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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Jeff Busby Paul Fox Cups (3 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Sidney A. Salmans
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A while back I managed to acquire a set of Jeff Busby Paul Fox Cups - this set was hallmarked on the inside and each weighed about 6 ounce each. Just a little while ago, I won a set of Charlie Miller Cups (that came from the Chicago Magic Co.), but first they sent me the wrong cups - they were a set of Jeff Busby Paul Fox Cups. This set came in a hallmarked bag, but the cups, although a nice set, they were not hallmarked, and they weighed only somewhat over 4 ounce each. Does anyone know if Jeff Busby made a set like that - light and not hallmarked? I am not familiar with the history of Jeff Busby productions.
Tom G
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Possibly RNTII? Oh, Mad Jake...
Leo H
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When Busby acquired the rights from Danny Dew in the early 1980s to sell the Paul Fox cups, he also picked up the remainder of the Danny Dew/Paul Fox sets that Dew still had in his inventory. Busby hallmarked those cups and sold them as the first round of his Paul Fox cups until his spinner could begin turning in the new sets, which were heavier. Original PF/DD were made in .40 copper, slightly thinner than Busby's cups or the later Mad Jake PF cups.

So to answer your question Syd, what arrived in the mail by mistake is most likely a set of original PF/DD cups, which are lighter and were not hallmarked by Dew. This was a set that Busby must have kept for himself. You must have won this in last months Jeff Busby Potter auction.
Sidney A. Salmans
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Right, it was the Potter auction, but I actually won the set of Charlie Miller cups, and they sent me the Paul Fox cups by mistake, which I sent back to them, so that they could send me the correct item. Thanks. That explains why they cups were constructed as they were.
Tom G
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The thing that makes me wonder is the hallmarked bag. I bought a set of PF cups from Busby and there was no bag. I "think" RNTII had hallmarked bags.
Mobius303
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RNT Sells the bags separately and he could have obtained them to keep the cups in.
Sidney A. Salmans
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It was hallmarked with Jeff Busby's name.
Tom G
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Well, never knew that Busby had bags made.
Mad Jake
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I know the cups you're talking about and the person you got them from. Those were a set spun by Danny Dew for Jeff Busby when Danny gave him the tooling., that is why there was no hallmark in the cups.
Original DD/PF cups were spun from 040 copper. They were light, and the beads were not tight for a reason, Danny had cups plated. Going through my dad's journals, Rings N' Things did a run for Danny..
It was suppose to be 100 sets. But it's noted in his journal from a reliable source that worked for Rings N' Things that more PF/DD cups spun by the original Rings N' Things sold more out the back door than
they actually made for Danny, *** shame.

My father's version of the PF cup was touted by Bill Palmer as the closet anyone ever got to getting them right. He closed the beads and made them out of 050 copper as not to confuse collectors. He always
changed something on cups he did from the. past so collectors' could tell the difference. His cups all shipped in the PF monogramed bag.

They had a lot of tooling for sale at an auction, my sister won the original DD/PF steel tooling. There was a rumor that the tooling was damaged. My sister had it X-rayed at Virginia Tech and magna fluxed,
a fair estimate, would. say about 5K more cups in 040 can be spun spun on them. Everything is intact.

Some one walked away with the Chick cup tooling for a song, I think it was 550.00. I was only after 2 things, the John Dahm wooden cups and chop cup Smile

I have quite a few of those bags, they were used for not only PF cuss, but other custom made items by Busby as well. It was a multi facet bag.
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
Rainboguy
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I bought a set of the Busby Hallmarked Paul Fox cups two years ago from Denny Haney while I was in Baltimore. They are brass, and hallmarked PF with the "P" reversed.

I am not sure if they were spun by Danny Dew or someone else, but they were $750, and, to me were/are worth the price to a collector. I assume that our friend Bill Palmer would know more about the rarity and value of these cups.

Growing up in St. Louis in the 50's and 60's, Rings N' Things props were pretty prevalent there at the time. My first set of Rings were from Rings N Things.
Mad Jake
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Actually the cups your have are Busby PF cuss if they they have the pf stamp in them.
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
Leo H
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Quote:
On Sep 3, 2017, Mad Jake wrote:
Actually the cups your have are Busby PF cuss if they they have the pf stamp in them.


That's true but I understand that Busby stamped the remainder of Dew's inventory of cups that he acquired and sold them as his Busby PF cups. These were among the first PF cups he began to sell.
Tom G
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I bought a set direct from Busby, I think $198 for the copper.
Leo H
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Quote:
On Sep 3, 2017, Tom G wrote:
I bought a set direct from Busby, I think $198 for the copper.


The first thing Busby did after acquiring the rights to the PF line was to raise the prices of the cups. Dew had been selling them for about $40.00 a set.
Pete Biro
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SADLY, BUSBY SCREWED DANNY BY NOT PAYING HIM.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Rainboguy
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Pete:

Busby, and a few other Magicians whom I will not mention here, screwed THEMSELVES over by their reputations for treating other magicians badly: Namely, by taking money and not delivering.

Busby's great undoing was his hyped Braue Chronicles fiasco........I still have his original sell sheet.

The world of Magic that we all live in is a LOT smaller on the inside looking out than on the outside looking in, and, at the end of the day, all you really have is your personal reputation....and trust me....bad news gets around fast........

When you lose your reputation.....you've lost everything..............
Mad Jake
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There is a set on the big auction site right now, he wants 1500.00 for the. Problem is they are NOT Busby cups. My father had 2 hallmark tools for PF cups and only stamped certain ones, this is one of them and even has all the RNT2 bag, tag etc. Dad's hallmark tool was slightly larger than Jeff's. The seller was made aware of this but still continues to run the ad.

Jake Jr.
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
Leo H
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Thanks for that heads up Jake. Even if this set really came from Busby, he wants too much for them. The Busby copper sets have sold for about $500 to $600 on the auction market. He apparently doesn't have the original bill of sale from Busby.
Rainboguy
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Potter and Potter is selling a set of Mike Roger's Jeff Busby Paul Fox Cups for $1,500. I bet that's where the guy who posted his set on the big auction site came up with the price.

As always, BUYER BEWARE!
Leo H
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Quote:
On Sep 24, 2017, Rainboguy wrote:
Potter and Potter is selling a set of Mike Roger's Jeff Busby Paul Fox Cups for $1,500. I bet that's where the guy who posted his set on the big auction site came up with the price.

As always, BUYER BEWARE!


Those Mike Rogers/Busby cups on that Potter website are the rarer stainless steel sets that Busby had specially machined. The last set sold at a previous Potter auction for about $900. Genuine copper Busby cups are currently going for about $500-$600 on the market
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