The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Shadow coins revisited (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
Jim Wilder
View Profile
Special user
Birmingham, AL
954 Posts

Profile of Jim Wilder
Hello,
I have read posts here for a few days. I did see the thread about shadow coins and read them thoroughly. However, I would like if someone could give me opinionated comparison of shadow coins and call shot, I understand them to be similar. I do street work primarily, and on a table top. Which routine would you recommend is better for working a table top that is waistline level?
Dave V
View Profile
Inner circle
Las Vegas, NV
4825 Posts

Profile of Dave V
I don't know about Call Shot, but a requirement of Shadow Coins is that it must be done on the floor as it needs to be viewed from above.

Having it at table top level would pretty much kill the effect.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
wsduncan
View Profile
Inner circle
Seattle, WA
3618 Posts

Profile of wsduncan
I would suggest that unless you have very small audiences that coin assemblies are not appropriate for street work. Audiences need to look DOWN to see a coin assembly and that limits the number of folks you can perform for at one time. Limit the number of people who can see your act and you limit the size of the hat!

Coins to Glass (Bobo's New Modern Coin Magic) is much better suited to the streets because it's of it's upright construction and the element of sound. There's a bunch of other "platform" and drawing room coin magic which would adapt well to the streets.

David Roth's Ultimate Coin Magic Collection 3 has some good work in this area including a very nice effect with coins and silk. Having the silk gives you some nice segue possibilities and also cover for a dramtic production of some sort which helps the volume of the applause (another good thing when trying to increase the size of the crowd and the amount of the hat).

Cheers
Bill
cloneman
View Profile
Elite user
475 Posts

Profile of cloneman
I'm going to have to disagree with wsduncan in one respect: the angles for assembly routines are not that bad. True, shadow coins is an "on the floor" routine, but I prefer Roth's Chink-a-chink anyway.

When I perform assembly rountines, I do it on a table with people either standing as I am, or sitting as I am. Frankly, I think the only bad angle would be if they were sitting and I was standing.

Frankly, I'm not sure of the benefits of Ammar's changes over Roth's routine. As for Call Shot, by Dean Dill, its a different effect and relies on heavy use of a gaff. I think most of Dill's assembly work is excellent and inspired. That said, Call Shot is not my favorite, requiring too many moves that just don't appear natural, in my hands at least.
"Anything is possible... if you don't know what you are talking about."
Chris S
View Profile
Veteran user
393 Posts

Profile of Chris S
Cloneman, have you seen a good performer do shadow coins in person? If you haven't I think you will not understand the benefits of Ammar's tweak to Roth's routine. Its all very well for us to just mention the illusion of height and its impact, but you have to see it...
May your moral compass guide you true - South West is where the honourable man fare. Pity those who lose their way...
cloneman
View Profile
Elite user
475 Posts

Profile of cloneman
Actually Chris, I have seen a few good coin performers doing Shadow Coins. The height is a nice touch, but in my opinion, does not make the routine that much of an improvement over Roth's work. If done right, Roth’s handling also makes it appear as if you do not touch the coins. Maybe I’m blessed with thick thumb bases (since you know the routine, I won’t tip the secret any more than that), but when people are standing and looking at me perform on a table, they usually say that I didn’t touch the coins when I do Roth’s routine. Nor do I think that I’m that amazing a performer, its just that I think Roth’s routine does the job as well.

If you can point me to an online Shadow Coins video that will change my mind, I will definitely view it with an open mind. I'm always interested in improved assembly handlings.
"Anything is possible... if you don't know what you are talking about."
Jim Wilder
View Profile
Special user
Birmingham, AL
954 Posts

Profile of Jim Wilder
Cloneman,
Do you use sugar cubes for chink-a-chink? I have it in print in Tarbell and a version by Johnny Thompson, but have not seen Roth's version.
cloneman
View Profile
Elite user
475 Posts

Profile of cloneman
No, I use coins, usually dollar size (I have big hands). To view Roth's handling I highly recommend his "Expert Coin Magic Made Easy" DVD. The basis for the routine is a great jumping off point for table routines.
"Anything is possible... if you don't know what you are talking about."
Jason Wethington
View Profile
Special user
Orlando, Fl
615 Posts

Profile of Jason Wethington
The big difference is the use of a [ in the routine. It affords a level of cleanliness that Roth's routine doesn't. It allows a cleanup that doesn't require specific performing conditions outside of the performing surface.

I'll see about posting a video of me performing a routine I use. I'll post back when it's up.
Jason
Jim Wilder
View Profile
Special user
Birmingham, AL
954 Posts

Profile of Jim Wilder
I just purchased both dvd's and the requirement for shadow coins. All in all, it will not be bad to know both routines. Also, I look forward to seeing the video.
Thomas Wayne
View Profile
Inner circle
Alaska
2240 Posts

Profile of Thomas Wayne
"Shadow Coins" does not require working on the floor; the lower your working surface, however, the "higher" off the surface your hands will SEEM to be.

