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Alexxander Elite user Frankfurt, Germany 423 Posts |
Hello everybody, I just found a great thread in another part of the café where mentalists probably don't hang out very often.. and I thought I'd share it with you.
There is a nice discussion about what constitutes a great performer, whether it can be learned or whether you're "born withn it" and some excellent suggestions on how to develop your character. I think it's very useful information for any kind of mystery performer. http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......orum=115 Also, what do you think? What makes a great mentalism performer? |
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Robb Inner circle 1291 Posts |
I'd say charisma, audience awareness/connection, technical proficiency and clarity of effect.
Charisma: the performer must be likable, intriguing, charming, etc. This is that "special something" that is hard to define and while generally you have it or you don't, you can learn to enhance whatever natural charisma you have. Overcoming self-consciousness, showing enthusiasm and excitement for what you're doing, etc. all make you more charismatic, Audience Awareness / Connection: Cassidy and Tamariz have written about this aspect of performance quite well... The performer must be connected with the audience, which means awareness of the audience. Bob calls it simply "the connection", and while it's difficult to define precisely, when you've achieved it you know (unless you're severely self-delusional) and likewise, when it's not there, you feel it all too much. Technical Proficiency: obviously your material has to work! You should not feel any uncertainty about your beats, moves or lines. Actions and words should flow and appear effortless. This unfortunately is where I think most magicians and mentalists think the most important aspect of performing, but really it's the least... By that I mean that even if there are technical snags in your performance, if you're charismatic, aware and a quick thinker, these qualities will overcome the technical failure. In other words, you can work yourself out of it. The same can not be said for the other qualities mentioned here... If you lack them, you're not going to be well received. Clarity of Effect. This is an important one as well... There are guys that have the charisma, have the technical chops, but their performances still lack clarity and impact. Why? Because the audience is sure what exactly happened or why they should be impressed. So, the ride might be quite interesting, but the destination or payoff is a bit of a let down. This is just my quick take on the question. I do think a lot about this, more than I think about routines these days. Trying to be as objective as possible, I think I have a fair amount of charisma as a performer but I could use more audience awareness / connection and I'm constantly evaluating the clarity of my effects. Being something of an intellectual, I often make my routines too subtle or clever and that can really come back to bite you if the audience doesn't realize the impossibility of what just happened. |
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jstreiff Special user 701 Posts |
Repeating something Pop Hayden said in the previously-referenced thread:
"I think that magicians are best served by studying mime, dance and improvisation. These hold the most important and relatable skills to what we do, and sort of crystalize them in a way that is more approachable and useable for most than the more deep and profound studies of the professional actor. Range, for example, is not that important for us. Following the point of focus, understanding how to share space with other performers and the audience, learning how to trust our instincts and immerse ourselves in the story and such things are far more important, and more accessible, than the type of things we find in acting theory. These can be acquired much more quickly in the study of mime and improvisation."
John
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10794 Posts |
Scripting is #1.
Improv and jazzing makes for a good show - but typically not a great show.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10585 Posts |
Believability and connection
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IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
To be something that others are not...an unique selling point...to have that, with some of the elements above, and I think mixed in with dedication and very hard work, then you would be seen as a cut above the rest...probably takes you beyond being 'great'...
I've asked to be banned
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Nestor D Special user France (Paris) 830 Posts |
Robb said it perfectly : Charisma (and it goes and in hand with the "unique selling point") is key then Connection with the audience.
If you have that, you can read a phone book for two hours while being entertaining |
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Robb Inner circle 1291 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 4, 2015, saysold1 wrote: If the question is what makes a great *performer*, I'm going to have to disagree with you there Brett. A great performer can make something out of a weak script whereas a poor performer can make a disaster out of a great script. Scripting is a vital aspect of our work, but I think it is a separate question from what makes a great performer. Of course, the better the script, the more the great performer has to work with, but again, ever see a movie where the plot and dialog sucks but you watch it anyway because a particular actors performance is sooo good? |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
There really is no answer to this question. Because it's all about "it," which one either has or hasn't, and which is nearly impossible to define.
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Robb Inner circle 1291 Posts |
I'm going to go ahead and agree with Bob, despite my attempt to answer the unanswerable. ;-)
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Doctor Crow discusses "it" in "Psychopath- Further Secrets of Doctor Crow."
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Joe Atmore Elite user Joe Atmore 419 Posts |
A certain je ne sais quoi.
Best Thoughts,
Joe Atmore International Artists Consultant Uri Geller's Phenomenon TV Series; PEA Bob Haines Memorial Award; Dunninger Show Recreation; Author of Dunninger Knows and Dunninger's Brain Busters JosephAtmore.com |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
I don't know what that could be.
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Harry the magic man Loyal user Spokane, Washington 270 Posts |
What makes a great movie? There are many different elements but they are heavily varied from film to film or performer to performer. I do not believe this question can be answered.
Between the conception
And the creation Between the emotion And the response Falls the Shadow Life is very long- T.S. Eliot "The Hollow Men" |
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18012 Posts |
EXPERIENCE ......APPLICATION OF TALENT.......HARD WORK.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 7, 2015, Harry the magic man wrote: Exactly- even great performers themselves can't really explain it. They often try to, but they all analyze what they did in retrospect. Example- Ted Williams once tried to explain how he was able to hit a baseball so consistently, but the bottom line was that he really couldn't explain it at all. He just did it. There's that word again- "IT." And in the end you either have it or you don't. Yes, as Slim notes, experience, application and hard work are usually part of the mix, but without that mysterious "it" and formula for greatness is incomplete. |
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RedDevil Inner circle Deep South 1315 Posts |
To have a mischievous alter ego, to drink rum, to be willing to photoshop New Year's baby pictures of himself and share them to let us know he is still having the time of his life while tolerating us disciples? Is that "it"?
www.reddevilmentalism.com
F-F-U-L-Ri-F-F-Li-R-U-F-F |
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eralph357 New user 61 Posts |
I don't buy the notion that greatness is a result of some mysterious IT that one either has or does not. Greatness, when I've seen it (in whatever field), it a result of dedication to craft, experience, etc. I've seen performers start out as woefully unskilled - one might have called them hopeless, but end up great. Even the seemingly innate charisma is misleading - I know quite a few people through Toastmasters that are now considered charismatic, but when they first entered the door had no charisma at all.
I think the reason that greatness is hard to define is not that it is innate, or a 'have-it-or-you-don't' IT, but that greatness has such endless variety. The great performers are great for an endless variety of reasons. Perhaps it is (at least in part) their uniqueness that makes them great. |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
And perhaps that is exactly what part of IT is.
I never said greatness was innate. Some of those who don't have "it" have later acquired "it." Others have subsequently lost it. But I disagree that "uniqueness" is a necessary part of greatness. You can be a unique performer simply by not wearing pants. But there is an undefinable type of "uniqueness" that I simply choose to refer to as "IT." I think that in his earlier post, Joe Atmore describe "it" best- je ne sais quoi, that undefinable element of greatness, which is much more than simply "dedication to craft, experience, etc." There are countless hacks who have those attributes, but who've never achieved greatness. One element of greatness in a performer that hasn't been mentioned yet, is his ability to connect with an audience and to STAY connected. That, coupled with talent and a smidgen of "it" is a pretty good start. |
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robwar0100 Inner circle Buy me some newspapers.Purchase for me 1 Gazette and 1747 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 4, 2015, mastermindreader wrote: The good doctor is onto something here. And, I am not sure anyone can define the "it" factor. I have found myself giving a lot of 5-star reviews on Penguin Live lectures. I started questioning myself whether all of the ones I reviewed can be a five. I concluded yes, they can. When I review a lecture, I am not comparing one performer against another. Rather, do I like the lecture, do I like the performer, do I like the effects, do I like the performance. So, who gets the 5 stars? The ones that resonate with me. We might not agree on the number of stars a performer should get, but for me they get five. Returning to what Bob said, it is all about the "it" factor, and what I perceive the it factor to be. And, for me it includes being funny and engaging with effects that are not convoluted and confusing to follow. Bobby
"My definition of chance is my hands on the wheel," Greg Long.
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