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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Quantity / Volume of Shows? (20 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Mindpro
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To take this a step further, I work with many in the magic community that are failing and yet haven't a clue! The only thing worse than trying to avoid or admit failing is not recognizing or acknowledging failure at all. Many think they are doing fine and miss it altogether or are simply too ignorant to admit it.
Dannydoyle
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The ability to see and admit and accept failure and do the postmortem and LEARN from that is quintessential is every successful person on the planet.

Avoiding it, disguising it from yourself, telling yourself that it is something it is not is just so bad for forward progress.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Ken Northridge
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Atlantic City, NJ
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Quote:
On Jun 26, 2019, Dannydoyle wrote:
This is the frustrating part about "opinions". Yea everyone has one. But an opinion is absolutely the lowest form of human knowledge. You don't need any credentials to have one.


At first I thought this was a brilliant statement, but the fact is an opinion COULD BE based on a large amount of evidence and experience. Trouble is we don’t know if someone’s opinion is valid unless we test it ourselves and go through the experience.

It is helpful to know the background of the person giving the opinion. I have come across some false teachers in my time in the magic community (and other businesses as well). Businessmen who claim they know the way to success and how to make lots of money, and yet later circumstances revealed they are broke. That’s why choosing the right teacher, mentor, or guide is important. Credentials do matter.

But in the end, the best teacher is experience. Yes, take advice from people you trust, but always with the realization that each individual’s experience will different.

My long time favorite quote on this subject:

“Experience teaches slowly, and at the cost of many mistakes”
-Batman (advising Robin, the boy wonder)
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
www.KenNorthridge.com
TomBoleware
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Yes everything written on this thread and the whole Café for that matter is just an Opinion. That’s what we do here on the Magic Café, we share opinions, some may be good and some may be bad. What we shouldn’t do is try and demand that all opinions shared here match our own opinion. Nothing wrong with saying I disagree and moving on.

Danny knows absolutely nothing about me; he has never read any of my books, never listened to a speech of mine, never sit in on one of my talks, never watched me do magic. All he knows about me is that at one time I did kidshows and owned a daycare center and from that he formed an opinion about me, and bashes me from his own ill informed opinion. The other 70 years of my life experiences means nothing to him. He Cannot Accept any Opinion That Does Not Agree With His Own. He just won’t allow it here.

Now to be clear, I completely agree that mistakes will happen and we can learn from it. But I don’t agree with the statement that “we all NEED to fail.” You might say, In my book Failure is Not an Option.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
WitchDocChris
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2019, Dannydoyle wrote:
The ability to see and admit and accept failure and do the postmortem and LEARN from that is quintessential is every successful person on the planet.


This is really it, isn't it?

All the quips and simplifications don't mean jack when it's go time.

And anyone claiming to have simple solutions to complicated issues is selling something. Their advice is not geared to help people, it's geared to get people to pay the guru.

Everyone will fail. People who think they can prepare their way past failure are setting themselves up for the worst possible failures - ones you don't even anticipate being possible.

Just today I saw a post by Eric Mead - someone I think we can all agree is both skilled and successful - talking about a trick of his just absolutely failing to the point he had to quietly put those props away and move on to the next piece. If anyone thinks Eric Mead hasn't prepared before he does a show, I suspect their wrong about a lot of other stuff too.

There are lessons one can only learn through the experience of failure. This is a fact. The only way preparation will make it so one avoids all mistakes is by 'preparing' forever and never actually performing.
Christopher
Witch Doctor

Psycho Seance book: https://tinyurl.com/y873bbr4
TomBoleware
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2019, WitchDocChris wrote:
Quote:
On Jun 28, 2019, Dannydoyle wrote:
The ability to see and admit and accept failure and do the postmortem and LEARN from that is quintessential is every successful person on the planet.



Just today I saw a post by Eric Mead - someone I think we can all agree is both skilled and successful - talking about a trick of his just absolutely failing to the point he had to quietly put those props away and move on to the next piece. If anyone thinks Eric Mead hasn't prepared before he does a show, I suspect their wrong about a lot of other stuff too.



I saw that post and thought about this too, Eric didn’t fail, he quickly took care of the mistake and moved on.
I’m sure he would be the first to tell you he didn’t ‘NEED’ that to happen.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
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Tom it seems as if YOU are the one having trouble accepting others opinions.

Why do you back up everything you said with guessing what others are thinking?

You juat can't accept what we are saying and you juat keep contradicting it and wonder why people make fun of you.

Failure is not only an option it is inevitable in the real world. Maybe sitting on the couch and spouting platitudes involves less of it. In the real world where people don't burp rainbows and fart puppies it is not only an option, it is stranded equipment.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2019, Ken Northridge wrote:
Quote:
On Jun 26, 2019, Dannydoyle wrote:
This is the frustrating part about "opinions". Yea everyone has one. But an opinion is absolutely the lowest form of human knowledge. You don't need any credentials to have one.


