The Magic Cafť
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index Ľ Ľ Not very magical, still... Ľ Ľ Impossible Whooper (5 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..10~11~12~13~14 [Next]
Wravyn
View Profile
Inner circle
2176 Posts

Profile of Wravyn
There are plants that are carnivores.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
Called insectivorous?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
E.S. Andrews
View Profile
New user
63 Posts

Profile of E.S. Andrews
Quote:
On Dec 13, 2020, Dannydoyle wrote:
Aren't bears omnivorous? I mean we certainly can't be the ONLY species that is omnivorous can we? As such is it really a "distinct advantage" and so forth? Wouldn't ALL omnivorous species evolve as we did if you follow that logic?

Hey man I love meat and won't stop eating it any time soon. But logic must be used when making points right? Oh wait I forgot where I was.



In the context of my post, my use of the term "distinct [evolutionary] advantage" was meant to imply in relation to other primates and hominids--not that all omnivores become as intelligent as humans or that all omnivores evolve into humans.

A small sampling of scientific articles on the subject of the critical role of dietary meat in the evolution of homo sapiens and, in particular, their intellect, and how it gave us a decided evolutionary advantage over our evolutionary cousins:


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5417583/

https://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/rele......99a.html

https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledg......3874273/

https://time.com/4252373/meat-eating-veganism-evolution/

http://www.scielo.org.co/scielo.php?pid=......&tlng=en
landmark
View Profile
Inner circle
within a triangle
5018 Posts

Profile of landmark
Quote:
On Dec 13, 2020, tommy wrote:
Eating a vegan or plant-based diet can be bad for your brain health, especially if you already have a low choline intake, researchers report.

https://neurosciencenews.com/vegan-diet-brain-health-14845/#:~:text=Summary%3A%20Eating%20a%20vegan%20or,low%20choline%20intake%2C%20researchers%20report.


Vegan choline supplements are available. For example:

https://nestednaturals.com/products/choline-bitartrate-550mg
landmark
View Profile
Inner circle
within a triangle
5018 Posts

Profile of landmark
Quote:
On Dec 13, 2020, E.S. Andrews wrote:

A small sampling of scientific articles on the subject of the critical role of dietary meat in the evolution of homo sapiens and, in particular, their intellect, and how it gave us a decided evolutionary advantage over our evolutionary cousins:


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5417583/

https://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/rele......99a.html

https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledg......3874273/

https://time.com/4252373/meat-eating-veganism-evolution/

http://www.scielo.org.co/scielo.php?pid=......&tlng=en


Thanks for the cites, much appreciated.

I looked at the abstracts and the main arguments of the articles.

Best I can tell:

1. None of them talked about possible de-evolution due to veganism. And for good reason--it's a silly argument. What evolution would have naturally selected for hundreds of thousands of years ago, adapting to the world's specific conditions *then*, cannot be applied to conditions in the world *now*. I am not competing against saber tooth tigers for my food or survival right now. I *am* now competing in a world whose meat-raising practices may well impact both local and global chances for our species' survival.

2 The second listed article even makes the following related point:

"Without meat, said Milton, it's unlikely that proto humans could have secured enough energy and nutrition from the plants available in their African environment at that time to evolve into the active, sociable, intelligent creatures they became. Receding forests would have deprived them of the more nutritious leaves and fruits that forest-dwelling primates survive on, said Milton." [italics mine]

In other words, meat then was important because the plants available at the time could not provide enough energy. But this is before the advent of even agricultural knowledge. So yes meat availability was important then, but now we can get enough nutrition in our everyday modern lives through vegan foods and supplementation.

3. The NIH article abstract says: "Too high a meat intake and fertility falls below replacement levels. Reducing variances in meat consumption might help stabilise population growth and improve human capital." And that's in an article you cite to support your view. Now I know you are not advocating a meat only diet, and your view is more nuanced than that. But I quote that exactly to point out that the relationship of meat-eating to health is full of pro and cons, and not simply one of "you must eat meat for brain health and veganism will make us devolve." It's just not so. And I say that as someone who is *not* a vegan.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
I know a family who were all very obese who went on a meat diet and lost a great deal weight. By neat diet I mean they now only eat meat and nothing out of the ground. I canít recall the name of the diet at the moment but as silly as it sounds it allows one to eat a lot and everything is fried.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
E.S. Andrews
View Profile
New user
63 Posts

Profile of E.S. Andrews
Quote:
On Dec 14, 2020, landmark wrote

Now I know you are not advocating a meat only diet, and your view is more nuanced than that. But I quote that exactly to point out that the relationship of meat-eating to health is full of pro and cons, and not simply one of "you must eat meat for brain health and veganism will make us devolve." It's just not so. And I say that as someone who is *not* a vegan.


