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Cris Cringle New user 74 Posts |
Greetings all,
I recently purchased a set of cups that were listed as Original Gazzo cups. There is no markings on them such as GA. They feel very nice in my hand though much larger than I’m used to. I’m not looking for value as I bought these to use but I’m always curious about the history of things and stories that go along with “things”. Measurements using a tape are Height outside 89mm. Inside 87mm Width at mouth outside 95mm inc rolled lip. Inside 87mm The seat on the top is 60mm in diameter Weight. 301g. 315g and 322g. Total 938 if me math is ok I can’t seem to get my photos to load. I will keep trying Any thoughts on these or help with photos? C |
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kcmagic1 New user 78 Posts |
I believe that all of Gary Animals cups were hallmarked or engraved. By the looks of your measurements, they could be the RNT2 Gazzo cups. Although the two are similar, the RNT2 Gazzo cups are more squatty than the GA cups and I believe that the mouth width is very close to the height of the cups.
Designer of the 1000-G cups - the most durable cups in magic www.kristiancharles.com/1000-g
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scotchrocket Regular user Canada 120 Posts |
Thanks for the stats!
Quote:
On Apr 14, 2020, Cris Cringle wrote: Try uploading to imgur.com (drag and drop, no account needed), then copying the image URL and posting here via bbcode (remove the space, and replace the URL text): [ img]URL_HERE[/img]
All about borrowed coins.
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Cris Cringle New user 74 Posts |
[ img]https://i.imgur.com/QPR6qVz.jpg[/img]
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Cris Cringle New user 74 Posts |
[ img]https://imgur.com/gallery/XjYqXgk[/img]
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kcmagic1 New user 78 Posts |
It is hard to tell from the photos, but I'm pretty sure that if they are not hallmarked or engraved, they are RNT2 cups. The only visual difference is that the GA cups are I believe about 1/2" taller. Maybe a little more than that, but definitely taller. As far as the beads, without looking at them side by side, are almost identical if memory serves me.
My partner for the 1000-G cups owns every set that Gary has made. I am sure that if you wanted the specs for them, I could get them from him. I did briefly talk to him about the GA cups today and he confirmed that GA cups are hallmarked, with the exception of the GA street devil cups, which are engraved and numbered.
Designer of the 1000-G cups - the most durable cups in magic www.kristiancharles.com/1000-g
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Dale Houck Veteran user Dakota J Magic at Saint Cloud, FL 343 Posts |
I have a rare set of Gary Animal "MAX" cups that are hallmarked and engraved. Numbered as set 1. I'm not sure if he made any other sets or not. Donnie bought the rights to make Gazzo cups from Gary so the specs he uses should be the same as the one's Gary used. I have a set of the Rings N Things Gazzo cups posted in the Tricks and Effects for Sale. I have a set of GA Gazzo cups (not for sale) in guild metal instead of copper. They are heavier than the set of Rings N Things copper cups, but that might be due to the difference in metals.
Magic is where you find it.....
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kcmagic1 New user 78 Posts |
Quote:
On Apr 18, 2020, Dale Houck wrote: The original GA Gazzo cups and the RNT2 Gazzo cups are not the same specs. The RNT2 cups are squattier. Also, don't take the wrong way because I think that Donnie is a great guy and manufactures great cups, but to hear Gazzo talk, that is not the way it all went down. I do not know for sure, I obviously wasn't involved with the discussions about manufacturing, that is just what I have been told.
Designer of the 1000-G cups - the most durable cups in magic www.kristiancharles.com/1000-g
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Cris Cringle New user 74 Posts |
I was told that an old man made these cups prior to Gary Animal for Gazzo. There definitely is no hallmarks or engravings in these.
C |
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Donnie Buckley V.I.P. Cleveland, Ohio 1123 Posts |
When I purchased the rights to make Gary's cups, he shipped me all his blocks, sample cups, and mandrels. His blocks for the Gazzo Cups are identical to the blocks we used for the RNT Gazzo Cups. (He did sometimes use some wildly thick metals though that I won't touch).
Also Gary CREATED the design for the Gazzo Cups. I don't see how anyone could have made the same cups prior to Gary designing them. The problem with "the way that it all went down" was related to WHO had permission to give RNT the right to manufacture the cups for Penguin Magic almost 20 years ago. I fixed all those problems almost 10 years ago, after I took ownership of RNT, when I legitimately paid Gary for the rights. I love Gary! and I'm proud to have been able to do the right thing by him. He likewise assured me that he was pleased that his designs are now in my hands. |
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Leo H Inner circle 1334 Posts |
Thanks for that back story Donnie. Will you ever spin the Gary Animal Street Devils? Those were the jumbo sized PF cups.
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Dale Houck Veteran user Dakota J Magic at Saint Cloud, FL 343 Posts |
This is an image of the Rings-N-Things Gazzo cups on the left in copper and the Gary Animal Gazzo cups on the right in guild metal. They are of identical height, saddle diameter and mouth diameter. The GA guild metal cups are heavier weighing in at 36.4 ounces. A review of the Gazzo cups in the Cups and Balls Museum will show there were different generations of Gary Animal Gazzo Cups and different generations of RNT Gazzo cups. The Rings-N-Things might be "squattier" than the Type I Gazzo cups but as shown in my photo there is nothing squatty about the current generation of Rings-N-Things cups compared to the latter GA Gazzo line.
Magic is where you find it.....
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kcmagic1 New user 78 Posts |
I stand corrected about the size. I must have compared the RNT cup to the type I GA cup. I wasn't aware that Gary changed the design with different generations.
Designer of the 1000-G cups - the most durable cups in magic www.kristiancharles.com/1000-g
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kcmagic1 New user 78 Posts |
Just wanted to give an update. I did measure the GA Gazzo cups that I have access to and they stand 3/8" taller than my RNT2 Gazzo cups. I took some pictures. It looks like the skirt from the mouth bead to the first bead is where most of the difference occurs because the first bead sits higher on the GA cups. Other than that, the two sets interchange and nest together perfectly; meaning the GA cups nests correctly on top of the RNT2 cup and RNT2 cups nests correctly on top of the GA cup. I took some pictures and if I can figure out how to get them posted here, I will do that.
Other than that, I absolutely love the RNT2 Gazzo cups and truly enjoy my conversations with Donnie. If it weren't for designing my own out of 303 which hold up longer with my performance, I would still be using the RNT2 Gazzo cups. Donnie has always treated me great, has excellent customer service and was a big help with the process of making my cups!
Designer of the 1000-G cups - the most durable cups in magic www.kristiancharles.com/1000-g
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Poof-Daddy Inner circle Considering Stopping At Exactly 5313 Posts |
Quote:
On Apr 22, 2020, kcmagic1 wrote: +1 Donnie is a true professional with great ethics. I find him to be the type of guy that "does it right, or not at all". I love chatting with him on the phone.
Cancer Sux - It is time to find a Cure
Don't spend so much time trying not to die that you forget how to live - H's wife to H on CSI Miami (paraphrased). |
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Cris Cringle New user 74 Posts |
Ok well then it seems I have some RNT2 Cups. They are very nice and I'm working them into my routine. My Cups appearance is certainly like those on the left of the picture above. My cups seem squatty as mentioned above but then again other than my Phoenix Cups I've not used any other cups.
C |
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Donnie Buckley V.I.P. Cleveland, Ohio 1123 Posts |
The length of the skirt (the space between the bead and mouth bead) can actually fluctuate quite a lot. It's one point of production where you can tweak the design - for better or worse.
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24314 Posts |
I don't claim to be an expert on cups and balls, but I do own more sets of cups and balls than just about anybody around. I had a couple of sets of Gary Animal cups that were not hallmarked. I'm not sure what the deal was with these. I also have a set of Gazzo (style) Cups that were hallmarked in felt tip marker with a large V. These were made by a fellow named "Vic," who evidently was one of Gary's teachers. The cups came from the Bob Read estate. They are different from the standard Gary Animal cups.
Early Gary Animal cups had a smaller saddle than the later ones. These were the original Gazzo Cups that Gary produced. Right after the early 2000's, Gary started making a cup with a bigger saddle. These were the GA typeII cups. He also took some of his type 1 cups and respun them so they had larger saddles. The main reason for this was that most c&b workers prefer a cup that will allow a three ball display on the top of the inverted cup. Gazzo doesn't use that feature. So the original Gazzo cups had a smaller saddle. As far as the quality of the RnT II Gazzo cups vs. the GA cups, it's a wash. They are both fine cups. The main thing is that you can get Gazzo cups from RnT II without any waiting. Donnie is a fair, honest dealer, and he bends over backwards to make sure his customers are satisfied. I know this, because I am one of them.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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dfolson New user 67 Posts |
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On Apr 18, 2020, Dale Houck wrote: Where is the for sale area? I can't seem to find it? |
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Dale Houck Veteran user Dakota J Magic at Saint Cloud, FL 343 Posts |
Quote:
On Jun 5, 2020, dfolson wrote Where is the for sale area? I can't seem to find it? [/quote] You can’t find it until you’ve had 50 posts.
Magic is where you find it.....
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