The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Every meat eater wants to be a vegan and I can prove it to you (32 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..6~7~8~9~10..14..17..20..23..26~27~28 [Next]
S2000magician
View Profile
Inner circle
Yorba Linda, CA
3469 Posts

Profile of S2000magician
Quote:
On Dec 16, 2018, critter wrote:
Where you moved the goalposts is that I referenced the "weak evidence effect" and then someone else brought up "confirmation bias." I spoke of how the two can both be true and then you decided we were only talking about confirmation bias. Both are valid theories so it's not a stretch to extrapolate a connection between the two.

And if you need more support for this then read up on the "synergistic effect."

Let me know if this isn't fun. It's just the internet so it should be fun.

I didn't move any goalposts, and I didn't decide that we were talking only about confirmation bias.

I was talking only about confirmation bias because your description of it was incorrect.; I had no argument against your reference to the weak evidence effect. Nor do I have any argument against a connection between the two.

On the topic of weak evidence, the morning session of the Level III Chartered Financial Analyst (CFA) exam will always have a number of questions in which the candidate has to formulate a conclusion, then give a specified number of justifications for that conclusion. When teaching the subject matter, I always suggest that they list (mentally, or on scratch paper) all of the justifications, then decide which are the best and write those in the exam booklet. (Note that if they're asked to justify a conclusion with, say, two reasons, the graders are instructed to read only the first two reasons listed; they literally cross off any reasons beyond the number requested.)
critter
View Profile
Inner circle
Spokane, WA
2462 Posts

Profile of critter
Except that my description wasn't incorrect. Feel free to check those definitions again.

I don't expect people to accept my definitions just because I spent six years in school for this and substantially more applying it but if this is just going to be me giving you a definition with a reference to where it came from and you saying "those words don't mean what the Oxford dictionary says they mean" then it's going to get tedious and I'll happily concede to spare myself that ordeal.

But if you are actually just doing a bit to demonstrate that facts really don't matter by demonstrating said principle... then... well-played.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

New Facebook Page:
https://www.facebook.com/Valeyard-Magic-Stage-233226717588438/
critter
View Profile
Inner circle
Spokane, WA
2462 Posts

Profile of critter
One more, this one not from a dictionary:
"...the tendency to process information by looking for, or interpreting, information that is consistent with one's existing beliefs."
Scott Plous: The Psychology of Judgement and Decision Making.

Note that reference to interpretation. It seems to be a recurring theme.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers


"This I offer in explanation of how it was that I found myself in my undergarments as I sat in my cell attempting to plot my escape."
~Professor Phineas Valeyard, Miskatonic University Dept.of Psychodynamic Natural History.

New Facebook Page:
https://www.facebook.com/Valeyard-Magic-Stage-233226717588438/
S2000magician
View Profile
Inner circle
Yorba Linda, CA
3469 Posts

Profile of S2000magician
Quote:
On Dec 16, 2018, critter wrote:
Except that my description wasn't incorrect. Feel free to check those definitions again.

I don't expect people to accept my definitions just because I spent six years in school for this and substantially more applying it but if this is just going to be me giving you a definition with a reference to where it came from and you saying "those words don't mean what the Oxford dictionary says they mean" then it's going to get tedious and I'll happily concede to spare myself that ordeal.

But if you are actually just doing a bit to demonstrate that facts really don't matter by demonstrating said principle... then... well-played.

Of course, I never wrote any of the things you suggest, but feel free to mischaracterize what I did write.

To be clear, what I wrote is that I've been teaching behavioral finance for a number of years, that confirmation bias arises in behavioral finance, and that I've never encountered anyone who said that confirmation bias involved interpreting ambiguous information in a manner that supports one's position, that it's always been presented as cherry-picking.

If it is commonly used to mean what you say, then that's news to me.