Try John Kennedy's "Translocation", or one of the many variations of that effect. It uses the same [ gaff, but is a much longer (and potentially more entertaining) effect.

Regards,
Thomas Wayne
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
Jonathan Townsend
View Profile
Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
26976 Posts

Profile of Jonathan Townsend
Thomas, how HUGE an engineering problem would it be to make something that allows you to do the trick on an almost vertical plane? I'm thinking along the lines of magnetics on a fridge.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Thomas Wayne
View Profile
Inner circle
Alaska
2240 Posts

Profile of Thomas Wayne
Quote:
On 2004-06-01 15:22, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Thomas, how HUGE an engineering problem would it be to make something that allows you to do the trick on an almost vertical plane? I'm thinking along the lines of magnetics on a fridge.


Funny, that reminds me of some early billiard instruction videos. The host had cut small (1 1/2" diameter) pool balls in half and inserted magnets into the flat side; a green-colored metal plate with simulated rails served as the "table", and he laid out shot examples for explanation purposes. Having been involved in pool and billiards from a young age I found it somewhat odd to look at.

The problem with using the magnets-on-a-fridge principal to create a "vertical" Shadow Coins - assuming a [ is involved - would be the natural attraction between the [ and a ... um ... "special" coin. Also, what would hold the [ in place?

Perhaps a reverse approach to the problem: shimmed coins and [ and a ... um ... "special" surface?

Unfortunately I fear that such a display would SCREAM of mechanical trickery. On the other hand, what if you were to use a large (legal size) envelope and lick-n-stick postage stamps?

Or even BETTER... pound four framing nails into the four corners of a thick wooden board and then assemble them - one at a time, ala Shadow Coins - all together at one corner of the board... and the board could be examined afterwards.

Oh wait; Michael Weber already did THAT one.

Regards,
Thomas Wayne
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
Dan Watkins
View Profile
Inner circle
PA
3025 Posts

Profile of Dan Watkins
Quote:
On 2004-06-01 22:51, Thomas Wayne wrote:
Or even BETTER... pound four framing nails into the four corners of a thick wooden board and then assemble them - one at a time, ala Shadow Coins - all together at one corner of the board... and the board could be examined afterwards.

Oh wait; Michael Weber already did THAT one.


Wow - now THAT sounds pretty darn impressive. Never heard that before.
Click to visit:
Image
Jason Wethington
View Profile
Special user
Orlando, Fl
615 Posts

Profile of Jason Wethington
I had heard of it but I wish I could have seen it done.
Jonathan Townsend
View Profile
Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
26976 Posts

Profile of Jonathan Townsend
If you can get in touch with him, ask about the thing.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Chris S
View Profile
Veteran user
393 Posts

Profile of Chris S
I don't think you can compare shadow coins with routines like Translocation. Shadow coins is all the stronger BECAUSE it is so brief. Often patter only interferes with a routine like shadow coins. Translocation is more of an interactive piece that is intended to be one that involves a dialogue. Its a beautiful routine in itself, but its a different animal.
May your moral compass guide you true - South West is where the honourable man fare. Pity those who lose their way...
Jim Wilder
View Profile
Special user
Birmingham, AL
954 Posts

Profile of Jim Wilder
I have been actively performing "shadow coins" and have had good responses from it just as well on a table top as while I perform it on the floor.

I have found it to be more of a filler/quick effect to use in a down moment. Now that I have studied, learned, and performed the effect, I understand the reasoning behind performing it at ground level, but have not had any problems with angles while performing it on a table top.
levitate
View Profile
Veteran user
315 Posts

Profile of levitate
Oooh I dunno about that. Translocation is one of the strongest things I do when done very very slowly and fairly. I mean you can SO fairly show no extras and its just impossible. Plus you can build it as you go, selling it even more as you go, then backfire it.

Michael
wsduncan
View Profile
Inner circle
Seattle, WA
3618 Posts

Profile of wsduncan
Quote:
On 2004-05-31 19:29, cloneman wrote:
I'm going to have to disagree with wsduncan in one respect: the angles for assembly routines are not that bad.

Thomas,
My concern is'nt that the angles are bad for exposing the trick... but that they're bad for large crowds to see the trick.

Assembly routines require a viewing angle that's not ideal for street work because you want to have enough people watching to make the hat worth your times and the more people you have in the audience the farther back they have to be and the fewer people who can see down onto the table.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Shadow coins revisited (0 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2019 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.17 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL