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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
I tried a search on the Café , but could find no reference to this trick. I came across it in an old ad in a Genii magazine. The ad was actually a U.F. Grant ad, but Grant was speaking highly of this Richard Himber trick called "Himber's Throw-Out Rope Trick" , which Grant apparently held in such esteem that he asked Himber if he could distribute it.
Anyone ever seen it ? Has Himber's item been incorporated into other rope routines or is it a stand alone trick ? Sounds intriguing. U.F. Grant writes: "This guy Himber recently played Columbus and I dropped down to his dressing room. He handed me a piece of rope , then took it back and cut it in four pieces, tied them together and THEN ... without cutting away the knots , or sliding them off , etc. , the knots visibly vanished. The rope was in one piece and he gave it to me to take home ... you too can duplicate this popular 4-piece rope trick with ordinary rope and without switching , and give it out at the finish ... this is one idea that is worth a five spot alone to any rope worker. This , next to Himber's Milk Pitcher , is his greatest effect. So I talked him into letting me advertise it ... All you need are the Himber illustrated instructions at $2.00 Postpaid." Click here to view attached image. |
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jimgerrish Inner circle East Orange, NJ 3209 Posts |
In the early 1940's, Professor Ted Collins invented and was performing his "Panama Rope Trick". By 1948, he had added his "4 to 1 Rope" to the start of the Panama routine. Both of those tricks sound related to the description of the "Himber Throw-Out Rope Trick." Dating that advertisement would help establish its place in the series and perhaps explain why the Himber trick has apparently disappeared but the Collins' tricks are still widely used.
Jim Gerrish
magicnook@yahoo.com https://www.magicnook.com Home of The Wizards' Journals: https://magicnook.com/wizardsTOC.htm |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
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On Jun 27, 2020, jimgerrish wrote: Sorry, for omitting the date of the advertisement. The U.F. Grant ad for Himber's "Throw-Out Rope Trick" was in Genii December 1943, pg. 157. |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
Doing a bit more searching , I find that Himber's Throw-Out Rope Trick was republished in 1960 by the Mack Publishing Company , Cherry Hill, NJ . A used book seller has one for sale on Amazon as of this date (June 27, 20202). I guess buying it would be the easiest way to find out what it is. Still curious to know if anyone else here knows it. The title of the trick was not familiar to me when I ran across that old U.F. Grant ad from 1943.
https://www.amazon.com/Himbers-Throw-Out......BN9MOJ2/ A bit more searching finds a copy for sale on eBay for $9.95 - https://www.ebay.com/itm/HIMBERS-THROW-O......74958044 (of course these links won't be good after some time has passed , but just posting them for reference now) Click here to view attached image. |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
The problem with manuscripts is that most if not all magic dealers of the time did not carry them. There was no profit in selling a $2 set of instructions. Only if Grant advertised them in magic magazines of the time, and magicians order them direct.
When I was stationed in Persideo of San Francisco, after Viet Nam, the one magic shop outside the base in San Franciso, I was surprised that they had a folder of Grant instructions, when I was looking for a Grand manuscript. If you can get Mak Magic to speak to you, they offered years ago, when Jimmy Sr. passed away, and the name changed to Mak Magic, they offered items that were sold under the Grant name. I can't remember if it was book or not, but it was a lot of Grant items. If Grant did sell them, then they may be in that offering from years ago. As I recall the offer was for over a hundred dollars for the lot. It was copies not originals to my knowledge. Although another guy got the close-up magic when Grant died, and ran the company for several years. Mak Magic got the large props and is still going today. You do realize you are looking for something that is over 80 years ago. I know I never heard of this manuscript, so it was not around offered in the 1960's and 1970's in their catalogs or advertisements in magic magazines. Although by then they were not advertising in magic magazines much if at all. |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
Here's a little more info on the Himber rope trick.
This is from Himber's own ad in Genii October 1943. In that ad he refers to the trick as "Paging Mr. Fetsch". (apparently the name was later changed to "Himber's Throw-Out Rope Trick".) But the description is the same: "A borrowed rope is cut into four pieces, and then in a split second, without cutting the knots off or sliding them off, the rope is restored again and thrown out into the audience for examination." . |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
I just realized the Throw Out Rope Trick sound like Chris Philpott's (of 100th Monkey) recently offered rope effect, "The End of My Rope" effect.
