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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Kevin Viner - Russian Roulette with Spike (5 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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DanielCardini
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Hi my friends.

I was looking at the master of illusion I think it was episode 09 when Kevin Viner did a trick I think is called - Russian Roulette with Spike
He have 4 cups and he put the spike inside one of the cups and then he turn around and when he is doing that one spectator can move around the cups and of course finally he smash one cup after another until the cup with the spike in it is the last one.

Does someone know where to find more info about this method or is it available somewhere to buy.
And whats your thought about this trick and the way he performed it.

Best Regards
//DC
jstreiff
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This has been discussed at length elsewhere in this forum; I suggest using the search function.

If you are a mentalist why would you do this? Put another way, is it credible that you would put your physical safety on the line night after night? If course if you are a magician, it is a given that you are performing a trick, which is another matter. Then of course there is the reality that people do get injured performing these effects as has happened several times in the recent past.

Just some things to consider.
John
MatthewSims
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I never liked this effect. It seems so transparent and fake to me. The question that you have to ask yourself is...

"What am I trying to prove or say by performing this."

Best,
Matthew
brehaut
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Quote:
On Mar 22, 2016, MatthewSims wrote:
I never liked this effect. It seems so transparent and fake to me. The question that you have to ask yourself is...

"What am I trying to prove or say by performing this."

Best,
Matthew



Well it's fake until it doesn't work and you end up in the ER
C.J.
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Quote:
On Mar 23, 2016, brehaut wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 22, 2016, MatthewSims wrote:
I never liked this effect. It seems so transparent and fake to me.

Well it's fake until it doesn't work and you end up in the ER


And there are many videos on YouTube showing it going wrong, so don't say it couldn't happen!

To the OP - searching just in Penny For Your Thoughts for "Russian Roulette" or "Smash and Stab" will bring up lots of past discussion on this topic. This should answer both of your questions.
Connor Jacobs - The Thought Sculptor
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Be fondly remembered.
mrmysticmike
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I believe that the Magic Castle has banned this type of effect during performances there.
Rook
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I've always enjoyed the Russian Roulette routines, but I've found that my audience typically responds better when I use eggs rather than spikes. As such, I get my best responses from Jimmy Fingers' Smashdown. Super easy, surprisingly effective, and much less expensive than many of the alternatives!
Those who don't believe in magic will never find it.

-Roald Dahl
DanielCardini
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Big Thanks to all of you my friends for answering me.
Jerskin
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This effect is now banned at the Magic Castle due to a recent accident.
GrEg oTtO

MUNDUS VULT DECIPI
E.E.
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I perform a smash and stab with only two cups as my opener in my show.

I know where the spike is. I'm looking right at it the whole time. No spectator upstage to mess around.

If a russian roulette routine doesn't fit that criteria, I wouldn't perform it at all.
That would be crazy. I don't get why people miss or fail the effect... If you are not %100 sure of what you are doing, you shouldn't be doing it.
I shall see you on the other side.
Sensio
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Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, E.E. wrote:
I perform a smash and stab with only two cups as my opener in my show.

I know where the spike is. I'm looking right at it the whole time. No spectator upstage to mess around.

If a russian roulette routine doesn't fit that criteria, I wouldn't perform it at all.
That would be crazy. I don't get why people miss or fail the effect... If you are not %100 sure of what you are doing, you shouldn't be doing it.


What is your feeling about how much people believe you really risk an injury based on your "powers"?
What kind of feedback you get but most importantly do you feel this urge to repeat it again and again?
Just curious, honestly.
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Matt Chalk
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Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, Sensio wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, E.E. wrote:
I perform a smash and stab with only two cups as my opener in my show.

I know where the spike is. I'm looking right at it the whole time. No spectator upstage to mess around.

If a russian roulette routine doesn't fit that criteria, I wouldn't perform it at all.
That would be crazy. I don't get why people miss or fail the effect... If you are not %100 sure of what you are doing, you shouldn't be doing it.


What is your feeling about how much people believe you really risk an injury based on your "powers"?
What kind of feedback you get but most importantly do you feel this urge to repeat it again and again?
Just curious, honestly.


Maybe he just likes performing the bloody effect?

People like Russian roulette. Let them perform it and ask questions without bombarding them with questions.
Demitri
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With Bob Cassidy no longer hear to address this, I felt it was necessary to point out that none of you are actually talking about Russian Roulette, but smash and stab (which a few have alluded to being synonymous - they're not). Russian Roulette uses a gun. Anything else isn't Russian Roulette...

As for effects to check out - there's Jon Allen's Pain Game, Randi Rain's Tetanus and T2 Sterile, and Wayne Dobson's Smash and Stab
E.E.
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Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, Sensio wrote:
Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, E.E. wrote:
I perform a smash and stab with only two cups as my opener in my show.

I know where the spike is. I'm looking right at it the whole time. No spectator upstage to mess around.

If a russian roulette routine doesn't fit that criteria, I wouldn't perform it at all.
That would be crazy. I don't get why people miss or fail the effect... If you are not %100 sure of what you are doing, you shouldn't be doing it.


What is your feeling about how much people believe you really risk an injury based on your "powers"?
What kind of feedback you get but most importantly do you feel this urge to repeat it again and again?
Just curious, honestly.


First of all, it's really funny.

My spectator choose one cup... only after they chose the cup I tell them there's a spike under one of the cups and that I will smash the cup they selected... "If a get hurt, it will all be your fault!" That line there kills Smile

After the routine I clarify: "You are probably wondering HOW you did it. What happened is that I mentally influenced you into choosing the cup I wanted you to choose! It's not that hard... %50 of the time works."


I don't really care if they go home thinking: "Well he wouldn't risk himself every night... it must be a trick"

It's just two cups, it's extremelly safe, it's quick, to the point, establishes my persona and my abilities, no one needs to go up stage, there's a lot of moments for fun and a couple of moments for suspense. AND, it's entertaining.

Those are the reasons why I perform this as my opener.
I shall see you on the other side.
Matt Chalk
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Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, Demitri wrote:
With Bob Cassidy no longer hear to address this, I felt it was necessary to point out that none of you are actually talking about Russian Roulette, but smash and stab (which a few have alluded to being synonymous - they're not). Russian Roulette uses a gun. Anything else isn't Russian Roulette...

As for effects to check out - there's Jon Allen's Pain Game, Randi Rain's Tetanus and T2 Sterile, and Wayne Dobson's Smash and Stab


Does it really matter? No real reason to nit pick
cheesewrestler
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Quote:
On Apr 28, 2016, Demitri wrote:
With Bob Cassidy no longer hear to address this, I felt it was necessary to point out that none of you are actually talking about Russian Roulette, but smash and stab (which a few have alluded to being synonymous - they're not). Russian Roulette uses a gun. Anything else isn't Russian Roulette...

As for effects to check out - there's Jon Allen's Pain Game, Randi Rain's Tetanus and T2 Sterile, and Wayne Dobson's Smash and Stab


Nobody cares about using the right names for effects any more.

There's a widely-discussed recent release that says it's a "card sword" and is being referred to in discussions as a "card sword". It consists of catching a selected card in a baseball cap.

Sword ... baseball cap ... no difference really ......
Demitri
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You're absolutely correct - there's no reason to nit pick. But something tells me, if my username was mastermindreader, you wouldn't have typed that response.

While I disagree with cheesewrestler about nobody caring about the right names for effects, he's free to feel that way. I suppose the real nature of my statement was lost (just a shout out to Bob, more than anything) - but I do think reminding the original poster that the effect he's looking for isn't russian roulette, might help him actually find what he's looking for.
brehaut
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Many times we Change reality and "lie" to help our effects. I have intentionally "misnamed" an effect to prevent a spectator from googling it. There are no rules. If someone wants to call it Russian roulette, I see no issue especially if it helps the performance
Demitri
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Again - my comment was only meant to help the original poster find the correct effect he was looking for. What he (or anyone) wants to call it during a performance is their choice.
Kevin Viner
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To the OP . . . thank you for your comments. I've PMed you some details of the effect (as the forum is publicly searchable). It worked great for me a number of years ago on Masters of Illusion, but I would now agree with the overall thoughts in this thread that it is a routine that doesn't seem to make much sense. There IS inherent danger in this method, and I don't know that it is worth the effect. Also, I feel like it creates one of two situations in the spectators' minds:

1) They believe that you are really at risk.

2) They dismiss it as a trick immediately and disregard it.

Neither outcome seems desirable. I don't want my audiences genuinely concerned for my safety, and I REALLY don't want them disregarding it as a "trick." Truthfully, I don't think that I would present it the same way currently if I decided to ever perform it again. It was a very direct effect with no presentation attached, but it wasn't bad for being 21 years old and my first national television appearance.
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