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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » After Dark by Matt Johnson (14 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Deano88
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Does anyone know if this is any different to Jamie Daws Seer envelopes , obviously after dark implements the dark arts principle on top of the envelope
Mickael
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Hi Matt !

I just watch your demo video and it is just whaou ! What kind of idea have you imagine to realize this miracle !?
It seems so clean that it seems impossible. I watch the explanation video because I can't wait to know ! And just whaou it is crazy that anybody though about that ! It is so easy clever and clean then I want to perform it directly. I love create and manufacture gimmicks but I confess I will never imagine something like that.
I know your work and I knew you have a strange brain ! But now I am sure you are just different !
This trick takes place directly into my close up set.
You want something new, you want something clever so go go go it is so good !

Mickael Chatelain
Karl M
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Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, Deano88 wrote:
Does anyone know if this is any different to Jamie Daws Seer envelopes , obviously after dark implements the dark arts principle on top of the envelope

I allready did the comparison of them mate
Kaliix
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So Dark Arts worked fine and has stellar rating on Penguin. It was a cool box deal for $5 and then was regularly priced at $9.95. So if After Dark is only an improvement to the envelope portion of Dark Arts, and only touches on the performing aspects and subtleties, how is it double the price? I'm sure the improved envelope is great, but twice the price of the original for a slightly cleaner handling of the envelope, (it sounds like) no additional routines and you have to make your own props?

Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, videoman wrote:
Quote:
On Jul 10, 2017, ash2arani wrote:
Does the original, Dark Arts, have any advantage over After Dark? In other words, if I own After Dark, is there any reason to get the Dark Arts download?


Dark Arts covers much more of the performing aspects and subtleties. Although After Dark touches on some of that, it primarily covers the construction and specific handling of Matt's new envelope. It seems to be assumed that you are familiar with the original.

If you have experience with mentalism you probably don't really need Dark Arts, if not you should get both.
But of course any serious performer knows that even gaining one small tip that you may not have thought of on your own is well worth the cost. Besides the obvious fact of not having to reinvent the wheel.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel J. Boorstin
videoman
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Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, Kaliix wrote:
So Dark Arts worked fine and has stellar rating on Penguin. It was a cool box deal for $5 and then was regularly priced at $9.95. So if After Dark is only an improvement to the envelope portion of Dark Arts, and only touches on the performing aspects and subtleties, how is it double the price? I'm sure the improved envelope is great, but twice the price of the original for a slightly cleaner handling of the envelope, (it sounds like) no additional routines and you have to make your own props?



Just look at it as 30 bucks for the whole enchilada. Or look at it as Dark Arts is a real bargain.
Trying to break it down and compare what you get for how much will only cause grief and frustration and shorten your life.
It ain't worth worrying about.
Relick666
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Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, videoman wrote:
Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, Kaliix wrote:
So Dark Arts worked fine and has stellar rating on Penguin. It was a cool box deal for $5 and then was regularly priced at $9.95. So if After Dark is only an improvement to the envelope portion of Dark Arts, and only touches on the performing aspects and subtleties, how is it double the price? I'm sure the improved envelope is great, but twice the price of the original for a slightly cleaner handling of the envelope, (it sounds like) no additional routines and you have to make your own props?



Just look at it as 30 bucks for the whole enchilada. Or look at it as Dark Arts is a real bargain.
Trying to break it down and compare what you get for how much will only cause grief and frustration and shorten your life.
It ain't worth worrying about.


Haha shorten your life. Lol.

I guess it's a valid question, as usual price point is very relative.

My philosophy is that if you can afford something and you're sure you will use it then go for it.

If you're already comfortable doing it in some other manner, unless it's a great improvement you're getting, it needs to be considered. Really depends on what you're looking for.


Andreu
252life
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Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, videoman wrote:
Quote:
On Jul 11, 2017, Kaliix wrote:
So Dark Arts worked fine and has stellar rating on Penguin. It was a cool box deal for $5 and then was regularly priced at $9.95. So if After Dark is only an improvement to the envelope portion of Dark Arts, and only touches on the performing aspects and subtleties, how is it double the price? I'm sure the improved envelope is great, but twice the price of the original for a slightly cleaner handling of the envelope, (it sounds like) no additional routines and you have to make your own props?



Just look at it as 30 bucks for the whole enchilada. Or look at it as Dark Arts is a real bargain.
Trying to break it down and compare what you get for how much will only cause grief and frustration and shorten your life.
It ain't worth worrying about.



lmao love that.

Anyway, I have both releases, DA and AD. (And now, I feel like I have ADHD. But I digress..)
I'd recommend both. And I can't find any fault with the pricing, I feel it's very fair.
Also, I really appreciate Matt.
His sincerity and pride in what he does shows.
Great releases, instruction, quality, price, etc, et-effin-cetera Smile
Not much there to complain about in my book.


252Book'emDano
Look for all the world like you're counting the brain cells in his cranium.

-Theodore Annemann
matthewjohnson
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I am truly overwhelmed with all of the amazing feedback to After Dark. As a creator and full time performer I always strive to only release material that I believe in 100%. It can be hard when you release something after years of work only for it to not be received well by the magic community.

Thank you to each and every one of you for putting your faith in me and my work. It means a lot.

MJ
Tmayer
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After dark is pretty good but I have to say the method is exactly what I thought. The only reason I bought it was because of the handling in the trailer. To people watching the trailer thinking that's exactly how it looks when you perform will be sadly wrong as I was. Im pretty sure hes just using a completely regular envelope in the trailer.

The instruction in the video is pretty good but he spent a lot more time on creation of the envelope than performance and subtleties.

All in all this is a great tool and I don't feel I wasted my money but I did feel slightly deceived by the advertising.

TM
matthewjohnson
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Hi Tmayer,

Thanks for your post.

The envelope I am using in the trailer is the After Dark envelope. As the camera is a fixed point I wanted to make sure that I gave you (the viewer) a fair representation of how this plays in the real world without compromising the secret as that is what you pay for. I feel that everything you get in the download accomplishes the effect I explain perfectly and does it in a very clever and subtle way. I also feel that the demo is a fair representation of how the effect plays in the real world. Too many demos don't do that and when you get the secret you end up disappointed. I believe 100% that anyone getting this download will be pleasantly surprised and very happy with not only the method but all of it's subtle nuances Smile

This is a tool not a trick. It is a tool with which you can accomplish great mentalism. At it's core anything written on a business card and placed inside the opaque cardboard envelope is viewable to you. I do touch on many ideas that you can use this for, offer these suggestions for routines and give a number of templates for the various routine ideas. You can do this right out of the download once you spend a few minutes printing and making up the envelope. How deep you want the routine to be after that is (in my opinion) up to each performers individuality. That is what is wrong with the world of products and downloads today (again in my opinion). Too many products are 1 trick ponies, that is to say you get that 1 trick in it's entirety with all the patter and moves and that is all you can do with it.

After Dark is certainly not that! I am not even trying to sell you refills. You are getting the whole enchilada Smile Once you have purchased it, it's yours to keep and you can make as many of the envelopes as you wish, forever. Any time you need to peek information or have the power of x-ray vision for a routine After Dark will be at your disposal Smile

Tmayer, I am really glad you like it, I am sorry it's exactly what you thought. You are correct, it is a GREAT tool and I am happy to hear you did not waste your money. The design of the envelope and the thought process behind it was not rushed. It took 4 years to get to the point of purchase. Now it's up to you to do your thing and perform the miracles Smile

Best,

MJ
Nicolino
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Quote:
On Jul 10, 2017, Lseeyou wrote:
Quote:
On Jul 10, 2017, Prager wrote:
How is it different from Dr. Jaks envelope?


They are different, CIA envelope needs flap inside to begin and you cant show both sides.

LOL, you must be kidding with your flap comment! Smile The only difference is whether it's fixed or loose.
And as soon as you draw an odd picture on the outside you can show the CIA equally from both sides.
So Prager surely has a point here.
The Mati Envelope
A brandnew peek device for the working mentalist!

Chance's Token
Tarot cards in a scenic piece of mystery.....
Lseeyou
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Nicolino, I'm sure you don't have trickshop.com CIA envelope PDF because if you had it like I have... you wouldn't write that silly comment.

