We Remember The Magic Caf We Remember
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Knots and loops » » Finishing the Ends of Rope (12 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
I've noticed that ropes are sometimes finished very neatly in a way that looks like the loose strands are tucked back into the hollow core. Where can I learn the method for doing that or whatever the true technique is?

Thanks,
David
Dick Oslund
View Profile
Inner circle
8360 Posts

Profile of Dick Oslund
David! I learned the "tuck" technique from the late ROY KISSELL in the '70s. Roy got it from the first lady president of the IBM, JUNE HOROWITZ, who got it from a young lad at a magic convention, eons ago.

This was discussed in a thread a year or so ago, but, I don't know how to find it!!!

It aint the hollow "core", it's the hollow "sheath"! If I can find a free minute, I'll write it up again. (WATCH THIS SPACE!)
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
Of course, you're right again. There is no core, so how could it be hollow?
Dick Oslund
View Profile
Inner circle
8360 Posts

Profile of Dick Oslund
The type of rope that magicians generally use is technically called "kernmantel". The core is usually strands of cotton surrounded by a woven sheath.

There are many methods of "sealing" the raw ends to prevent fraying. Old sailors would whip the ends with waxed twine. Many people bind the ends with various types of tape (ductape, etc.) Some magicians use glue, like Elmer's. There is a relatively new method in which one dips the rope ends in a liquid plastic which hardens. Nylon, and other types of "plastic" rope can be heat sealed.

Tucking is an almost permanent method, that requires only a few minutes. The rope pieces that I'm currently using for the Nightmare have seen thousands of spectators!

I'll be back!
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
I'll await your return with heightened anticipation.
Bill Hegbli
View Profile
Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
23046 Posts

Profile of Bill Hegbli
Quote:
On Nov 13, 2015, BeThePlunk wrote:
I've noticed that ropes are sometimes finished very neatly in a way that looks like the loose strands are tucked back into the hollow core. Where can I learn the method for doing that or whatever the true technique is?

Thanks,
David


Nowhere, it is not written up anywhere to my knowledge.
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
The ropes in Fiber Optics appear to be finished this way. On the WGM DVD for PNM, Dan Fleshman indicates that he will speak about it, but his segment ends before he might have gotten to that point.
55Hudson
View Profile
Special user
Minneapolis
982 Posts

Profile of 55Hudson
The routine I use now doesn't require finished ends (the ends are all cut during the performance), but I used to need finished ends. I used candle wax.

Get a nice, clean cut. Burn a fat white candle till you get a good pool of melted wax, dip the end and form with your fingers (be careful of burning yourself!). Probably same outcome as Elmers glue, but I'm a bit old school. And it works just fine. Don't know if other methods last longer, I always replaced my ropes (keep them clean & new looking) before the wax wore off.

Hudson
Dick Oslund
View Profile
Inner circle
8360 Posts

Profile of Dick Oslund
OK Plunk (and anyone else on this "party line") I've kept you waiting long enough.

I published this in my book, with "history". Here are just the basic instructions:

1. Trim off end(s) of the rope.

2. Pull out about 3/4" of the core "yarns", cut off and save in small box labeled, "Pieces of rope too short to use")

4. I like to use a nail file to: Tuck the sheath ends into the space left when you removed core. This may require at least a minute!

5. Now, do other end. Disregard #5 if you have already realized this.

6. When all ends are tucked, roll the ends between fingers to "set" the tucks.

7. Some like to add a drop of white glue to the space left from core removal, BEFORE tucking. I've never found this necessary.

I made up two sets for Professor's Nightmare about 15 years ago. (Always had "back ups" in spare props case.) About a year ago, being retired, I cleaned out the spare props case, and gave the extra set to Anand Khalsa.

The END!
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
That's great, Dick. Thank you. David
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
OK, I did some experimenting this morning and found a very satisfactory process. Here are the steps:

1) I'm using a soft-weave rope without a core. If you're using kernmantle (core surrounded by a woven mantle), follow Dick Oslund's advice above for removing some of the core.

2) Push a fat pen or something similar down into the rope to widen the hollow central space. With the pen still in the center of the rope, carefully un-weave the mantle about 3/4". Take out the pen.

3) Using tweezers, grasp each strand of the weave by its end, push it down the hollow center, and let go. This takes some patience, but it's not so bad. Occasionally, push the pen down in to help all the strands lie straight in there.

4) When all the strands are folded inside, push the nozzle of a bottle of white glue into the center of the rope and squeeze some glue onto the strands. Roll the rope between your palms and pull a few times to spread the glue and bring the rope back into shape.

The result is a very neat, soft and rounded end. For my taste, it is a much better result than a hard end of glue (which sometimes gets caught as I manipulate the ropes) or even the neat look of tape.

Hope it works for you,
David
jkvand
View Profile
Special user
Johnstown, PA
658 Posts

Profile of jkvand
This is awesome! I've been wondering how to do this for years. Thanks for sharing!
Tukaram
View Profile
Regular user
Iloilo, Philippines
200 Posts

Profile of Tukaram
I have never noticed tucked ends... I may have to play with it. All I have ever done is whip the ends with a strand out of a white twine. Only takes a couple minutes and looks pretty good, but the tucking sounds good...
Dick Oslund
View Profile
Inner circle
8360 Posts

Profile of Dick Oslund
Hi Tukaram!

Yup, I've showed Tenderfoot Scouts *for years" how to whip a rope. (Dental floss being waxed, so it has some stiffness, works great.)

However, I think you'll like the tuck "method". Of course, it only works with "sheath and core" rope.
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
Bill Hegbli
View Profile
Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
23046 Posts

Profile of Bill Hegbli
Dick, live and learn, after all that explanation twice, Be The Plunk decided to do it his way, anyway. Then he becomes the teacher, not having tested his method from years of use. He will find out what he has done wrong in a few years if he bothers to do any rope tricks with what he thinks is a better method. I just hope no one uses his method.

I see from his explanation he just skipped over your words. Especially, the word drop, and took it to mean "hard end of glue".

My oh my. Do you think dab would be a better word then drop. Don't know, as he did not know what a drop was.
DaveGripenwaldt
View Profile
Elite user
491 Posts

Profile of DaveGripenwaldt
I've always tucked au-natural...(the rope, not me)...never needed glue.

I would only add that I have used the eraser end of a mechanical pencil for the tucking because the eraser tends to grip the threads of the rope allowing you to push them inside the core more easily.
Mary Mowder
View Profile
Inner circle
Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA
3652 Posts

Profile of Mary Mowder
If you trim the core as Dick suggests and then run a thread around the very tips of the exposed outer sheath so they bundle together it makes it very easy to tuck in. just push the tip if the thread and bundle in with a tooth pick. the thread may come off in the process which is no big deal. I prefer to do a couple of stitches to hold it all together. It is not needed but I do wash and dry my ropes in the washing machine and dryer.
Some glues will not wash and Rope does get dirty.

If you like a hard end just sew it through several times and it will be easier to feel. Don't pull the thread too tightly, match the color of thread after the first wash of the rope and match the weave in you sewing if you want it to look neat. I always pre-wash my rope to shrink it because I know I will be washing it later and I don't want them to shrink too much then. Tie the ends to prevent fraying.

Whenever you wash a Rope, allow some time to break it in again because they will shrink a little and stiffen up. You can get them back to normal by working with the Rope.

-Mary Mowder
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
Thank you, Mary. That sounds like the best solution of all.

I've bought "magician's rope" from two different sources and in two different sizes. I haven't encountered rope with a core to date. our method sounds good for any rope.

Thanks again,
David
Dick Oslund
View Profile
Inner circle
8360 Posts

Profile of Dick Oslund
The late Roy Kissell, magician, old carnie pal, and owner of the Fox Fun & Magic Shop in Detroit tipped the "tuck" method to me, sometime in the '70s. I always stopped to jackpot with him when I was near Detroit. He got it from June Horowitz, who got it from a young magician at a convention.

Plunk...some of the dealers, I believe, pull the core of kernmantel rope to cut shipping costs. I still have two spools of rope from the 'old' days, and, I use it cautiously. But, at 84, I'll probably have 1 1/2 spools left when I get the "big booking", and "blow" this show!
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
BeThePlunk
View Profile
Special user
West of Boston, East of Eden
888 Posts

Profile of BeThePlunk
Helpful background and instructive information as always, Dick. As a newbie at the tender age of 68, I haven't done much rope work yet, but I do find that the core-less stuff is super supple. I'll have to look around for the other variety of rope so I can compare. Any suppliers come to mind?
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Knots and loops » » Finishing the Ends of Rope (12 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2022 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.02 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL