The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Coaching (49 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..13~14~15~16~17..22~23~24 [Next]
charliecheckers
View Profile
Inner circle
1959 Posts

Profile of charliecheckers
Quote:
On Sep 7, 2017, RobertSmith wrote:
I can't even take this seriously anymore.


You are not alone by any means, and that is unfortunate. Not so much for the purposes of coaching, but more so just in the way people choose to participate here. Coming here without ego can do wonders for ones career advancement. When I first joined TMC, Tricky Business was filled with discussions that were varied and vibrant. People came here with novel marketing ideas looking for feedback, website critique advice, discussions on approaching various markets, marketing tools, work ethics,and so many other vibrant discussions. I took some time this weekend to go back and look at them. It was eye opening to see how many used to join in and offer opinions, advice, experience, concerns, warnings, motivation and such. In general (not always) there was a understanding we were not all on the same level with respect to our achievement, understanding, breadth and depth of experience. The idea that there were those contributing who had insights unique to themselves was not a foreign notion because many had experiences beyond operating as a solo performer. Yes there was disagreement, tension at times and a fair bit of non-sense, but it did not seem to dominate the pages the way it does today.

That was six years ago. In the past three or so years, the discussions have dwindled as have the number of individuals contributing and the discussion topics. We seem incapable of discussing ideas without counter personal attacks. This takes discussions well off course.
thomasR
View Profile
Special user
854 Posts

Profile of thomasR
"Coming here without ego can do wonders for ones career advancement."

Which is why some of us are constantly annoyed at mindpros ego. He just told us that he gave you advice that no one else on this forum could have given you. That's the biggest pile of BS I've read on this forum (and that's saying something).
cbguy
View Profile
Veteran user
350 Posts

Profile of cbguy
I literally came into this thread hoping for the best and being prepared for the worst. I read through every line, which spans over 15 pages and what I discovered is this thread had "NO" real advice or anything helpful, what-so-ever. What it does have is a bunch of gloating and it reads like an extra long Dave Dee, sales letter...all fluff and no meat.

Now, with that said, I do own Mindpro's three books and they are filled with good, useful information which has proven to be helpful to me, but...

The only person here, who didn't boast about themselves but rather actually offered "HELP" is Robert Smith...just saying!

A lot of insecurities and inflated ego's seem to monopolize this section of the Café...it's sad really!

I am thankful for the few people who I have become friends with on the Café. It's only a handful, but then again, there is likely just a few over a handful who are actual workers on here, these days anyway.
Mindpro
View Profile
Inner circle
9580 Posts

Profile of Mindpro
Quote:
On Sep 11, 2017, thomasR wrote:
"Coming here without ego can do wonders for ones career advancement."

Which is why some of us are constantly annoyed at mindpros ego. He just told us that he gave you advice that no one else on this forum could have given you. That's the biggest pile of BS I've read on this forum (and that's saying something).



Whoosh!

There is so much incorrect about his post.

Yes, it really is too bad.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
I don't have a dog in this fight either way so I really don't care.

What is interesting is how simply disagreeing with someone means automatically they have huge ego issues. Plus they are stupid. THAT is what takes over this section of the Café.

Nobody is allowed to have another viewpoint. Nobody is allowed to have another way to do things. Everyone has to whip it out and measure.

I don't think Mike will be very successful with Simple Simon. Does it matter? NO! He has his plan, he is a pro, I respect that. Not hard to do really.

I have been wrong before, and will be again. It doesn't matter. Even if I disagree I wish him the best and if I can help I will. All that is important is he experiences success. Not whether my opinion is right or wrong.

That is only one example.

You guys get back to measuring now.

As for a coach sure the right one can help.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
View Profile
Inner circle
9580 Posts

Profile of Mindpro
Quote:
On Sep 11, 2017, Dannydoyle wrote:
I don't have a dog in this fight either way so I really don't care.


That's the point, it shouldn't be a fight. It doesn't have to be this way. Someone posted on a topic they were interested in and creating a discussion about. Some come here intentionally looking for stir things up or to push a fight. I've never understood why people post if the topic isn't applicable to them or they have nothing to add other than opinion. Especially here in Tricky Business.
cbguy
View Profile
Veteran user
350 Posts

Profile of cbguy
LOL... I like the dig! It was put in there casually. Mike has done really good as Mike for 15 years and things got better for Mike once Simple Simon came along and at this point, the futures so bright, he's gotta wear shades.

BTW, I want to make it clear that Davis was helpful as well...and he did not boast either. Just wanted to clarify that.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Quote:
On Sep 11, 2017, cbguy wrote:
LOL... I like the dig! It was put in there casually. Mike has done really good as Mike for 15 years and things got better for Mike once Simple Simon came along and at this point, the futures so bright, he's gotta wear shades.

