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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Every meat eater wants to be a vegan and I can prove it to you (32 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dannydoyle
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The best explanation I have ever heard was from a friend of mine you would all know but I won't use his name.

Not sure but I think he is not full vegan. But he said originally it was for health reasons, then ethical considerations, now he just does it to hack people off. It was a hilarious lunch.

Landmark that was hilarious as well.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
NYCTwister
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Geez. You go away for a few hours....
This is starting to feel like the Free World Charter thread.

Without going into whether insects are fish that drink elephant milk, there is a a lot of truth to what JoeJoe is saying; which is that we're better off eating the freshest food - food consumed as close to "being alive" as possible. In addition it's vital that the food itself is properly nourished, and as much as possible unadulterated, while it's growing or living.
I'm with JoeJoe in that I'd rather eat something found/killed in a forest, which is a healthy ecosystem; than something grown on most farms, or killed in most slaughterhouses.

I'm not 100% vegan - I eat meat about twice a month, usually while out with others. I also put half and half in my coffee, use butter at times, things like that; so I'm no fanatic. Not one of my friends has ever gotten an unsolicited word of advice.

Like a cliche', everything started going downhill when I turned forty. My hair started thinning, the family arthritis showed up and everything started cracking and popping. I never ran out of breath before, even though I smoked. Afterwards I started avoiding stairs whenever I could.

I was offered pills for the arthritis, told to stop smoking, eat better, exercise etc. I've always had a kind of phobia about pills because every one of my family members who was ill, and never seemed to get better, took a lot of pills.
So I took the last three pieces of advice to heart and started to make changes. I had a young son, and I wasn't going to be an old man at forty five.

I got a juicer, started walking and taking the stairs, cut back on the smoking, yada yada yada. I also started reading a LOT about natural healing, because I wasn't going to take any pills.

This led to learning about, trophology, the chemical makeup of food; and the affinity each has for various functions of the body, and it's organs. I also learned about what I think is the MOST important part of maintaining health, which is fasting and caloric reduction.

So this is where I'm coming from when I say that there is a lot to what JoeJoe is saying.
I don't believe a lot of the things he says are such absolutes - "everything is either healing or killing you", "man was MEANT to do this or that" "ALL illness is caused by malnutrition"; but the basic concepts are correct.

I think we've become so complacent, used to our desires being met with less and less effort; and so increasingly in need of instant gratification, that we've lost sight of what we really need to be healthy. Instead, like with many other things, we accept what we're told...because we're busy.

They say it's good enough - we eat it - we don't die - it tastes good - it looks like food - how bad can it be - they must be right.
But like any one cigarette is probably not going to kill you, the effects are cumulative.

We're made of chemicals, and what goes into our bodies are chemicals. Some of the interactions are beneficial, and some are harmful; but I think the biggest problem is that many can tolerated.
We can tolerate Red dye #947 and high fructose corn syrup, but there is nothing of nutritional value in them; they exist only for appearance and preservation.
Once in a while...sure; but if everything you eat has a bunch of such things then you're health will suffer, slowly but surely.

Do I think that there's a conspiracy of doctors and companies? No, but it's another area where capitalism without morality has caused a great deal of damage.
Doctors have to work within a system where health care decisions are affected by profit motive. If you work for Frito Lay your job is to sell Cheetos - especially since studies have shown that they won't kill you...right away.

Then there's the manipulation of data, and the propaganda; as JoeJoe pointed out.

"Milk! It does a body good!" "EVERY Olympian drank milk!"

Milk, aside from mothers milk and raw milk, is s#it. And it's hard to trust raw milk anymore, because...look at the cows! They can barely walk!
Aside from the fact that it comes from antibiotic ridden, malnourished, creature which has lived abominably; the pasteurization process destroys the nutrients. The vitamin D and the calcium are added afterwards.

Yet everyone knows that you just HAVE to drink it.

As far as "food as medicine" is concerned, I think this is where we form up and take sides, like we do with everything.

Since food, like drugs, are made of chemicals, it's logical to consume the chemicals that will be beneficial for your health/condition.
But we go to extremes. One side says stay away from doctors, and the other side says to always do as the doctor says.
Both are wrong, and both usually have some financial motivation for their extremism.

There are things that can be treated slowly and with lifestyle changes, and some things that need medical intervention and monitoring; but, to me, the key distinction between the extremes is that so many of the conditions that we treat are chronic, and have become so because of the way live.
Obesity, diabetes, IBS, on and on, are all things that can be prevented to a large extent. It's annoying to me that those who yell the loudest about health care, never mention the fact that many people are sick because they just didn't take care of themselves.

This is something I'm pretty passionate about, not only for my own experience, but because it intertwines with so many other social ills - especially regarding costs.

Not surprisingly, it's also an area where money in politics, and the influence it buys, has a devastating effect on food production and the manipulation of information.
If you need fear to enforce your beliefs, then your beliefs are worthless.
S2000magician
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Quote:
On May 23, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
Quote:
On May 23, 2018, S2000magician wrote:
they're certainly not vegetables, so anything that eats them certainly isn't a vegan.

If you want to get technical with words, "vegetables" do not actually exist. Vegetable is culinary term used by chefs, it does not actually identify anything in nature.

I don't want to get technical with words, but vegetables certainly do exist. The fact that it's a culinary term rather than a botanical one doesn't change the nature of vegetables, nor the nature of insects.

Insects aren't plants.

Happy now?
magicfish
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Using mammal and animal synonymously is an all too common blunder nowadays it seems.
magicfish
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Quote:
On May 23, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
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On May 23, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote:
Are fish covered in fur? Are birds? Are reptiles?


Everything in nature is covered - trees are covered in bark, fish are covered in scales, birds are covered in feathers, animals are covered in fur, dirt is covered in grass, human beings are covered in skin (that's right, we are NOT "animals").

Insects are covered in "setae", stiff hair-like bristles.

I'm not sure what you would call the covering on reptiles, it seems to be something of a cross between skin and scales. Either way, I don't consider reptiles to be "clean food" but I've never had the need or desire to eat one so I haven't researched that.

-JoeJoe

So Insects and Humans are not animals but Plants are?
Maybe books are for more than just starting fires Joe Joe. Might wanna preorder Senor Fabuloso's book Smile
JoeJoe
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
So Insects and Humans are not animals but Plants are?


If you want to define "insects" as "animals" then you would also have to define plants, reptiles, birds, trees, and humans as "animals" also.

I'll continue to define "animals" as creatures covered in fur, and "insects" as creatures covered in setae, and "humans" as creatures covered in skin.

I'm not going to argue the definition of words. I've told you what definitions I'm using, to apply your defitions to the words I use to change the meaning of what I say so you can make jokes if not productive.

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
magicfish
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Ok. So do you make up your own definitions of sub atomic particles as well? Electrons?
What about Mathematics? Or do you draw the line at inventing your own Biology?
And no, I am not joking.
Dannydoyle
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Joe Joe I'm pretty certain that this is why you have so much trouble communicating. We have agreed upon language and words mean things. You can not just make up your own definitions and then stomp and get angry when others point it out. This is not how society works.

I'm not being mean I'm being serious and respectful.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
magicfish
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
So Insects and Humans are not animals but Plants are?


If you want to define "insects" as "animals" then you would also have to define plants, reptiles, birds, trees, and humans as "animals" also.

I'll continue to define "animals" as creatures covered in fur, and "insects" as creatures covered in setae, and "humans" as creatures covered in skin.

I'm not going to argue the definition of words. I've told you what definitions I'm using, to apply your defitions to the words I use to change the meaning of what I say so you can make jokes if not productive.

-JoeJoe

What are Mammals covered with?
Animated Puppets
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Since Humans are classified by not having fur (though what is fur but compact hair and there is a plethora of hairy guys out there), I guess evolution doesn't even enter into the equations.

I've been on a high protein low carb diet for about a year and lost a lot of weight and drastically improved my health. Most of my protein comes from dried beans, quinoa, and high fiber cereals with protein shakes. But, I still have meat occasionally.

Now, I'm not one to knock someone who found something that works well for them but the title of the thread invites criticism IMO...
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JoeJoe
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
What are Mammals covered with?


Mammals are covered in fur. Human beings are covered in skin.

Human beings could be a hybrid creature of some sort, a mixture of mammal and virus - the only other creature to behave the way humans do is the virus (ie: destroying it's environment until it dies with it).

-JoeJoe
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JoeJoe
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, Mike Gainor wrote:
Now, I'm not one to knock someone who found something that works well for them but the title of the thread invites criticism IMO...


Scientific research has to be criticized, I don't hide from criticism either. I welcome it.

Nobody would learn anything if we only talked to people that agree with us. Smile

-JoeJoe
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Dannydoyle
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Science questions itself. And in a logical manner, using facts and proof not just perception bias.

Asking questions is good. Getting answers is even better.

But you can't make up your own definitions to words and just observe without recording and doing studies and proper research and claim your findings are valid and doctors are wrong. Well you can I guess. You just shouldn't be expected to be taken very seriously.

You just can't claim humans are not mammals in the spirit of questioning things. Well again you can but that is proclamation not question.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
JoeJoe
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, Dannydoyle wrote:
But you can't make up your own definitions to words and just observe without recording and doing studies and proper research and claim your findings are valid and doctors are wrong.


All words are "made up", they don't exist in nature ... duh. All the countries of the world use different languages, nobody agrees on language ... our language has been "confounded". Even the various dictionaries do not always agree on what a particular word means - in some cases a word can even have multiple definitions that actually contradict each other.

When I'm talking to someone that isn't using the same definition, I explain what definition I am using. The brain doesn't think in "words", it thinks in "images" ... when you hear words, your brain has to translate them into images. Instead of trying to tell me my word is wrong, understand the definitions I am using so you can get the same image I have.

That is why I say "if you do not SEE an example in nature..." ... images are more powerful than words, you learn more actually observing nature than you do reading about it. Words can be used to manipulate people just like numbers can (ie: "cook the books").

I'm done arguing on what an "animal" is ... I told you what the words means to me, if you have a different definition fine. That does not change the meaning of what I said using the definition I used. You don't really care to know what image I have of an "animal" in my mind, all you want to do is play word games - I'm not here for that, I don't have time for that, I don't play games, I'm an adult, games are for children.

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
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JoeJoe
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If you'd understand what I just said Danny, you would get along with people much better ... you need to quit trying to act like you are the smartest person in the room and start trying to understand what other people are trying to say. Smile

Anytime you get the urge to say someone is wrong based on the definition of a word, you should seek to find out what definition they are using. It resolves a lot of conflicts before they arise.

I like the phrase "what do you mean by that?" Smile

-JoeJoe
Watch the Pilot Episode of my new TV Show:As Seen on TV: The JoeJoe Magic Show
Learn JoeJoe's secrets at Magic Joint dot com
Dannydoyle
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Joe Joe I'm getting tired of your lashing out like a child when I have treated you with nothing but respect. Please stop.

You do not have to act like this, especially when you don't mind criticism. Or do you have different definitions for that phrase as well?

Stop with the duh stuff please. This is the second time I am asking nicely.

You are the one acting smarter than everyone. Then you get angry when shown actual facts.

It makes talking with you impossible because you have to define your Joe Joe language. Everyone agrees what things mean and that is used to communicate. It would be faster and more efficient of you just used any of the established languages instead of forcing everyone to adapt yours in a desperate attempt to always be right.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
magicfish
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
What are Mammals covered with?


Mammals are covered in fur. Human beings are covered in skin.

Human beings could be a hybrid creature of some sort, a mixture of mammal and virus - the only other creature to behave the way humans do is the virus (ie: destroying it's environment until it dies with it).

-JoeJoe

Incorrect. Mammals are covered in hair. Not fur. And they give birth to live young and they are warm blooded and have a spine.
Dannydoyle
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Joe Joe why is it that everyone must respect your views and you get to lash out at others? In this thread alone you have said some of the most uninformed crap possible and still people are respectful. You give the duh nonsense like a third grade recess taunt.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
magicfish
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
Quote:
On May 24, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
What are Mammals covered with?


Mammals are covered in fur. Human beings are covered in skin.

Human beings could be a hybrid creature of some sort, a mixture of mammal and virus - the only other creature to behave the way humans do is the virus (ie: destroying it's environment until it dies with it).

-JoeJoe

Incorrect. Mammals are covered in hair. Not fur. And they give birth to live young and they are warm blooded and have a spine.

This is why bats are not birds Joe Joe, although "seeing" them in nature, they would appear to be.
Thanks to Linnaeus' universally accepted Classification of All Living Things (science) we have a knowledge beyond just what we see.
Kind of like your subterranean plant root behaviour.
S2000magician
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Quote:
On May 24, 2018, JoeJoe wrote:
Quote:
On May 24, 2018, magicfish wrote:
What are Mammals covered with?

Mammals are covered in fur. Human beings are covered in skin.

Given that you seem to revere words developed by science, you should honor this:

Scientific classification of humans (homo sapiens, the only extant human species):

Kingdom: Animalia (Interpretation: humans are animals)
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Mammalia (Interpretation: humans are mammals)
Order: Primates
Suborder: Haplorhini
Infraorder: Simiiformes
Family: Hominidae
Subfamily: Homininae
Tribe: Hominini
Genus: Homo
Species: H. sapiens

You're welcome to define words however you want, but please do so with the understanding that you're often wrong. As you are here.
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