Quote:
Have the spectator remove the card. This will allow the person to see the interior of the envelope; which appears normal in every respect, since the folded in flap conceals the top edge of the divider.


I never understand why some of you guys talk with so much confidence when you really don't know what you are talking about.

#ThinkBeforeWriting
Nicolino
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No, of course I don't have it. But I don't have After Dark either. Hence I thought that qualified for a fair comparison.
And where's the fun, after all? Smile

Seriously, I apologize for wasting your time. But I stand to my opinion. Smile
The Mati Envelope
A brandnew peek device for the working mentalist!

Chance's Token
Tarot cards in a scenic piece of mystery.....
Lseeyou
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Yes I wasted my time with you and everyone will waste their time while scrolling through the content of this page to find that your comment, if they ever find out that what you wrote is completely based on a fantasy/lie... just because you want to have fun.

That must be very funny... only for you.

#WhyImWastingTimeWritingThis
matthewjohnson
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The reviews are coming in for After Dark over at Penguin Magic. All 5-Stars Smile People are loving this which makes me happy. I want people to be satisfied with my work and use it. I know you will use this and love the method.

You can check out the reviews at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/8643

Cheers,

MJ
makulit974
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I got this because I really love DA and use it at all my gigs. I was really looking forward to the "improved" version. But personally, I don't think I will use it.
What I really liked about Dark Arts is that I could give the envelope to the spectators and ask them to check it and take out the cards themselves.
To me, this really sells the fact that the envelope is normal. I feel that this new "improvement" does not add anything. With Dark Arts, you start clean and you end clean.

This is just my thoughts of course. After Dark is great and if Dark Arts didn't exist, I'd perform it...

For those thinking of getting this, I suggested getting DA and AD. Both are great releases and they complement each other!

Patrick
videoman
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Patrick, I don't follow you. Why can't you do the same routine you currently do but replace your current envelope with the new one?

Starting clean is easy because there is such a natural opportunity to switch in the gaffed envelope.
Ending clean is typically a little more suspicious, but still nothing that any specs ever seem to zero in on. Probably because they are convinced the envelope is harmless by that point anyway.
makulit974
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Quote:
On Jul 14, 2017, videoman wrote:
Patrick, I don't follow you. Why can't you do the same routine you currently do but replace your current envelope with the new one?

Starting clean is easy because there is such a natural opportunity to switch in the gaffed envelope.
Ending clean is typically a little more suspicious, but still nothing that any specs ever seem to zero in on. Probably because they are convinced the envelope is harmless by that point anyway.


Hi Bill,
Because I like to give them the envelope and ask them to take out my business cards from the envelope. I can't give them the After Dark envelope. To be honest, I don't really need to end clean. I usually take out the card from the envelope and I end there. I only end clean when I want to give them the envelope.
In short, with DA, they can HANDLE the envelope freely at first and this is what I like. As you pointed out, I could achieve that with AD but to be honest it would defeat the purpose of using it because I believe the strength of AD lies in the fact that you can SHOW the envelop to be normal and do the whole routine with that same envelope.
But I don't want to show, I want them to see it for themselves. Both envelopes achieve the same thing, but I'd rather have to switch so I can have them touch it...
videoman
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Thanks for clarifying. I do see your point now.
Personally, I like them to freely handle the envelope in the beginning, remove the cards, verify it's opaque, etc.
Then when they place their card inside I hold the envelope for them, BUT I still like to be able to show the envelope on both sides and handle it very freely.
That is why to be honest, I still prefer to use my own style of envelope which I'm sure is probably based on an envelope developed a century ago. I have not seen it before but I'm certainly no history expert and I'm not naive enough to believe I have developed anything new.
252life
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Here's a mildly funny aside I noticed (about myself) recently.
It just maybe qualifies as being on topic...

When I was new to mentalism, I was so precise making up tools like this.
I'd measure and carefully cut, etc.
Yesterday, I caught myself using a pocket knife to quickly throw together a few DA envelopes.
(I'd been performing all day and got bored. Which was the perfect time to mud test Proteus btw Smile )

Funny how little (prop wise) we really need to entertain a group.

252UsualRamblings
Look for all the world like you're counting the brain cells in his cranium.

-Theodore Annemann
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