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Titanas V.I.P. 1995 Posts |
I just wanted to make a statement concerning all of the different thoughts and opinions regarding this post.
I think the best way to communicate this is with facts as I know them. Sven-pads; * Brett WAS going to sell his version of the Svengali pad to Murphy's but financially could not make it work. This is a fact. We have emails backing this up. * Bret should have no issues with anyone making Svengali pads as this is NOT HIS TRICK. * Svengali pads have been marketed/sold in the past. This is NOT a new trick. What’s more, this is NOT Bret’s original invention and Murphy's has NEVER carried a pad claiming to be a SVEN-PAD. Dice: * All of the electronic dice effects we are discussing are the result of Anverdi's Mental Dice. * MURPHYS MAGIC OWNS THE RIGHTS TO THE ENTIRE ANVERDE LINE. If ANYONE should have an issue with this is should be Murphy's. * This is also true of Anverdi's COLOR MATCH, SPIRIT BELL, etc. Murphy’s has NEVER been compensated by ANYONE for using Anverdi's ideas and original effects. * Over the years there have been upgrades in technology, different ways of transmitting the signal, etc. this does NOT change the fact that these "effects" are Anverdi’s and thus belong to Murphy's Magic. * We have never come out against ANY person who has taken an Anverdi Idea, (again, which Murphy's owns the right to) changed the way the signal is delivered, etc. and called it their own. * People have taken Anverdi’s ideas and made updated technological upgrades that were not available at the time these were first made. but the facts remains that Murphy’s owns the rights to all of these ideas/effects. Best regards, Titanas
Product Developer @ Murphys Magic Supplies
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Jared Inner circle Rhode Island, USA 1573 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 17, 2017, Mac_Stone wrote: This was by far the most intelligent post on this thread. Those of us who support Pro Mystic products will continue to do so as satisfied customers. Sales for this product will be minimal (at best) namely because Pro Mystic has an "army" of loyal supporters. Additionally, Pro Mystic products are powered by the same receiver for all devices (a non-visual "system" approach). |
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The Duster Inner circle 1693 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Titanas wrote: And the shameful Cube 3 you ignore - hmm The creator has many times tried to sort things out with you guys / Steve - but you ignore him How can Steve use the guys ideas - to make himself well known - and then sell them as his own afterwards But you ignoring him again - says more Maybe I am looking at the wrong thing on PM but the dice look like cardboard and obviously made hollow... if that is the case and this effect looks like actual dice - maybe that's the selling point here [?] |
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Robert Houdin 78 New user 92 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, elimagic wrote: Wait, you say that the procedure to put a “external component” into a real looking die belongs to Promystic and has been plagiarized? Really? |
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elimagic Inner circle 1663 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Robert Houdin 78 wrote: I don't want to comment anymore as I hate internet arguing and I've already shared my opinion a few times and that is enough. I just needed to respond to the other poster attacking me and others with similar opinions integrity as that isn't kind or productive to the discussion. I'm interested in how this plays out. Happy Christmas to everyone in this thread! Hope the new year brings great new releases and gigs to all! -Eli |
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videoman Inner circle 6732 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, M Pitcher wrote: You're just making wild accusations here with no basis or facts. If you are insinuating that Craig is contacting his supporters and asking them to extoll the virtues of his product then I disagree. In fact, I don't believe Craig has any fear whatsoever of this product and I doubt you believe he does either. You're just pulling things out of your arse in the hopes that others will believe you. |
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Mac_Stone Inner circle Miami, FL 1420 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Ustaad wrote: So the other issue with this product is the marketing. For years Pro Mystic have gone out of their way to keep RD a tightly controlled secret. Almost always referred to in abbreviations, kept on a password protected secret area on the PM website, and with NO ADVERTISING. This is all to keep the thought of an electronically modified die out of the general public's lexicon. Several readers here haven't even been able to track down the PM product. The general public is aware of concepts such as marked cards, fake thumbs, and even loaded die, but the concept of a die that secretly transmits information is not a concept that exists in the lexicon of the general public. Until now. The trailer reveals the secret in its entirety, all one has to do is stumble upon the trailer and now an amazing effect has been spoiled. Whether you spent $400 on three dice or $1500 on a single there is no more SECRET and no more MAGIC. If you think these strongly marketed flashy video trailers don't thrust their products into public view I present to you 4,000,000 views and counting that says otherwise. Ethical matters aside, this cheaper and arguably inferior product has spoiled its own effect as well as that of more expensive and arguably superior products. I think those that have spent nearly four times the cost of this product and have worked so diligently for YEARS are in their right to be upset that this product so blatantly gives the game away. |
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Justin Lewis Special user 981 Posts |
Quote:
You are absolutely looking at the wrong thing on Promystic Page. Nothing craig makes is of cardboard or looks like cardboard. It is password protected on his website to try to maintain the real die secrecy!
“The tragedy of life is not that it ends so soon, but that we wait so long to begin it.”- Anonymous
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Robert Houdin 78 New user 92 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Mac_Stone wrote: I fully understand those who spent $1500 on a single die using vibrations technology to be upset now that a $400 “colored dice trio” using a responsive visual display has been developped. This is the nature of things that rely on technology. R. |
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Mercury52 Inner circle Kevin Reylek 2239 Posts |
QFT
Quote: On Dec 18, 2017, Mac_Stone wrote:
Kevin Reylek
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Mac_Stone Inner circle Miami, FL 1420 Posts |
Robert,
I think you may have missed my point. My argument is not that this product is cheaper and therefore I am upset. Rather, my argument is that this cheaper product, and it is as a matter of fact cheaper in regards to MSRP, has openly revealed it's own secret, and to a larger extent the secret of any similar product, to anyone that watches the video. Any lay person who has seen this video will not be able to make a distinction between these two products but they will be able to reduce either product down to a simple electronic gizmo, because that is what was clearly demonstrated in the trailer. A closely guarded secret has been openly revealed to anyone with an internet connection, I think that is what most negative comments here find most upsetting. To add insult to injury it was, what most negative commenters feel is, a "Cheap Knockoff" that gave the secret away for free. Please just take a moment to consider that perspective. Neither of these products are cheap or inexpensive but one of these products has revealed its own secret FOR FREE. Kevin, I am not at all sure what QFT is supposed to mean. Above all else I think it is worth reiterating something I wrote in a different thread, please keep this in mind as we move forward. Quote:
On Dec 17, 2017, Mac_Stone wrote: Perhaps I should change my phrasing from "take seriously" to "consider carefully." Thanks, Mac |
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Robert Houdin 78 New user 92 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Mac_Stone wrote: Yes, I think I got your point Mac, so maybe I should have add: "...and I fully understand them to be upset by the fact that such a “technological breakthrough” is not going to be kept an “absolute secret” anymore... (mainly to our community... laymen don't care). Worst, it now will be accessible to most of us, amateur magicians!" BTW, I don’t understand how so many of you can refer to Promystic RD so openly? Has the moratorium on this product been removed? With Craig’s permission? I would be curious to hear Craig's opinion about all this... Thanks for letting me express my views, R. |
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Mac_Stone Inner circle Miami, FL 1420 Posts |
Robert,
I might be wrong, but what I'm inferring from your post is that you feel the use of secret electronic communication is obvious to lay people or that eventually in the future it will become common knowledge to lay people. Certainly with regard to psychics or mentalist even I feel the use of secret person-to-person electronic communication is common knowledge amongst the public, Peter Popoff was very publicly exposed for this very thing. However, I do not feel the public are aware that intimate objects are capable of secretly communicating. That is something I would not consider common knowledge. A smart phone is obviously capable of all kinds of communicating, secret or otherwise, but not a piece of plastic. It will become common knowledge with videos like the one Murphy's produced. You can't control what someone watches on the internet, so if your intent is to keep something secret best not to put it on the internet. I do not know if Ellusionist intended for Pyro Mini to remain a secret of magic but their aggressive marketing and flashy videos thrust their product into the eye of the general public. Again, see below. I think you might be joking with regards to the amateur magicians comment, I assume because of the emoji, but I still think this is priced outside the range of most amateurs. |
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Mercury52 Inner circle Kevin Reylek 2239 Posts |
Mac, QFT is "Quoted for Truth". I thought your post was pretty spot-on.
