signature is now hidden the spectator is absolutely convinced they are still looking at their coin. Let the coin slide off your palm onto the table never leaving their sight and have them place their index finger onto it. Now introduce your nest of boxes or whatever you want to produce the coin from. Now the spectator is holding a nest of boxes that you will never go near and they are absolutely convinced that their signed coin has not left their sight.

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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Jonathan Townsend
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*Tact time - maybe even diplomacy? Here goes:

Hi Mark,

First, thanks for posting the videos of your work in action. And for keeping a focus on performing magic for audiences. In this craft it's refreshing to read that someone's been exploring to find what works and using that in performance for a long time. Kudos and bravo!

When bringing an item into the literature of our craft it helps to find how the item relates to existing knowledge and how it extends existing capabilities. Watching your videos reminded me of time spent around Fred C. Baumann back at the magic shop long ago. He was a champion of a sleight found in The New Modern Coin Magic by J. B. Bobo (hard cover enlarged edition). When describing your methodology, you might do well to address how your work extends the functionality of what's described on page one hundred and eleven. On the next page in that book you may also find some related effort to shunt traffic when using that sort of method in coin magic.

Feel free to PM or or email if you like. The academic / book side of this craft is a resource and represents the best recorded efforts of those who would share their discoveries at the time.

Best wishes,

JonT
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Mark_Chandaue
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Hi Jon,
In the book although aimed at mentalists it does indeed reference and credit bobo's for the elements that were inspired by reading that very book likewise it also references Richard Kaufmans Coinmagic for later refinements that came as a result of the pages of that book. However when all is said and done it is simply a coin switch although a very nice and deceptive switch.

Whilst my book has effects that rely on the deceptiveness of this particular switch, when all is said and done, it is just a utility, something else to add to ones arsenal to be used as best suits the performer. I developed it for my own personal use because I had a specific need, necessity is the mother of invention. I have kept it to myself for over 30 years. The book I am currently writing is a mentalism book and the switch is taught for use in the mentalism routines included in the book which include a date prediction and a coin bend.

The coin bend is a little more involved than is shown in the brief demo video. There is also another coin bend in the book that also owes no small part to bobo's book, a book which in today's world of DVD's is often overlooked and undervalued by the youngsters coming up today.

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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Mark_Chandaue
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Unfortunately my bobo's is the 1966 hardback edition and I think the pages aren't quite in the same places as yours but I suspect we are in the same ball park. That particular methodology was my field of expertise. I did a lot of work in that area from 78 to the early 90's particularly in using it for things that would not traditionallu use that methodology. Alas much of my coin work will probably never see the light of day. I did give Michael Ammar permission to publish some of it around 91 but the book he was planning never saw the light of day.

Much of it I can't even do anymore, the reason I moved to mentalism is that my hands don't work that well anymore and they are getting worse rather than better. Not counting the switch, my personal favourite was the International reverse matrix using only 4 coins, half dollar, penny, Chinese coin and US dollar (today I'd use a euro). To be fair that was mostly an intellectual challenge because someone said it would be impossible to do with only 4 coins and no additional coins. I did share that with David Neighbours around 4 years ago but whether he stored it in his memory banks with the hundreds of other variants he knows I don't know.

Coins were my first love and to be honest no longer being able to do most of the things I once could due to the hands no longer willing to play ball is a source of sadness. 20 years ago I could classic palm a grain of rice, these days anything smaller than a half dollar is a struggle. Fortunately with mentalism I have found a way to continue performing despite the ever decreasing dexterity in my hands. Whilst the hands don't work my mind is still sharp and mentalism allows me an avenue to stretch my creative muscles without the physical limits that age now inflicts on me. It's also nice to go back to being a beginner again despite my original journey starting in 1967.

Mark
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funsway
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We should produce a book "Arthritis and Beyond" or "Old Fart Magic"

I can't do 80% of hat I ustacould -- so I invent new sleights and moves.

Kudos to you for "pressing on."

Sorry for my confusion above -- my memories outstrip my hands.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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J-Mac
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I can contribute to the "Old Fart with bad hands" book!

Jim
funsway
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They used to laugh when I dropped a fork on the floor. Now they applaud when I get through a meal without doing so.

Which trick do I practice? Yesterday I heard "totally old person" say, "Any day that is upright is all right."

I'll bet he knows some magic!

back to the OP -- I'll work on this new switch just because I can. Success is not a requirement.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Michael Rubinstein
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Mark, back in 1986 I put out the Knockout Coin Magic video/ now dvd set which had an international reverse Matrix using only 4 different coins. It wasn't the first published though. I think it was Harry Levine who put one out in Mike Ammar's Encore series if memory serves correctly.
Available at dealers EVERYWHERE - RUBINSTEIN COIN MAGIC- The biggest book on coin magic since Bobo's Modern Coin Magic, and the most important since David Roth's Expert Coin Magic! Hardbound, 500 pages, 20 chapters of state of the art coin magic illustrated with 930 crisp photos! A contribution chapter from over 20 of the world's top coin magicians! This will be the book against which all future books on coin magic will be measured! Already called a Modern Classic!!
And if anyone (USA ONLY) needs some of the coin stuff used in the book, shoot me an email at rubinsteindvm@aol.com as I have some limited supplies of coins and props used in the book.
magicman29
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When is your book going to be released mark?

kieran
Mark_Chandaue
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I'm hoping for later this year Kieran, getting all the crediting and permissions has been time consuming. I'm considering doing the coin stuff as a video download as well because the coin stuff would be easier to learn on video and would have a wider appeal whilst the rest will only be of interest to mentalists.

That's interesting Michael, I might have to see if I can track down copies of those. I came up with mine In the early 80s although I doubt I could date it. I'd be Interested to view those as I can't figure out any other solution to have all 4 coins return to their initial positions instantly with only 4 coins. I'd be surprised if you me and Harry came up with the same solution especially as David said he hadn't seen my version before. David is so knowledgable on the matrix that I'm sure he is aware of yours and Harry's. Even though I don't do coins anymore that problem took some solving. Also we may not be talking about the same thing as I believe at some point the effect that was initially known as a reverse matrix became known as something like a SnapBack matrix and reverse matrix describes a different effect these days.

Just to be clear the effect I am referring to starts as a normal matrix however on the last coin all 4 coins appear instantly in their original places. If there are two other versions out there that achieve this with 4 different denominations of coins and no additional coins I would be intrigued as to how they achieve this without additional coins because I can't see another solution and so would love to know how others solved the problem from a purely intellectual standpoint.

Mark
Mark Chandaue A.I.M.C.
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Michael Rubinstein
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You can also find my version on the NYCMS dvd series, and in my Penguin Live lecture, a available as a download from Penguin, and soon to be released as a dvd. The Knockout Coin Magic 3 volume dvd is sold by L&L. It was originally in my lecture notes from the early eighties.
Available at dealers EVERYWHERE - RUBINSTEIN COIN MAGIC- The biggest book on coin magic since Bobo's Modern Coin Magic, and the most important since David Roth's Expert Coin Magic! Hardbound, 500 pages, 20 chapters of state of the art coin magic illustrated with 930 crisp photos! A contribution chapter from over 20 of the world's top coin magicians! This will be the book against which all future books on coin magic will be measured! Already called a Modern Classic!!
And if anyone (USA ONLY) needs some of the coin stuff used in the book, shoot me an email at rubinsteindvm@aol.com as I have some limited supplies of coins and props used in the book.
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