Please not that that last sentence is in no way intended to suggest that I think that it's wrong. It's intended to suggest that it's news to me. And we can all learn something new.
art85y
View Profile
Elite user
home-an unremarkable spiral arm of an insignificant galaxy
454 Posts

Profile of art85y
Quote:
On Dec 16, 2018, Senor Fabuloso wrote:
What I got from your post art85y, was HUNGRY.


Senor, I particularly recommend the truffle oil, Smile
Use the FORCE Luke.
ed rhodes
View Profile
Inner circle
Rhode Island
2696 Posts

Profile of ed rhodes
Yeah, I really dislike squeaky truffles!
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
magicalaurie
View Profile
Inner circle
2747 Posts

Profile of magicalaurie
"Every thought you think, word you speak, and action you take proceeds from either love or fear. Peace and upset, innocence and guilt, healing and illness all spring from that one fundamental choice." Alan Cohen
Steven Keyl
View Profile
Inner circle
Washington, D.C.
2494 Posts

Profile of Steven Keyl
Although confirmation bias may be in play with ambiguous information, that doesn't discount that the primary meaning of the term deals with information that would not otherwise be considered ambiguous--and I HATE agreeing with Bill!

Confirmation bias is the tendency to search for, interpret, favor, and recall information in a way that confirms one's preexisting beliefs. People display this bias when they gather or remember information selectively. The effect is stronger for emotionally charged issues and is a type of apophenia, which is the tendency to mistakenly perceive connections and meaning between unrelated things.

In other words, you're both right to an extent but the full meaning of the term is a little broader than either definition. This doesn't have any effect on the discussion at hand, though, but thought it might be useful for some.
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!

Come visit Magic Book Report.com!

"If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain
Steven Keyl
View Profile
Inner circle
Washington, D.C.
2494 Posts

Profile of Steven Keyl
Getting back to the point, though, I'm a firm believer in moderation. In any area of life, whether it be diet, politics, or really any life choices, proponents of more extreme behavior need to have increasingly compelling arguments in favor of deviating from those moderate choices. Given that both vegan and non-vegan diets can result in dietary deficiencies, I choose the diet that gives me the greatest flexibility in countering any imbalance.

More important than vegan vs. non vegan, is the idea that over-processed, mass marketed foods are a far greater danger than a piece of chicken. It's been brought up in this thread but to my way of thinking is the most important element for dietary health.

And let's not focus so much on staying alive that we forget how to live! (READ: Cheeseburgers taste good!)
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!

Come visit Magic Book Report.com!

"If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15737 Posts

Profile of tommy
It is something to do with priests refusing to baptize fornicators.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
S2000magician
View Profile
Inner circle
Yorba Linda, CA
3469 Posts

Profile of S2000magician
Quote:
On Dec 21, 2018, Steven Keyl wrote:
. . . I HATE agreeing with Bill!

Now you're making me blush.

Smile
HeronsHorse
View Profile
Loyal user
Scotland
207 Posts

Profile of HeronsHorse
To the op. I just wanted to correct a silly thing you said early on.
People don't have to put ketchup on meat to be able to eat it. Look at how steak is eaten. I'm a chef and let me tell you, the more raw the better and not many folk use seasoning either, not on the rare steak.
I don't care for it myself, my wife is vegetarian and I'm on a feeding tube. I don't have the luxury of defining what is and what isn't acceptable to eat. Or eating it!(I did used to eat meat though, shoot me!) I certainly don't try to tell others what they ought to eat and neither does my wife. It would be arrogant of me.
;)
You're proposition is so obviously wrong it is like a very long joke! You didn't prove anything. Thanks for the read though. Fascinating. I'm not being sarcastic there, I mean that.
Quote of the Month
Those who think that magic consists of doing tricks are strangers to magic. Tricks are only the crude residue from which the lifeblood of magic has been drained."
- S.H. Sharpe
JoeJoe
View Profile
Inner circle
Myrtle Beach
1908 Posts

Profile of JoeJoe
Quote:
On Jan 4, 2019, HeronsHorse wrote:
Look at how steak is eaten.


