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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Dick, many thanks for the good luck wishes.
Frank, I'm enormously grateful to you for that link: what a fascinating collection of information. I think a hat coil might just work for my purposes, but it would have to be the mother and father of all hat coils (in terms of bulk) and have a definite climax. I also have to bear in mind the need to strike whatever I use quietly and unobtrusively. I don't think an artifical bird in a small cage would cut it dramatically, but thanks for the idea. |
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FrankFindley Inner circle 1028 Posts |
Quote:
On Jun 17, 2018, Bert Coules wrote: I think a hat coil might just work for my purposes, but it would have to be the mother and father of all hat coils (in terms of bulk) and have a definite climax. I also have to bear in mind the need to strike whatever I use quietly and unobtrusively. I don't think an artifical bird in a small cage would cut it dramatically, but thanks for the idea. Besides an animal, the most iconic load would be eggs like Thurston and other greats did. But it may not fit the theme and is a longer time sequence with a spectator or two. But how about ending with a flash appearance of coins and cash filling a bowl? It is pretty shocking to an audience. For example, see here at 25 seconds: https://www.penguinmagic.com/penguinlearn.php. It is amazing what can be produced from a prepared hat especially when the gimmick plays double duty. Flags were another big production item from that time and often produced from a drum. It was a major boast that the performer toured the world and this was a way to create that perception. Producing a large flag on a flagstaff was another approach to this and could easily be added to any production as a finale (eg out of the unwound hat coil). It doesn't get much bigger than a flag production for a solo performer. See ending of routine here for example: https://youtu.be/vXPT6RxhIoc The flag could be anything including character's country) and so could align with setting. In China it is still a staple of performers to produce the PRC flag. |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
No offence, but if I had to pick an effect which most completely failed to meet my criterion of being a brief self-contained solo routine that quickly builds to a well-defined dramatic climax and is easy and unobtrusive to clear, the Devant/Thurston production of a load of eggs would probably be top of the list!
The flag production, certainly as seen in that video, relies completely on the cover of the silks, and I don't think silks are right for the character. It also requires a steal, which I wouldn't ask a non-magician to do. It certainly does have a flash impact though, you're right. Your first link didn't work for me I'm afraid, even after I created an account for the site. Thanks for the thoughts. . |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
FrankFindley, you've got me wondering now if a flag production could be done without a steal from a table or whatever. Maybe if the performer was wearing a cloak. A quick twirl...
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
On reflection I don't think it's right, either stolen under cover of a hat coil or produced from clothing. For maximum effectiveness it needs a decent amount of space for a good sweeping display and I can't guarantee that that will be available, but there are other considerations too. But again, many thanks for the idea.
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kidnapped1853 New user 62 Posts |
Bert, how about the Tri-Section Illusion? Here is some video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Wz2dDWyCTo
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Kidnapped1853, funnily enough, I was thinking about it earlier today, so thanks for that link to a performance that was new to me. He gets a huge bonus point for being the only person I've ever seen who has a *reason* to open the flapped cabinet, and he would get even more if the baton was inside it rather than improbably clipped to its lid, though of course that would be tricky. He does lose perhaps half a mark for the sheer illogicality of the dusting assistant.
But that's all beside the point, since I can certainly see the effect working for the character (the great magician loftily demonstrating his invulnerabilty) though the routine would have to be briefer than this and the other videos I've seen. The main drawback for my purposes I think is that it's just a touch ungainly: the necessary stance and the leaning across the body are both a little awkward (and the latter isn't too good for visibility, maybe). But I don't want to seem ungrateful: this is a strong contender. Is it owned and licensed by anybody do you know, or is the principle out there to be freely used? . |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Ah. I just watched that video again and realised that while the dusting might be illogical (to say nothing of demeaning) the presence of the assistant - and in particular her casual walk round the back of the apparatus while the flap is down - serves a very valid and nicely subtle purpose.
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Mr. Woolery Inner circle Fairbanks, AK 2149 Posts |
Something like Miser’s Dream would allow for serious and self important performance. With the right pail, the noise alone serves to get and keep the audience focus. And there exists (or used to) a relatively simple mechanical version that can be dumped out empty at the end, if that’s what you want to do. Also, on Gary Darwin’s TT video set, he demonstrates an almost self working version with a giant coin as the final production.
Patrick |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Patrick, thanks for the idea. Though I've never seen it done that way, I agree that in the right hands a solo Miser's Dream could work well as a serious piece of genuinely mysterious (and possibly even poetic) magic, but without the distraction of comic byplay with a spectator I think the level of focus on what the performer is actually up to would be rather more than I'd want to ask a non-magician to bear.
I know that there are no-sleight variants, but unless you actually see some at least of those coins appear at the fingertips of an apparently empty hand, I believe the magical element is distinctly lacking. But I'm grateful for the suggestion. . |
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Mr. Woolery Inner circle Fairbanks, AK 2149 Posts |
The one Darwin shows has a half dollar appear for every coin. They are all visible. And at the end, just the single giant coin. The gimmick is the appearing coin and it is something you can make in minutes with items you probably have.
But if it doesn’t fit, that’s fine. Good luck! Patrick |
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George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 3042 Posts |
On that tri-section illusion: I could see it too for you want, Bert, but here's my unsolicited two-cents' worth, FWIW.
The first thing that bothered me was the setup. There's a magician's table, then some kind of a riser, then the base of the prop, and finally the box itself: the part we're supposed to look at. I understand about needing to have the box at the right height, but this seems "inelegant" compared to the persona the performer is trying to convey. I would suggest a stand or something that's already at the correct height. This would also help what you mentioned about leaning. I love the idea of the assistant walking around the back, but why not give her something else to do? Maybe, instead of the center portion of the box just lifting up in place, she can come around the back and remove it altogether. I suspect the "lifting in place" arrangement is there so it can be a one-person illusion, but it doesn't have to be that way. Finally, something else I've never liked about this is the fact that the lower box has a flap only on the front. That seems illogical. Again, maybe it's so it can be a one-person illusion, but, with an assistant, you can have two flaps. Or --- (and I promise I'll stop here) what if there were no stand? The assistant just holds the box in place at the correct height. That way the "lifting in place" of the center section makes sense, and so does the fact that there's only one flap. When it's open, we see the assistant standing back there. And striking the prop is a piece of cake.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Patrick, thanks for that. I do like the idea of a different approach to presentation imbuing a standard effect with a relatively new feel: a solo, serious Miser's Dream, an intense, dramatic Linking Rings, an almost hypnotically slow Cups and Balls - there are lots of possibilities, but few, alas, that fit the bill in this case. It's not the presentation that's the worry, it's the necessary magical technique: I think it's easy to forget (I know I've done it myself) that what the fraternity thinks of as the most simple and basic of sleights or handlings is actually something that needs a high level of skill and confidence, things that can't be quickly and easily acquired.
George, I've been thinking more about the Tri-Section and I share your misgivings, both about the effect in itself and for my particular needs. Though I like your suggested refinements, I can't have a second person on stage, so an assistant (dutiful feather-duster wielding or not!) isn't on; I do worry about the inelegance and the sight lines; and there's no build up to a climax, which is my primary requirement. The right effect is out there somewhere. I just have to find it, and I'm sure I shall. Everyone's thoughts and suggestions have been enormously helpful: please do keep them coming. Many thanks again to all. . |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
This goes completely against what I was saying in that it doesn't build to a dramatic climax, but if I could coax an actor to give this sort of routine with this sort of smoothness and intensity, I'd be well satisfied. A quiet, understated, reflective encore, totally unshowy but leaving no doubt as to the sheer skill of the magician. Two minutes of poetry:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paKDutWykiA But back in the real world, no sleights and no magical moves please! . |
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Mr. Woolery Inner circle Fairbanks, AK 2149 Posts |
Https://www.stevensmagic.com/shop/misers-miracle-solari/
This is the same trick Darwin showed. A pail, a jumbo coin, a half dollar, a tt, some epoxy putty. All the skill is in presentation, not manipulation. I’m not trying to convince you, just to be clear about what I mean. Patrick |
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Mr. Woolery Inner circle Fairbanks, AK 2149 Posts |
I would love to have those rings! What a great two ring routine!
Thanks for sharing that. |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Patrick, thanks for the Miser's Dream link. I'm perfectly happy for you to try to convince me about anything (and please keep trying if you have any more ideas) but I'm going to stick to my guns here: it's a nice routine but when you say it doesn't call for manipulation I have to disagree: the key move might be simple but it still depends on both skill and confidence, and (I suspect) a keen awareness of sightlines.
And as an aside, though the jumbo coin is certainly a defined climax it also makes the rest of the trick completely illogical, because it forces two quite different things into juxtaposition: a magician who can pluck coins from the air is both awesome and enviable - who wouldn't want to be able to do that? A magician who then makes those coins vanish and replaces them with a single large coin which has no practical use in the real world is an idiot. What's the point? But it wouldn't do if we all had the same taste! I'm so pleased you like DMC's ring routine. I think it's magnificent. . |
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Wravyn Inner circle 3482 Posts |
One thing I might suggest is a torn and restored newspaper. It’s a one person effect, it doesn’t need any talking script unless you want it to, once done, the restored paper can be folded and carried off stage by the actor or set on a table and would not be in the way.
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
OK, I'll answer my own question. Maybe the magician is so contemptuous of the values of the mundane world that he has no need for anything as petty as bankable cash - he'd rather demonstrate his power and his aloofness by airily dismissing hard currency in favour of something essentially pintless except to demonstrate his powers.
Yes, that works for me... Thanks again, Patrick. The video did indeed make clear what you were talking about. . |
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Bert Coules New user Romney Marsh, England 85 Posts |
Wravyn (nice name!) thanks for the idea but I think a T&R Newspaper has the same drawback for me as even a simple Miser's Dream: it needs specific, specialised handling if it's to look any good. The moves are simple and straightforward - to the mind of a magician. But not, I'd suggest, to anyone coming to them for the very first time and having severely limited opportunity to rehearse what is, from their point of view, a two-minute segment of a two hour play.
There's also the point that given the guy's performance persona a T&R newspaper might come across as a bit trivial. Though I accept that it's all (or almost all) in the presentation. Sorry to be so unenthusiastic. I do appreciate your input; thanks again. . |
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