Could this be the Throw Out Rope trick? https://www.penguinmagic.com/p/9851 He mentioned in Latest and Greatest topic, if anyone knew of an effect like his. https://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/view......rt=100#3 |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
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On Jul 5, 2020, Bill Hegbli wrote: Interesting ... that certainly seems close to the description of the Himber effect. Maybe a case of an effect being re-invented ? Although I note that in Himber's it says that the cut rope is tied together and then restored to one piece which can be handed out. Watching the video of Philpott's "The End of My Rope" , the rope isn't tied together before the restore. Doing a little more searching I found that the duo act David & Leeman performed Philpott's "The End of My Rope" on Fool Us . During Penn's code-worded interrogation afterwards he noted that Leeman seemed to be the partner with the most "pull" in the act. Both David and Leeman nodded in agreement. So it seems like Philpott may have re-invented some variation on Bill Neff's Miracle Rope ? https://youtu.be/YLkRmXGNtWI?t=221 But it seems like there must be more to it than simply a reworking of Neff's rope trick, because here is what Chris Philpott posted after David & Leeman performed it on Fool Us: Quote:
On Aug 4, 2016, Chris Philpott wrote: Note that he says: "Those of you who know the method, what do you think of Penn's explanation? Is naming a traditional part of the method while ignoring the original part good enough?" So I think we know what he means here by Penn mentioning the "traditional part of the method" , but he says that Penn ignored "the original part" , implying that there is more to it than what Penn was alluding to ... . |
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
Because Chris Philpott went on to say:
Quote:
On Aug 24, 2016, Chris Philpott wrote: (from this topic: https://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/view......start=80 ) I have not yet read that entire topic about The End of My Rope , but I'm sure this was all discussed in as great a detail as allowed without causing outright exposure. (a lot of time that line seems to be crossed when discussing new tricks here on the Café , I know I've been guilty of that myself in certain topics) I'm going to go read the entire topic now. Whether this is or isn't partially based on Himber's apparently forgotten "Throw Out Rope Trick" , the Philpott trick seems to be worth looking at . If it can be performed at any time in the act then it is certainly an improvement over Neff's rope trick which is limited to being an opener , unless some sort of locking p _ _ l or a h_ld_ ut is used. . |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
David Todd, are you forgetting the red ladies nylon stocking gag, that makes it possible to perform Neff's Rope effect during you show. It does not have to be an Opener effect.
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maratekin Regular user 150 Posts |
The Himber manuscript is available at Trickshop.com.
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countrymaven Inner circle 1426 Posts |
I don't really like the panama rope trick c n r and its variants. I don't care if a modern magician who was begging for help for covid does it or not. That type of c n r could only really convince magicians. Not spectators. IMHO
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TrickyRicky Inner circle TrickyRicky 1653 Posts |
I have The Panama Rope and Himber's throw out Rope. They are both good and a bit different in methods.
Tricky Ricky |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
I purchased the Himber manuscript. I found a flaw in the description. They do not tell you what to do with the cut off ends in the right hand.
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Harry Murphy Inner circle Maryland 5444 Posts |
I have both the original manuscript/booklet sold by Richard Himber and recently bought the ebook version sold by Trickshop.com (At $5.00 USD it was just too inexpensive to pass up). They are identical. Apparently the folks at Trickshop.com simply scanned the original. Page 12 and 13 in my Trickshop.com ebook show clearly what happens to the cut pieces. They are tossed out.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
They show what happens to the left hand pieces before the restoration, but not the right hand pieces cut at the beginning of the effect.
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Harry Murphy Inner circle Maryland 5444 Posts |
Page 10. cut ends off knots.
Page11. Ends of pieces are held in right hand Page 12 & 13. Simultaneously slide left hand ...etc., etc., .. the same time teasing rope and pieces into air...etc. etc. While the drawing on page 12 doesn't show the pieces (as seen on page 11) they are there. What is in the left hand is the rope that is going to be instantly restored and tossed out. What is in the right hand is the pieces of rope trimmed from the knots. Actually walking through the routine with a length of rope (or practice using yarn or string) and it makes sense and works.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
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David Todd Inner circle 2328 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 21, 2020, Harry Murphy wrote: I also purchased the manuscript (from a used bookseller on Amazon Marketplace for $7.00. I didn't realize until after I purchased it that TrickShop had it as a PDF for only $5.00) I agree with you that it makes sense walking through the routine with a piece of rope , following it step by step. However, the original description in the U.F. Grant advertisement (posted above) employs a bit of "dealer-speak" which glosses over a key point: "He handed me a piece of rope , then took it back and cut it in four pieces, tied them together and THEN ... without cutting away the knots , or sliding them off , etc. , the knots visibly vanished. The rope was in one piece and he gave it to me to take home." "without cutting away the knots , or sliding them off ,etc., the knots visibly vanished." happens in a way I was not expecting from the description. I was picturing the knots vanishing and a restored single piece of rope which could be thrown out to the audience. What actually happens is "the knots instantly disintegrate into small pieces of rope which fall to the floor as the single piece of rope is tossed up in the air. (and may then be thrown out to the audience for examination) . Nothing is mentioned in the ad about the several small pieces of rope that fall to the floor as the single piece of rope is tossed up. Himber's own advertisement also omits the mention of the pieces falling to the floor as the rope is tossed up: "A borrowed rope is cut into four pieces, and then in a split second, without cutting the knots off or sliding them off, the rope is restored again and thrown out into the audience for examination." I haven't tried it out on anyone yet (not even the long-suffering wife) so I don't know how it plays . Harry, what has been your experience with it ? - |
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Harry Murphy Inner circle Maryland 5444 Posts |
Lots of dealer speak in that ad blurb. "...cut in four pieces, tied them together..." It is tied and then cut.
I think a spectator retelling the effect would probably remember it more like the dealer advert than what really happened. this is a quickie cut and restored. I used to perform it because other magicians in my area at the time were performing a more normal cut and restored. The audience reactions were good and the trick was well appreciated. I never saw this but this as a jaw-dropping, show stopper of an illusion. Nice stand alone rope routine for the middle of a show. At one point I used it as a preamble to cutting the ropes into the lengths necessary for the Professor's Nightmare (Slydini's handling and cuts) with then ended with the 3 to 1 rope.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
I now see that on page eleven it does mention the right hand. I missed it several times.
Why would those knots be held in the right hand so long, and the drawing suggests them being concealed from view of the audience. This is one of the worst Cut and Restored effects I have ever ran across. I can't believe Himber would put out something so terrible. Not to mention the littering of the venue that hired you. |
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