Yeah, I did ... steak without ketsuo is cooked on fire so it will taste like smoke which is a plant-based seasoning ... hickory, maple, mesquite, etc etc ... before magic I was a chef too. You are not going to tell me chefs don't use smoke flavors to season steaks, or at the very least "blackened".



Quote:
You're proposition is so obviously wrong it is like a very long joke! You didn't prove anything.


And you didn't eat my vegan chicken nuggets either, so I wouldn't have expected to have "proven" anything to you ... the proof is in the flavor. People don't eat food because they want to kill animals - they eat food because it tastes good. They will eat food they know is unhealthy and will kill them as long as they like the way it tastes, sad but true.

If plant-based foods taste better than animal-based foods, people will prefer to eat them ... period. It has nothing to do with your own personal belief systems. Smile

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
HeronsHorse
View Profile
Loyal user
Scotland
207 Posts

Profile of HeronsHorse
Ok Mr know-everything. I'm wasting my time here so I'll simply vanish!
Circular dogmatic arguments are not my style. Enjoy yours though.
Quote of the Month
Those who think that magic consists of doing tricks are strangers to magic. Tricks are only the crude residue from which the lifeblood of magic has been drained."
- S.H. Sharpe
JoeJoe
View Profile
Inner circle
Myrtle Beach
1908 Posts

Profile of JoeJoe
Well it is common sense - if people will spend billions on unhealthy food like McDonalds just because it "tastes good" imagine what they would spend on healthy food that tastes better.

Twenty years ago when I moved to this town as a vegetarian there was not a single plant-based meat available anywhere, now there are four sections of frozen vegan-meats at Kruger.

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
ed rhodes
View Profile
Inner circle
Rhode Island
2696 Posts

Profile of ed rhodes
Seems to me, vegans want the taste of meat so badly, they’re willing to put up with fake meat that almost satisfies their desires!
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
JoeJoe
View Profile
Inner circle
Myrtle Beach
1908 Posts

Profile of JoeJoe
Quote:
On Jan 4, 2019, ed rhodes wrote:
Seems to me, vegans want the taste of meat so badly, they’re willing to put up with fake meat that almost satisfies their desires!


No ... we don't make our vegetables taste like your meat, you make your meat taste like our vegetables.

Hickory smoke, maple, tomatoes, onion, lettuce, pickles, olives, peppers ... meat eaters want the taste of vegetables more than vegans want the taste of flesh.

Everything you season your meat with is a vegetable; no vegan is seasoning their vegetables with dead flesh.

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
ed rhodes
View Profile
Inner circle
Rhode Island
2696 Posts

Profile of ed rhodes
Yet, you’re the ones making plant based “chicken nuggets,” and announcing that you’ve found four different plant based “meat substitutes!” We may be using plants to “augment” the flavor of meats, but you’re using plants to try and find a substitute for what you really want... a big, juicy, bacon cheeseburger! Smile
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
JoeJoe
View Profile
Inner circle
Myrtle Beach
1908 Posts

Profile of JoeJoe
No, I don't want a piece of dead animal that will clog my artiries and make me sick.

It is not even a debate about animals-vs-plants: it is about growth hormones, steroids, antibiotics ... if you knew what they fed the cow that you are eating, you wouldn't want it.

But hey ... as long as they can make that dead animal "taste good", people will eat it no matter what ... they will eat it even if it makes them fat and sick, some people will still defend their diet even on their death bed. Sad but true.

Solution to the problem is simple: demonstrate to people that plant-based food can taste better than animal-based food.

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
magicfish
View Profile
Inner circle
6080 Posts

Profile of magicfish
Joe Joe wrote:
"If plant-based foods taste better than animal-based foods, people will prefer to eat them ... period."

Incorrect.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Every meat eater wants to be a vegan and I can prove it to you (32 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..6~7~8~9~10..14..17..20..23..26~27~28 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2019 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.28 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL