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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » "The Spellbound Problem" (9 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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karnak
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Quote:
On Oct 17, 2019, Al Schneider wrote:
Well, I think so. I am kinda thinking of more details on making the cone.
Some other magic sellers have talked to me about handling this.
When they find out how I make the cone, their interest fades.
However, due to your kind post, I will try and do a more complete job.
Al


That would be great. I have the necessary coins. But when it comes to making cones, I'm all thumbs.
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critter
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I think Roth's wild coin is my favorite routine that uses the spellbound effect.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
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critter
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Just came across a relevant quote by Peter Duffy in a review from Magic Magazine, October 2007-p44:
"Dai Vernon once said that confusion is not magic. Vernon's Spellbound is a thing of beauty. The effect is both visual and crystal clear to the audience."
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

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Wilktone
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This was a timely resurrection of this topic for me. I don't perform in formal situations very frequently, but this past weekend I got to be a volunteer performer at a medieval/renaissance themed event. One of the tricks I performed was "The Alchemist," a wild coin routine by Marc DeSouza (the effect is four copper coins changing into gold, being dropped into a glass and then all turning back to copper at the end). There are four spellbound changes used for each coin change.

After almost two years since first posting my thoughts on Spellbound (the routine, not the moves) I still feel that the two issues I originally posted are valid.

1. The method is obvious.

Sure, a lay audience may not fully understand HOW you're hiding one of the coins, but they know what's up. It's kind of like a card manipulation stage act or a quick-change act, it's more about the surprise of seeing one more fan of cards or one more outfit. With Spellbound the lay audience is most likely impressed with your skill, but doesn't reach the "must be magic" feeling that Mr. Schneider aims for in his theory writings.

2. There's no ending.

At least in the classic routines. For example, I looked at Vernon's Spellbound routine from Stars of Magic and it's simply 4-5 coin changes and then it stops. David Roth's Spellbound from Expert Coin Magic Made Easy videos similarly is a series of coin changes and then it stops. While the effects are indeed clear and visual, the moments start very surprising with the first change and then (I feel) must get less and less surprising each time. As an effect, it starts out strong and then ends weak.

Dr. Rubinstein's Imagine a Coin routine fixes these problem by "bookending" a triple spellbound routine with a production and vanish. The bookends help to make the method more deceptive (and more challenging to perform). Mr. Schneider's Cone and Coin routine fixes these problems by not really being a spellbound routine in the first place. Mr. DeSouza's The Alchemist fixes the problems by not being about a single coin changing back and forth a number of times, but rather four different coins changing once and then altogether.

So I think (as was suggested above already) the best way to perform "spellbound" is to not do a classic Spellbound routine but to use the moves in the context of a different routine (i.e., Wild Coin). I am, however, thinking of mostly my own performance style and goals. I am an amateur and mostly perform in casual situations for people I already know. The "perverse magic" style of Gerald Deutsch and "jerxian" style of Andy appeal more to me these days. You will probably find your own style and goals to be different from mine.

Dave
Jonathan Townsend
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Folks might like Curtis Kam's Inverted Spellbound. The effect being that you turn a coin inside out. You could pull the halfdollar into a couple of quarters to finish. Just saying it's really about the magic rather than skill demonstration.

A different approach would patter about how to hide valuable things by putting a thin coating of base metal on top. You take out a copper coin and pretend to pull off the wrapper and show a silver inside. Of course thieves figured that out long ago and so folks started leaving coins with only a thin silver layer around to take but when the thieves pulled that off they found only copper. ... Smile
...to all the coins I've dropped here
critter
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Spellbound feels like a chase to me if done on its own. Definitely not theatrical but a cool fast paced novelty. I think the best uses of it in a routine are when the series is built up to. Then it's a surprise.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

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Jonathan Townsend
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Okay, what's the surprise? What's the setup? Smile
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Mb217
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Quote:
On Oct 28, 2019, critter wrote:
Spellbound feels like a chase to me if done on its own. Definitely not theatrical but a cool fast paced novelty. I think the best uses of it in a routine are when the series is built up to. Then it's a surprise.


I agree that a spellbound works well wrapped up into a routine. Here, I do that pretty much by presenting both coins upfront before going into a few creative spellbound-like changes. So, people don't have to wonder if there are 2 coins, because there are or at least there was. Smile After the cons magically switching places, even more magic is in the fact that one coin vanishes and becomes the other coin and vice versa, reinforced by open, clean shows of the hands...Building, building, building and then BAM!--that big surprise. Smile

I don't know, but I think that all the logic is right there for all the magic it shows. But as my grandpa would often say, "I can show you better than I can tell you." Smile

*Check out my latest: MBs Morgan w/ BONUS: Destiny, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at www.VinnyMarini.com Smile

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critter
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On Oct 28, 2019, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Okay, what's the surprise? What's the setup? Smile


Like in wild coin. There's a buildup to the full spellbound part of it. That's what makes it climactic in the context of that routine. Roth even explains the first one is for variation. Then the last sequence really knocks their socks off. It's not just doing the same thing four times, it's doing it twice and then doing it better and then doing it even better.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

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Jonathan Townsend
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Goshman said the item was for himself and played music to accompany his recital. The switches were evident in result yet invisible as he performed.

Try thinking of Roth's wildcoin as an outline for some magical effect you want to share with audiences. If narrating is your style - go for it. All the better if you find some magical effect under the mechanics. Pick some effect to drive the changes beyond switch practice/Or be decisive and play up the impossibility of the switches. Roth's purse and glass routine is a transposition with three coin changes.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
critter
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Thanks.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

New Facebook Page:
https://www.facebook.com/Valeyard-Magic-Stage-233226717588438/
simplymagicweb
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A little spellbound within a stand up wild coin style routine. Hope you like it

https://youtu.be/pbaKa89p4JQ
Magically,

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Jonathan Townsend
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Is anyone finishing the routine by having the coin change into a button from the front of their jacket?
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Rick Holcombe
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Here is one attempt at giving the routine a premise.


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