At first I thought this was a brilliant statement, but the fact is an opinion COULD BE based on a large amount of evidence and experience. Trouble is we don’t know if someone’s opinion is valid unless we test it ourselves and go through the experience.

It is helpful to know the background of the person giving the opinion. I have come across some false teachers in my time in the magic community (and other businesses as well). Businessmen who claim they know the way to success and how to make lots of money, and yet later circumstances revealed they are broke. That’s why choosing the right teacher, mentor, or guide is important. Credentials do matter.

But in the end, the best teacher is experience. Yes, take advice from people you trust, but always with the realization that each individual’s experience will different.

My long time favorite quote on this subject:

“Experience teaches slowly, and at the cost of many mistakes”
-Batman (advising Robin, the boy wonder)


All opinions are not equal is your point.

I have an opinion about the universe and what makes it work. I have never studied it though. So should my opinion be thought in school? Should anyone listen to it and make decisions based upon it?

I have a pool in my back yard. I can even swim. Does this mean I am Michael Phelps?

Yes everyone is entitled to an opinion but you are not entitled it being right. Experience matters and without it an opinion mighr as well be a fart in a hurricane.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Quote:
On Jun 28, 2019, Dannydoyle wrote:
Tom it seems as if YOU are the one having trouble accepting others opinions.

Why do you back up everything you said with guessing what others are thinking?

You juat can't accept what we are saying and you juat keep contradicting it and wonder why people make fun of you.

Failure is not only an option it is inevitable in the real world. Maybe sitting on the couch and spouting platitudes involves less of it. In the real world where people don't burp rainbows and fart puppies it is not only an option, it is stranded equipment.


Nobody except YOU is making fun of me.

Danny, let me try one last time to get YOU to understand.

I have said many, many times that mistakes will happen and when it does we can learn from it. But I disagree that we ‘NEED’ it to happen.
Why can’t you just admit that “we all NEED to fail” was a bad choice of words? That YOU FAILED to make your point with that?
Please tell me right now, so I can stop posting why we all NEED to fail?

Do you really believe that in your next show you ‘need’ something to go wrong?

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Dannydoyle
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Funny how everyone here but you gets it. I do not have a more simple language with which to communicate. Sorry

As OTHERS have pointed out there are lessons you can ONLY LEARN through failure. That is the admission price.

If you want to exel at something failure is an essential part of learning. If you want to be mediocre then failure is what you claim. The mediocre are always at their best.

Agsin you really should stop like you promised.

And it is not just me Tom. Read the thread.

NOBODY is saying what you say I am.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Ok Danny. I’ll leave you with this:

Yes many of the guru type motivational speakers talk a lot about how we shouldn’t let our failures get us down and that we should turn them into successes. But we shouldn’t take that as if we should welcome failure in order to learn a lesson. True it’s only in hindsight that we most likely can see how our failures lead to our successes. But you’re not guaranteed to be a success when you fail. More often than not, if you fail, you failed, period. And that’s where you’ll stay. Very few will even try to turn a failure into a success; they discard it as a failure and move on to something completely different. Failure is not for everybody and it’s certainly not needed for most. Success has a much greater influence on the brain than failure and just like Success Breeds Success Failure can do the same.

But don’t take my word for it, do some research and see for yourself how many of the modern studies have shown that we learn more from success than failure. Quite the opposite of what many will tell you.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
www.tomboleware.com
Mindpro
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Thank you. Well, you have certainly spoken your piece and it has explained a lot. Yet it has little to do with quality or volume of shows for the working professional performer or the more shows vs. less shows at more money topic that was in progress.
Dannydoyle
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My GOD I hope that means you are done posting.

Tom if you want to stay mediocre then go ahead. (At your age not much will change.)

Your complete inability to comprehend this very concept is what leads so many to stay at mediocre. If you never fail Tom, you never learn to deal with it. It is not unlike a child kept in a bubble who has no real strong immune system working for them. The body does not know how to deal with the sickness when it happens.

If you don't now how to deal with failure then when it happens it is paralyzing. It is what Ray is saying about pressure testing. Christian speaks of having to make the mistakes and learn lessons and to not make the mistake is to not learn.

YOU have NO CLUE what we are talking about because you have not done this. Certainly you are not doing it currently. You can get away with pretending you never fail when selling non FDA approved supplements in a pyramid scheme. Get off the couch and into the world of actual performance Tom and it is a different world. One you are woefully ill equipped to speak about. No amount of feel good speeches from gurus will help you in this world. You do not know what is happening.

Now PLEASE I hope you are done derailing this thread. Stop addressing me then complaining I am mean to you.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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