Kevin Reylek
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Juno-How Regular user 102 Posts |
I am thinking the 3 dice will be great for a randomised password routine along with a book test. So we know that it’s most likely your password will be made up of a name and some significant numbers..... I don’t want to reveal your personal information, so I would like you to help me create a random password. Spec one please pic any long word form this 300 page book. Spec 1,2,3 each roll a dice please - put them together to create our random password and then divine the password in the most dramatic way possible
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mh1001 Special user 602 Posts |
There are so many things said here that make absolutely no sense.
First, why trashtalking, insulting a new creator because they compete with PM ? So, competition is prohibited ? In economy, we know it's always a good. By the way, in what way is it a rip off ? It's not the same product. Furthermore, if you value creativity, comments like "I will never purchase anything else than PM" is very disappointing for newcomers. Secondly, I'm very puzzled by comments like "now that Mental Dice is sold by Murphy's, and is revealing its inner workings, we are all doomed". Even some people here said things like "lay people watching these trailers". Lay people ? Which one ? Your friends, which know some of your secrets ? Let's be serious for a moment. People who watch Murphy's and other companiers ads are magicians themselves. Of course, to prevent a secret from leaking, it's way better to avoid the product falling in hands of big, renowned companies. But in fact, I do not believe it would make a big difference. Again, lay people don't know about Murphy's Magic or Ellusionist, or T11, or Penguin, etc. Also, you can see many performances on PK touches, which are not guarded as secret, at least not to the same extent as some of the PM products, yet no one seems to know how it works. And don't forget the price of Mental Dices. Thanks to that, not many people will get those. Especially hobbyists. What I'm most afraid of, is not this kind of "exposure". Instead, it's advanced technology. For instance, what Labco's MindBuster is composed of is probably the same as in this product : http://www.montblanc.com/fr-fr/collectio......ink.html Similarly, there are tools like these : https://store-fr.iskn.co/products/slate/......deration If those things become common knowledge, you can guess what may eventually happen to you if you're using MindBuster (which costs more than 1400 euros ?). This would be, not due to exposure of tools we are using, but due to knowledge of similar technology which exists in the real world. |
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JackMagic Inner circle 1982 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 18, 2017, Robert Houdin 78 wrote: This happens in all fields of technology When large screen TV's came out they cost a fortune now you can get the same for lot less Makes you wonder why the price has stayed the same over the last five years when clearly it is possible to make the same for a lot less !! |
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Robert Houdin 78 New user 92 Posts |
Quote:
On Dec 19, 2017, JackMagic wrote: Most of us know the answer: monopoly situation and strong "protection" network (built around targeted privileges, gifts and discounts). Unfortunately, this model is also a classic... |
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Shawn D Elite user Hughson,Ca 465 Posts |
I wish the price was a lot higher that way everyone won't be owning it or buying it to expose it on YouTube.
Oh wait the trailer did that for us. I own MD an I still ordered it. |
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Nick-V. Special user Create and Devastate 817 Posts |
On Dec 16, 2017, MR Effecto wrote:
Reading the part to where you need to return them to have the batteries replaced kinda turns me off. On Dec 16, 2017, Christopher Williams wrote: I also admit I am tempted but the fact you can’t charge the dice yourself puts me off [/quote] Same here. I'll stick with the Old Old Fashion way.
Peace on the Magical Streets
~Nick V.~ |
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