BTW, I want to make it clear that Davis was helpful as well...and he did not boast either. Just wanted to clarify that.


No dig. If anything it is a dig at ME! Not seeing what you see and me being wrong. Please read what I wrote again.

No dig at Mike because I know first hand where you came from. How could I possibly say that was not success?

No need to be defensive. Please accept my apology.

I will HAPPILY be wrong! As I said I want nothing but success for you.

Which brings us to another problem here is the miss reading of posts.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
View Profile
Inner circle
9580 Posts

Profile of Mindpro
As I said, it's amazing how things are taken as one chooses rather than what is truly offered and intended. What amazes me how how Danny & I both were trying to assist you Mike and speak up on your behalf. I think you are taking several things wrongly. The whole reason after months I spoke up against Robert is because there are some here who didn't want to see you get misdirected, misinformed and lose, time, effort, the great deal of money you are putting into play, and trust. I think this is obvious by how we've tried to be helpful and present you with a bigger picture and understanding both here and via PMs. If you choose not to heed the information being offered that is one thing and totally up to you, but to state anything other than that by those trying to help you seems quite wrong.

I have also re-read this entire thread and there is certainly some VERY useful and helpful info here. If you chose not to see or accept it, that does not mean it doesn't exist.

Seems most here are routing for you.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
I will say one thing.

The "idea" of having information that ONLY can be gleaned from ONE person on the planet is a little hard to swallow. It is a MAJOR claim to back up.

While I know exactly what you are trying to say, I am not certain those were the best words to express the sentiment.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
One more thing to say, just so it is said.

Having an opinion on whether something will or not work and to what degree it will work is fine. We all have that and all discuss it and cool.

BUT don't let ANYONE tell you not to follow your heart. Even if you are wrong, find it out for YOURSELF! You are not living "my dream" you are living YOURS! I can have any opinion I want and it should mean NOTHING to you as to if you pursue it. Please NOBODY interpret anything I say as not thinking you should move forward.

If someone looked at me 30 years ago and I had listened to the MANY who told me I was nuts I would be wanting to hang myself. I have had failures along the way and made serious mistakes. But not bad considering at a couple points I wasn't even supposed to be alive.

Reality will seep in at it's own pace. If we don't try, and don't make small mistakes, we are destined to make really huge ones. Don't be afraid to try. It is the only way we learn. I applaud Mike for having the courage to try. Often it is only that courage that will separate success from mediocrity.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
View Profile
Inner circle
Hattiesburg, Ms
2662 Posts

Profile of TomBoleware
I have always said that forums such as this are a place for opinions; books and one on one discussion is where you get your facts.

Still, a variety of ‘opinions’ can be good for those looking to weight the options. Some like choices so they can make up their own mind. You can’t force advice on people anyway, besides, it’s a lot like William Arthur Ward said; “The mediocre teacher tells. The good teacher explains. The superior teacher demonstrates. The great teacher inspires.”

So if you really want to help someone, inspire them to find the answers on their own. Don’t just insist that your way is the only way or insist on you getting the credit for their success.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Mindpro
View Profile
Inner circle
9580 Posts

Profile of Mindpro
Wow, things are really being taken way off course. Thomasr's post was simply offered incorrect information. First, I never once said I gave charliecheckers any advice. I have not spoken to eevn posted/PM's an exchange with him since last year I believe. So this is incorrect.

Secondly, there was no ego involved here at all. If anything it was just the opposite. It was a humbled moment I choose to share for the benefit of the topic. Up to this point Cafécheckers had been writing about his experience in coaching as his interests in others experience on the topic. Much was shared from his perspective as a student/client and the why, how and benefits he has received. Since some were still struggling with understanding the coaching topic, I though I would share a glimpse from the other inside perspective, from the coach's perspective. I offered what was a very impactful moment that happened. It was a beautiful thing as it also showed the type of thing he gets from coaching he feels he couldn't get anyhere else. It was they type of thing that makes the coaching relationship so special and most of all beneficial.

It was also content he couldn't have received anywhere else and he identified that and his appreciation for it in his sentiments. As with the vast majority of what I teach, train and share in my coaching, it is not content available or published elsewhere. This has nothing to to do with ego, but simply a fact which was also recognized in the moment by the student. I'm not sure how this is seen as ego from either of us, and why it is being taken out of content and rubs others the wrong way.

There is a difference between ego and confidence based on experience, pride and fact.

Same for above, charliecheckers made some great observations which he chose to share here. He made some very real and true points in that post regarding the current state of Tricky Business (similar to what WDavis did a few months ago in an attempt to try to get TB back to its former place). Points that have changed the tone, progress and benefits of the Tricky Business section. As many of us here we take great pride in this forum and its contents and progress. I see no need for the type of activity, agendas, bias and negativity created by some members here (usually only 4-5 people), twisting the context and content of whats being said, not even attempting to understand the information that is being offered and shared, and then offering opinion-based posts and attacks based on the these twisted and self-generated misperception and understandings.

Its happening regularly. Threads and posts that could be so productive and beneficial being derailed into this path of negativity and agenda. I know its keeping people away because they then PM me with content and questions that should be part of the forum, but are afraid to post or be ridiculed.

If you don't care for a topic or even someone's insight or contributions, great, then don't read their posts. I do it, others do it and all is fine. But to feel the need to complain, create perceptions that have never been offered, to change context and to twist things to your own beliefs and benefit is actually the exact opposite of the benefit of this forum.

As I said, it amazes me how someone can take a very simple but great moment that was trying to be shared for everyone's benefit, and twist it into something negative with completely different meaning. Its sad and this all really needs to stop.
charliecheckers
View Profile
Inner circle
1959 Posts

Profile of charliecheckers
Quote:
On Sep 11, 2017, cbguy wrote:
I literally came into this thread hoping for the best and being prepared for the worst. I read through every line, which spans over 15 pages and what I discovered is this thread had "NO" real advice or anything helpful, what-so-ever. What it does have is a bunch of gloating and it reads like an extra long Dave Dee, sales letter...all fluff and no meat.

Here is an excerpt from a post from Mindpro from page three, where he shared in great detail all the things to consider when considering to seek a coach as well as his personal approach.
Quote:
Many come to get a far greater understanding of the business of live entertainment. How to scale and grow your business other than by just booking more gigs. They quickly realize entertainment business is far different from conventional business. Some want to learn the many different facets of the business. "How do I go into an elementary school and earn $2500-$3500 a show? Do I give them the quick answer? No. I educate and teach them about the educational market in every facet so when they get the answer they know and fully understand all of the whys, when, who, what and hows. More than just giving them what they think they need. More times than not what they think they need and what they are really asking for are very different things.

This post was very on topic and informative to those who wonder what coaching can offer. It also was likely eye opening to some to realize there is a lot to consider when running ones own business.This paragraph alone should have informed you that he was not a match for the type of help you seek, which in itself is informative. It could have saved you (and him) the trouble of pm's and such.

Quote:
Now, with that said, I do own Mindpro's three books and they are filled with good, useful information which has proven to be helpful to me, but...

With all the negative attention to Mindpro, interestingly, I never see anyone criticizing his advice. The fact that you are a big enough person to add this statement to your post speaks really well of you.

Quote:
The only person here, who didn't boast about themselves but rather actually offered "HELP" is Robert Smith...just saying!


Given your situation and belief in yourself, Robert seems like someone who can give you a leg up.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Quote:
On Sep 12, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:
I have always said that forums such as this are a place for opinions; books and one on one discussion is where you get your facts.

Still, a variety of ‘opinions’ can be good for those looking to weight the options. Some like choices so they can make up their own mind. You can’t force advice on people anyway, besides, it’s a lot like William Arthur Ward said; “The mediocre teacher tells. The good teacher explains. The superior teacher demonstrates. The great teacher inspires.”

So if you really want to help someone, inspire them to find the answers on their own. Don’t just insist that your way is the only way or insist on you getting the credit for their success.

Tom


I don't mind opinions. I don't mind other opinions contrary to mine.

Where I go down a different road is when opinion is offered based on no experience. When that happens it gets bad.

Also I don't like it when people offer uninformed opinion as if it were fact, or 40 year old opinion that wasn't even valid then and try to tell someone that they can implement it and it costs them money. This happens way too often here on this board. I get too many PMs from people who tried things they are told and lose big. It is one thing to inspire and encourage and it is another to cost someone real money in real life. Then they are too embarrassed to come on here and explain that they failed. Then the same who encouraged them in the first place tell them to keep going and going and losing more and more. It is a spiral and for some a very bad one.

Which is the most sad part. Failure here is looked at as something to be embarrassed about and not something to learn from. What happens when people fail here they slink away into the woods and don't post. If they do post again they almost never claim they failed or didn't meet expectations. Everyone is a huge success from day one. How ridiculous. Heck every time I sit with Bannachek, Todd Robbins, Docc Hillford, Bob Sheets and so forth all we DO is tell stories about how this or that went wrong! It would seem we are the biggest failures on the planet.

Have you ever seen a thread here where someone says they tried this and it didn't work but I learned X? Of course not. Which is sad. Ask me about Key Largo! They were staying away in droves! I wanted to hire a bouncer to throw people INTO the place. Anyone think I didn't work in Branson because the bank wasn't big enough to hold all my money? I have mentioned these failures and others before. I embrace them and learn from them.

And I am not talking about being encouraging "through" failure but learning FROM failure. If you want to coach or teach someone then prepare them for life. Life is not all success and it is how we deal with not succeeding that makes us who we are. How do we deal with hitting a plateau? How do you push past and get more than is given? These are the things in my view a coach should be doing. Not helping with your specific business.

I know almost nothing that nobody else does. But I don't need to in order to teach someone to be realistic and how to push that reality further than most think it should go. I would never hire a coach for a business plan. I would hire one to move me to do the best with that plan I could. I would be suspicious of a coach who thought he knew everything about everyone's business anyhow.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
cbguy
View Profile
Veteran user
350 Posts

Profile of cbguy
I can certainly admit to failures...There have been plenty and without them, I wouldn't be where I am today.

...and since I mentioned the subject of help. I can count the people who have been helpful over the years on one hand.

Here is a list:

1. Bob Brown
2. Celeste (Evans) Bryene
3. Jimmy Kryszac (I know I spelled his last name wrong, but he would just make a joke about it)
4. Don Driver
5. Robert Smith

One of the things I've learned from my failures is what to look for in someone that is trustworthy and truly helpful. Two key features that everyone on my list have in common is they all displayed humbleness and gratitude. I'm not saying anything negative about anyone who has contributed here. What I am saying is in Robert, I see the attributes that I also seen in the first four people on the list above. That instantly gets my respect and attention.
TomBoleware
View Profile
Inner circle
Hattiesburg, Ms
2662 Posts

Profile of TomBoleware
Danny, it is a FACT you don’t respect anybody’s opinion that doesn’t agree with your own, if you did then you would never start with the crap about their ‘uninformed’ opinion. You have proven it over and over, so please don’t pretend you haven’t, and that your not known as the master attacker here. You love attacking those that don't agree with you, period.


Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Quote:
On Sep 12, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:
Danny, it is a FACT you don’t respect anybody’s opinion that doesn’t agree with your own, if you did then you would never start with the crap about their ‘uninformed’ opinion. You have proven it over and over, so please don’t pretend you haven’t, and that your not known as the master attacker here. You love attacking those that don't agree with you, period.


Tom


From the #1 uninformed opinion in the world.

The only FACT is your opinion I do not respect in the least.

I disagree with Robert on occasion and respect his opinion. Why? Because he is out there ACTUALLY DOING IT! Same with Mike. Unlike you.

And by the way YOU made this an attack. I never mentioned you until you attacked me and told lies. Go figure.

Go get some experience and we can talk about it.

Canyou please stop attacking me? You claim it is what I do while you are doing it. Please stop. It is a FACT you just came at me for no reason. No need. Just stop please.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
View Profile
Inner circle
Hattiesburg, Ms
2662 Posts

Profile of TomBoleware
Danny, you just got through saying above, “I don't mind opinions. I don't mind other opinions contrary to mine.” So please go back and change that.

And yes you were including me, you constantly do and you ALWAYS question whatever I say. Makes no difference what it is. I recommend Robert here to Mike and you didn’t like that. As for as my experience, I have explained it several times in detail how I have more than fifty years experience in some form of magic. I have performed as a professional and a part-timer, I owned a magic shop for ten years, I founded a long running magic club, I have taught magic lessons, and I have a book on magic, sold a copy yesterday and received a great comment on it today. I have been involved in magic in one way or the other nearly all my life. Not to mention that I have more business experience in a wide variety of businesses than you can imagine. I have made millions in business, but unlike some I don't come here to brag about what all I have done.

Now does that make me as good as you in magic, no of course it doesn’t, but my opinion should still be allowed here without having to hear how you don't like it. It would be easy for you to not to respond to every thing I say, but you can't do it. You just can't.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19770 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Who is attacking again? I did not mention you in my post Tom. Sorry the world does not revolve around you.

I also recommend Robert. How can you say I don't like that? Are you feeling ok?

You don't come here to brag about what you have done, yet you can't stop talking about what you supposedly have done.

Your made up experience means little to nothing.

Can you please stop attacking and making up lies? This thread has nothing to do with you. Hard for you to imagine but true.

It seems as if YOU are the one who has trouble not responding. But you are irony impaired I guess.
Watch you respond now. It will be funny.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Coaching (49 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..13~14~15~16~17..22~23~24 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2019 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.23 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL