The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Interl8ced by Phill Smith (16 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3 [Next]
phillsmiff
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
1654 Posts

Profile of phillsmiff
It wasn't my intention to deceive anyone with the text on my site, although admittedly I didn't explain there what the method actually was, I haven't really done that with any of my releases. I certainly didn't realise that that would make anyone foam at the mouth. Everyone who has asked for more detail in pms here or on FB I'm happy to discuss it. That's the same with all my stuff, always has been. I'm not really about selling secrets and hype, at least it doesn't feel that way to me. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't much like being accused of deliberately tricking people.

I thought the original post was a little hyperbolic but I want happy customers and everybody expresses themselves differently so I highlighted the opportunity for a refund. No one else has asked for one, and all the messages I have got have been supportive and positive so I'm not terribly concerned.

Phill
-+: https://www.mythologycodex.com :+-

A collection of incredible jaw-dropping mentalism, now available.
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
Phill. The "foaming at the mouth" comment was just a figure of speech.

I did not ask for a refund, nor think to ask for one. You offered and I accepted, for the reasons I mentioned. I thank you for that.

You say "It wasn't my intention to deceive anyone with the text on my site, although admittedly I didn't explain there what the method actually was, I haven't really done that with any of my releases."

That the method was not revealed, wasn't the issue for me. The issue is that there just is no real description of what the effect really is. I mean this constructively. I've had messages from others who have the same thought about the ad copy on this. There is much published material on this method already and it's countless permutations. I feel that there is nothing new here and that part of the way you go about it takes a step backwards and not forwards.

I suppose what bothers me most, is that I do strongly feel this way and yet have enjoyed your previous works. I think you do yourself a disservice by not being more descriptive in the ad copy.

Sudo
bigjay1974
View Profile
New user
Worcestershire. UK
85 Posts

Profile of bigjay1974
Just purchased this and as with all of Phil's products I'm 100% happy, This method may have been used before but ive never come across it and for £15.00 I'm happy with the purchase. Ask yourself after shelling out much more than this on some dealers and getting a double back card with a post it pad and a page of typed instructions or maybe a paperclip that was stretched for twice the price of this (not naming any dealers but I'm sure you know who) I feel that 38 pages of instructions on how to adapt this method is worth it.

Phil don't let the haters get to you. Your buddy
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
I'm not a "hater."

Consider these book titles with ad copy by Jon Racherbaumer:

"Jonah Ploys" - This manuscript explores hybrids of the Jonah Card Principle. Beyond that it hopes to draw attention to this fascinating motif and perhaps inspire further research and development.

"Clockwork" - On the Clock Effect. The clock effect/principle is a variant of the automatic placement principle. It allows you to force a card. The procedure typically is that the spectator freely selects any full hour on the clock (1-12). Cards are then dealt into a clock pattern where one card takes the place of each hour. The card at the spectator's freely chosen hour is the force card, which for example could have been predicted beforehand. Jon describes in this ebook a number of the most important variants of this effect followed by a partial chronology of the effect.

"The Gemini Motif" - The Gemini Motif is an apparently fair-looking, semiautomatic dealing procedure that forces two, three, or four cards, depending on its application.

"Dreamwork" - Several decades ago Bob Hummer invented a new principle which caused a short-lived stir among cardicians. The effect was called "The Mindreader’s Dream". It sounds too good to be true: A spectator merely thinks of a card and performs a few, unseen dealing procedures with a deck of cards. The magician briefly scans the cards, consults a “dream book,” and then names the mentally selected card. Racherbaumer collects in this ebook several improvements and variations on this basic principle, including the original Hummer method.

"Criss-Crossings: Unleashing the X-Force" - This is an interesting study of the X-Force and variations thereof only the way Jon Racherbaumer can do it. The X-Force is the simplest force that every magician has learned to do at one point in their life. Jon dissects the X-Force or Criss-Cross Force and then puts it back together in different and new ways. This is fodder for those that want to go into the fine and nuanced details of performing this force.

Do you see what I'm getting at? There is no misunderstanding what you're purchasing when you read the ad-copy of the above ebooks. Each one clearly indicates that it is about the exploration of a principle and different applications for it. Naming the principle in play doesn't prevent one from purchasing it, but informs the purchaser. The ad copy also don't try to present each principle as something "new."

If I'm not interested in the "Cross Cut Force" and it's applications, then I won't buy an ebook about it. But if that's what the book is really about and you try to be deliberately ambiguous, then I am going to be upset when I do purchase it, and find out that this is what's it's about.

Is it wrong to expect clarity?
dmoses
View Profile
Inner circle
2187 Posts

Profile of dmoses
I bought it-- and my exchange rate must have been different than others because it only cost me rough $20.
I bought it knowing Phill's other work, including especially Quinta and Stegosaurus, and given the title I knew generally what I was in for.
Despite what others may feel, I thought the work made these (because there's more than one) principles useful, portable and impromptu.
I perform two other effects that make use of this principle-- but I've not put the work in to make it so versatile and easily applicable to create original effects.
It's the thinking that's elevated us out of card trick land into someplace fun and full of possibilities-- and yes, I see Leo Boudreau there too.
Some might think this is a step back (maybe because the relatively simple work performed without the usual built in crib) but I don't.

In fact, I prefer the versatility and potential theatricality of this principle presented here than much of the latest Liar/Truthteller routines making the rounds.

d
"You're a comedian. You wanna do mankind a service, tell funnier jokes."
TPR by Dave Moses and Iain Dunford
MadisonH
View Profile
Inner circle
1382 Posts

Profile of MadisonH
Quote:
On Aug 12, 2016, dmoses wrote:
I bought it-- and my exchange rate must have been different than others because it only cost me rough $20.


That's the best thing about "Brexit" it has raised the US $1 from £0.50 to £0.75 which makes the conversion rate cheaper.
MazingMandy
View Profile
Special user
Has tolerated the trolls here for
676 Posts

Profile of MazingMandy
Quote:
On Aug 12, 2016, MadisonH wrote:
Quote:
On Aug 12, 2016, dmoses wrote:
I bought it-- and my exchange rate must have been different than others because it only cost me rough $20.


That's the best thing about "Brexit" it has raised the US $1 from £0.50 to £0.75 which makes the conversion rate cheaper.


Glad to see someone is getting something out of brexit!
will4gzus
View Profile
Loyal user
285 Posts

Profile of will4gzus
I believe page 3 has a fatal typo error in the explanation, if you read it as written, it will never work. It actually presents an impossibility. I Also bought the Ebook Mokele, the website did not work for that download at all Smile
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
I thought so too, John. Smile
will4gzus
View Profile
Loyal user
285 Posts

Profile of will4gzus
Never mind the typo remark that was my mistake. Sorry Phil. But the Mokele download is still an issue
Sean Giles
View Profile
Inner circle
Cambridge/ UK
3727 Posts

Profile of Sean Giles
So what if Sudo didn't like it, surely that's his choice. Magicians are like whining children sometimes. He said he usually likes phils stuff but on this occasion didn't. So what, big deal. What you are doing here is discouraging people from speaking out when they don't like something. How is that any help at all.
phillsmiff
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
1654 Posts

Profile of phillsmiff
Hi guys, this is perhaps going off on a bit of a tangent. FWIW here's my take on it:

As far as I'm concerned the combination of the two methods in Interl8ced is unique to this work. Whilst the methods each have a published history, I developed the combination myself independently and I have never seen them used together this particular way. It’s entirely possible that the combination *has* been done before, but if it has, I haven’t seen it and none of the people I’ve shared this with have flagged it. If anyone has references that they feel would benefit the readers of the text as places to find out more, I will be happy to add them to the ebook and would welcome a PM with the details.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm not a purveyor of secrets, I haven't ever traded just on hype, and I absolutely don't go in for this weird marketing I see on here sometimes which kind of suggests that the product is in some way the real thing. What I do is use my knowledge and creativity to create tools that help my customers produce exciting and memorable moments for their audiences. Some of what I sell is methods, some of it is presentational ideas and scripts, and some of it is guidance on creativity and the philosophy of our art. Like a lot of my work Interl8ced contains a mix of these. This has, thus far, been well received so I don't feel I can be doing too much wrong.

Some people feel I have not been clear about the specific effect of Interl8ced: that was an omission of error rather than a deliberate manipulation. If you have read the text you will see that there are a huge range of performances possible, I didn't specify one because I didn't want to limit the appeal of the effect to people who only like close up card work, for example. Clearly some feel that was the wrong thing to do. Heard and understood.

So, first off: if you bought Interl8ced and you feel I have been deceptive in my marketing, if it's not what you expected, and you are unhappy with what you got, then I will offer a full refund. This isn't only my policy, this is the actual law, and it is true of any purchase you make from any magic creator.

Second: I will shortly be amending the text on the website to give a couple of different examples of the effects from the ebook. I won't post them here to save space but hopefully you will get the idea.

Ref. the debate about exposure on here, let me get in front of that too: Interl8ced is a system combining a fairly traditional card displacement principle with a simplified binary process. It doesn't require sleights or the memorisation and complex maths sometimes associated with binary material. Binary is a great method but it can be overwhelming. Focusing its application to the very specific system outlined in the book gives readers something to fully understand and which is extremely accessible and flexible. This is the same approach I took with Stegosaurus - take something powerful and create a framework that contains it and makes it more accessible.

In the case of Interl8ced, incorporating the card principle gave it a shape that is simple to grab hold of and which is easy to apply to your own effects more or less on the fly. I know a bunch of people who previously believed that they don't have the analytical mind to perform binary material but who can not only do so now with ease, but comfortably create their own bespoke effects using it with confidence. I'm proud of that and I stand by it. I don't mind saying this because revealing that Interl8ced uses these methods doesn't give anyone the ability to actually do the effects, they don't get access to the presentations or the extended material in the text without buying it which is where, I at least feel, much of the value lies.

I don't know if all of this is enough to convince anyone in particular that I'm not a shyster, but there it is. If anyone has any problems with this purchase or anything else they have got from me, email me at info@miscellaneousmiracles.co.uk and I will do what I can to rectify it. I think this is as open as I can be and I don't intend to get drawn into the semantics of every argument. Where there is a problem I will do my best to fix it.

Please don’t use this thread as a battlefield or an arena for personal grudges, if people have questions or suggestions let’s have that instead, we may be taking different routes but we are all climbing the same mountain.

Phill
-+: https://www.mythologycodex.com :+-

A collection of incredible jaw-dropping mentalism, now available.
NeilS
View Profile
Inner circle
2277 Posts

Profile of NeilS
Well said Phill.
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
Phill, I think that's a great summarization and I agree with your course of action here. It was 4:00am when I picked up the book. I was obviously tired and cranky and over-reacted a little in my initial posts. And for that, I apologize.

I wish I hadn't said anything at all now. Next time if I feel this strongly about something, I will just PM or email instead. Lesson learned.

Best of wishes.
Nicolino
View Profile
Inner circle
2862 Posts

Profile of Nicolino
Top class, gentlemen! Smile
The Mati Envelope
A brandnew peek device for the working mentalist!

Chance's Token
Tarot cards in a scenic piece of mystery.....
phillsmiff
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
1654 Posts

Profile of phillsmiff
Thanks guys. I'll need to sit down in a bit and pen the descriptions. My suggestion ref. the references wasn't idle, if anyone has any they think would be useful, about either principle even quite loosely connected, please send them over. I'm writing an appendix explaining how to do the effect over social media and when I update the file I'll add in what I can to clarify other sources of information about the principles so people who want to study more can chase them down.

Similarly if anyone has any presentational ideas or gambits they want to share I'd love to include those.

In the meantime have a great Sunday.

Phill
-+: https://www.mythologycodex.com :+-

A collection of incredible jaw-dropping mentalism, now available.
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
Please respect Phill's wishes jaizon. This thread has moved on and I will not respond to you any further than this comment.

@Phill: I have a worthwhile reference for you to check out for your appendix. It is the only routine of this nature that has found favour with me. Is it ok to email you with a small discussion about it? I also have some handling touches on your material in the book that you might find of interest.
phillsmiff
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
1654 Posts

Profile of phillsmiff
Sounds good, if you send it over to info@miscellaneousmiracles.co.uk I'll have a look.

Phill
-+: https://www.mythologycodex.com :+-

A collection of incredible jaw-dropping mentalism, now available.
Sudo Nimh
View Profile
Inner circle
1488 Posts

Profile of Sudo Nimh
Alright. Sounds good Phill. Smile
phillsmiff
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
1654 Posts

Profile of phillsmiff
For the curious I've updated the site now with a few descriptions of my favourite Interl8ced effects.

http://miscellaneousmiracles.co.uk/produ......d-ebook/

Phill
-+: https://www.mythologycodex.com :+-

A collection of incredible jaw-dropping mentalism, now available.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Interl8ced by Phill Smith (16 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3 [Next]
X
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.21 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL