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RedHatMagic Loyal user UK 239 Posts |
I guess, but I think your analogy to guitar playing is a good one in this sense. Everyone wants to play guitar, but everyone still loves an amazing guitar player. You are "Sick to death of card tricks" fine don't do them.
Spend a bit more time on the Café and it seems that fairly frequently there are posts about "don't start with a card trick" "too many card tricks" etc etc etc. Nor was I tying to blame anyone (I concede it looks that way) but no one ever seems to write the same sort of posts about other magic genres. Sick of mentalism effects, sick of Rope effects, sick of coin magic ...no one writes these posts though there are loads and loads of tricks in these areas too. I stick to my guns, there is a lot of navel gazing about cards.
Let the Entertainment Commence!
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Aus Special user Australia 996 Posts |
I'd like to make an observation about card magic and why it has a high proliferation in magic compared to other branches of our art.
When I started magic,money was always tight, so the luxury of buying expensive props and DVD's was a luxury I just couldn't afford. Playing cards are always available at a reasonable price in and outside magic shops and the versatility of them is almost endless. If you have something that can give you easy availability, offer a economical entry for most people and a diverse spectrum of possibilities in performance then to me it's a no brainier why card magic is such a dominant aspect of our art. The real problem isn't card magic, it is bad card magic and bad performance. Magically Aus |
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frankvomit Elite user 485 Posts |
I'm with aus on that. cards can be fun when the plot is simple and the magic is direct like boom the card just changed in the specs hands to be honest that and a couple others that involve the spec doing most of the work cause those are what I do well. just like spongballs I do a couple routines well. I don't do long effects r anything that involves counting cause I don't do them well. and I don't do conveluted magician fooler tricks cause if I really wanted to fool a bunch of magicians id shout hey david coperfields truck just pulled in at a lecture.
pick the right tricks for you and know how to engage your audience and keep learning. |
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Race Blakhart Special user Selma,CA 624 Posts |
I agree with nearly everything everyone has said in defense of cards. Like I said in the first sentence of my original post, I am still interested in learning the sleights until they are a part of my muscle memory. I'll also add that I love reading about the history of card magic and love watching folks that do it well. Hell, some of my all time favorite performers focus on cards. I just feel like I can't go to a magic site without being bombarded. Not to mention, if I express this to anyone I get their arguments down my throat as if I said something completely different about the subject. Which is why I specified "not pressure to work with cards, but the weight of it all in general, in comparison to the rest of the magic world."
I don't even see what there is to argue here. I was looking for like minded discussion, but I have yet to see that actually happen on the internet. haha Plus the fact that with a lot of folks on the boards you almost have to walk on eggshells unless you want an all out debate. I for one don't look to argue. It's no fun and gets me nowhere. |
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Aus Special user Australia 996 Posts |
Quote:
On Oct 19, 2015, Race Blakhart wrote: Race no argument from me, in fact I agree card magic is overly represented in the grand scheme of things, but I guess it's like anything, if you've had your fill, you move on. It's not really surprising when you think about it, without going into old ground already talked about, it's suffice to say where there is proliferation there is going to be innovation and that innovation is going to spill over onto magic shops and websites in the same magnitude. There is probably a risk of being desensitized by the mass of material if you let it but like anything moderation is key. Also perspective makes a difference, before your eyes start glazing over as just another card trick think of the tricks potential. So much great magic is potentially lost because people take a to linear perspective on what things are. No one seems to take the time to take a step back and ask questions of themselves like: Can I substitute something in it? Can I combine it with something else? Can I adapt something to it? Can I modify and magnify it? Can it be put to some other use? Can I eliminate something? Can I reverse or rearrange it? Once you start seeing things in this way, you stop seeing things as they are and start seeing things as they could be, and that my friend is when things start getting really exciting. Magically Aus |
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Mike Gilbert Veteran user Las Vegas, Nevada 376 Posts |
To tie into what Aus mentioned earlier about just starting out...
Card tricks are generally what an aspiring performer starts with when they're just exploring the art of magic. Performer or not, it is also what we have generally been conditioned to associate with being a magician. "Oh, you're a magician? Can you show me a card trick?" Is this wrong? No, but the spectator/inquirer doesn't necessarily know any better. They don't necessarily know what else the magical arts encompass. Having said that, I've never been a big fan of card tricks. Will I perform them? Sure, but sparingly. If anything, it might be a simple transformation, transposition, or an abbreviated ACR kinda deal. Now, this opinion will most certainly vary without fail, but I believe you could learn nothing more than the material on Born to Perform (Oz Perlman), and be set for life. Unless you want to devote yourself to performing primarily card magic. That's a whole different monster, and more power to you. Otherwise, that material (which is timeless and hard hitting) will be more than enough to weave into the rest of your act, and you'd never have to learn another routine for the rest of your life if you didn't want to. In the end, take it all in stride, and do what makes you happy. I totally see where you're coming from with the bombardment of card effects out there, but if you think about it, it makes sense. Cards are everywhere; either on your person, at a bar, at a party...you name it. You can pick up a deck (doesn't even have to be a complete deck) and do a million different things with them. No swapping props out or even carrying props for that matter. It's self-contained. Am I playing Devil's Advocate? Perhaps, but it is what it is. The cards and I have a standing agreement. They don't bother me if I don't bother them.
-Mike Gilbert
"Most of us have two lives. The life we live, and the unlived life within us. Between the two stands Resistance."- Steven Pressfield |
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Mr Salk Special user Tied to 568 Posts |
Every adult should strive to be competent and at least mildly entertaining at Everything.
One should be able to cook tasty food, play a few songs on readily available instruments, play chess and popular games, and do a few card tricks.
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Race Blakhart Special user Selma,CA 624 Posts |
Aus and Mike, I actually added your replies to my digital notes. I always cut and paste little snippets of information I think can help me on my path, and both of your posts hit me pretty hard with all the great opinions and info. Great stuff!
And Mike, I'm going to forever remember your quote of "The cards and I have a standing agreement." Haha And thanks again for reminding me how much I love the Café! And Mr.Salk, I couldn't agree more. |
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Mike Gilbert Veteran user Las Vegas, Nevada 376 Posts |
I'm glad I could touch somebody's heart in such a profound way LOL! You're gonna be just fine my friend
-Mike Gilbert
"Most of us have two lives. The life we live, and the unlived life within us. Between the two stands Resistance."- Steven Pressfield |
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Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
Well...when I was about 13, I read my way through ERDNASE. Then, I realized that a 13 year old "gambler" wasn't going to "make it".
I explored other "areas" of magic. Seventy years ago (tomorrow, the 24 of Oct.) I did my "first" show in our local Jr. High School. I was not yet 14.) In 40 minutes, I made $26.00. (Grown men were working all week for that!) I kept practicing all of the flourishes, 'cuz people expected a magician to be proficient with cards. I did one card trick (Six Card Repeat--the "mechanical version")'cuz I didn't know how to do a false count. I had seen Harry Blackstone (pere) do the 6CR. He used the glide. He presented it well, but, it didn't look "natural" to me. I've managed to "survive", since 1945! Oh! I did wear out a bunch of George McAthy's "Insurance Policies"! (George and I, and Tommy Windsor became good friends.) Along the way, I got to know a few "card guys" (Charlie Miller, Ed Marlo, Alex Elmsley, Dai Vernon, Ricky Jay, Jon Racherbaumer, et al. I even met Harry Lorayne! I enjoyed their friendship, and, their phenomenal skills. I still do, occasionally, the 6CR (I did eventually learn the buckle count!) and, occasionally, the Insurance Policy. Every once in awhile, I play with the Ten Cards Across. In my late teens and early twenties, I did get fascinated with "white gloves and split fans". That didn't last long! I was trying to be "swayve & deboner". I wasn't! An agent told me, "Make 'em laugh, and, I'll get you work!" I listened. I did. --And, he did. I ENJOY watching a good card man, but, I aint one!
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
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Mike Gilbert Veteran user Las Vegas, Nevada 376 Posts |
Ain't gotta be one to appreciate one!
Happy Anniversary, Dick!
-Mike Gilbert
"Most of us have two lives. The life we live, and the unlived life within us. Between the two stands Resistance."- Steven Pressfield |
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Race Blakhart Special user Selma,CA 624 Posts |
Quote:
On Oct 23, 2015, Mike Gilbert wrote: Amen! And ditto to you Dick! That's amazing! 70 years!!! Congrats!!!! |
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
The best thing about magic is that there are so many diverse areas to work in, cards, coins, close up, stand up, illusion, comedy, escape, bizzare, caberet, mentalism and it really goes on and on and on. I've always been a generalist, when you get a bit bored or tired of working in one venue, you just switch to another.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Mike Gilbert Veteran user Las Vegas, Nevada 376 Posts |
Well said Father! Just remember...there are no rules
-Mike Gilbert
"Most of us have two lives. The life we live, and the unlived life within us. Between the two stands Resistance."- Steven Pressfield |
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Shurikenstorm5 New user South Carolina 75 Posts |
I'm with you 100%. I've done card magic for a few years but I am growing out of it and becoming more interested in mentalism, but when someone ask to see a trick, I always find myself going back doing the same impromptu card tricks I've been doing for months.
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Teyo New user New Brunswick, NJ 53 Posts |
I consider myself a generalist as well. I try to perform and practice a little bit of every field and find my self not being able to chose just one cause they are so many great areas of magic.
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wulfiesmith Inner circle Beverley, UK 1339 Posts |
In my capacity of 20 years plus - I have never performed "card tricks" as such.
They have always been "cloaked" as gambling routines/games of chance etc. You are an entertainer ... put a spin on the ball. Hope this helps ... |
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prestidigitation New user 54 Posts |
I fully support this thread, as I'm sick of card tricks too.
And I think the general audiences are sick of the abundance of card tricks. Plus, as Penn Jillete put it, "card tricks are for wimps!" So, I'll go practice my sponge balls now. |
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Jon Strum Regular user 125 Posts |
If I can riff off your original post, I'd say that I'm sick to death of card tricks that are poorly performed. Sick of watching sleights in need of further practice. Sick of being bored to tears while some poor spectator counts cards into endless piles. Sick of presentations lacking all entertainment value, that are reduced to "and now I will take the card and...".
Once the other hand, I can't get enough card magic done well. So for me, there's never enough great, involving, entertaining, and magical card tricks.
"Do you like card tricks?" he asked.
I said no. He did five. |
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts |
Good on you, Strum. Exactly right.
Re: the post just above yours - perhaps?, possible?, could be? - the audiences YOU KNOW are sick of "the abundance" of YOUR card tricks. I can guarantee that nobody, over the last few decades, and all over the world, have been sick of the abundance of my card tricks. And the kind of people I work for sure would let me know if they were sick of them. I'm quite sure there are others who feel as I do. No? (Perhaps Penn's card tricks are for wimps. I'll challenge anyone to prove that mine are!) Had to get these thoughts off my mind - feel better now!
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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