You're right, of course. I was making an extreme postulation in response to the extreme postulation of this thread's OP--although I would submit that my somewhat tongue-in-cheek conclusion is more viable than the OP's apparently serious one.

Would there be a negative evolutionary impact on our species if all humans, simultaneously and for millennia, stopped eating meat in their diets? Who knows? As you note, our knowledge and circumstances are vastly different than they were in our formative evolutionary years. It is possible that in the short term, the effect on population health of simultaneous "going vegan" would be net positive.Beyond that, on the evolutionary measure of time, who knows? But there is nothing in our evolutionary history and common DNA to suggest that homo sapiens all "want to be vegan" or that strict en masse veganism would positively impact the ongoing evolution of our species.

This talk of food is making me hungry.
magicfish
View Profile
Inner circle
6751 Posts

Profile of magicfish
Quote:
On Dec 13, 2020, tommy wrote:
Called insectivorous?

No. Carnivorous plants will often eat creatures other than strictly insects.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
An insectivore is a carnivorous plant or animal that eats insects. An alternative term is entomophage, which also refers to the human practice of eating insects.

As a kid I once eat a Bumble Bee; It landed on my ice cream and stung my tongue.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Wravyn
View Profile
Inner circle
2176 Posts

Profile of Wravyn
Quote:
On Dec 14, 2020, tommy wrote:

As a kid I once eat a Bumble Bee; It landed on my ice cream and stung my tongue.


That would have been a female bumble bee. Male bumble bees do not have stingers.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
Thank you. I did not know that.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
magicfish
View Profile
Inner circle
6751 Posts

Profile of magicfish
Quote:
On Dec 14, 2020, tommy wrote:
An insectivore is a carnivorous plant or animal that eats insects. An alternative term is entomophage, which also refers to the human practice of eating insects.

As a kid I once eat a Bumble Bee; It landed on my ice cream and stung my tongue.

That is correct. But carnivorous plants aren't always strictly insectivorous- they'll often eat other creatures. Therefore, they are carnivores, not insectivores.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
Do vegans eat such plants or protest them?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Wravyn
View Profile
Inner circle
2176 Posts

Profile of Wravyn
My better half works at the restaurant chain that sells the impossible burger. It is not a vegan burger, it is only plant based.
If a person is vegan, they are to request it to be cooked either in the frier with fries or microwaved, otherwise they are grilled with meat products.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
Before the industrial revolution, poor people hardly eat any meat. They would be hung for stealing a rabbit. This why poor the people back then were small and the rich, like Henry VIII, were massive. Now the elite are taken us back to pre-industrial revolution times with the Great Reset, all poor people are going to shrink. Have you seen all those little old houses with little doors? Only the little people pay taxes.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
landmark
View Profile
Inner circle
within a triangle
5018 Posts

Profile of landmark
Quote:
On Dec 16, 2020, tommy wrote:
Do vegans eat such plants or protest them?


They feed them The Impossible Locustģ
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
If Vegans live behind a rock, are black homosexuals and have three wives, then are pretty easy to some-up, arenít they?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80eqm3T552Y
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
magicfish
View Profile
Inner circle
6751 Posts

Profile of magicfish
Quote:
On Dec 16, 2020, tommy wrote:
Do vegans eat such plants or protest them?

They demonstrate around the garden chanting meat is murder while their purple haired pierced faced children tell the evil plant how to live its life.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devilís Island
16203 Posts

Profile of tommy
Other researchers believe that talking to plants may stimulate growth because of the carbon dioxide produced when people exhale as they speak.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
ed rhodes
View Profile
Inner circle
Rhode Island
2750 Posts

Profile of ed rhodes
I'm reminded of the demon in "Good Omens," who took a slightly different slant on talking to plants;

https://youtu.be/ldioxVEFxo4
"There's no time to lose," I heard her say.
"Catch your dreams before they slip away."
"Dying all the time, lose your dreams and you could lose your mind.
Ain't life unkind?"
The Magic Cafe Forum Index Ľ Ľ Not very magical, still... Ľ Ľ Impossible Whooper (5 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..10~11~12~13~14 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2021 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.21 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL