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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Table hoppers & party strollers » » To many people see the same tricks over and over (10 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Jumbopenny
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Quote:
On Dec 10, 2021, funsway wrote:
Quote:
On Dec 10, 2021, Jumbopenny wrote:
Long gone are the days where all we had were paper catalogs like Tannen's which weighed like 3 pounds.



Oh, you meant places to BUY things. Yup, lots of tricks to buy, and even inspiration from watching great and poor video presentations.

Learning how to engage an audience, create astonishment and a memory of "must be magic' - not so much.

If greater availably and access could lead to being a better magician vicariously, then it would also lead for better grammar, vocabulary and wisdom.
Learning "what" and "how" is not enough. Good table-hopping requires understanding "why" and "when."

Just an opinion, of course. I can only rely on tens of thousands of live magic presentations that were all different.

I fully agree that using the internet is good place to start these days. But at some point "live" enters the equation.



No. not just buying magic. Literally everything. From selecting, buying, to performing.

There are many sources of reviews like the Magic Café to help you select magic. There's no shortage of places to purchase magic online.

Performance? Watch AGT, Magic Castle, Penn & Teller, and multiple talented street performer channels all on Youtube. Cyril, Dynamo, David Blaine, Lu Chen and DMC all have multiple season series on close up magic. Not to mention many asian TV shows.

Tutorials? Alex Pandrea, Spidey, Rich Ferguson, Brian Brushwood, and Sankey among many others have Youtube tutorial channels.

This is just the tip of the iceberg. If with all this you can't come up with several dozen things to perform then magic is not for you. Find another interest, hobby, profession.

I'm not sure why you are bringing up this "live" thing. We are magicians. This is our interest, passion, and for some a profession. We sourse our magic then go out into the world and perform. We learn through performing. This is a given. George is a professional performing magician who is asking how to source magic. He's already doing the things you are talking about, and did not ask about.
funsway
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Well, Jumbo, your statement of "I'm not sure why you are bringing up this "live" thing," shows why this is going nowhere.
I have been very clear why I feel that way - and why I am offering my opinions to help George in his search for alternatives to the repeat audience problem.
I do not see where he is asking, "how to source magic." You apparently think he is and challenged his question in "put down" way.

You seem to offer the opinion that "literally everything" can be found on the Internet. I do not, even if one had the time to dodge the ads pretending at a search engine.
More importantly, watching anything on a small electronic screen has a limited learning modality that does not truly represent what performing before a live audience will entail.
It also leads to a top down bias on "copying" rather that the incremental "bottom up" learning essential to creativity and audience engagement.
This and other "learning issues' related to the "illusion of knowledge" problem led to my going back to school and getting a Masters in Educational Technology
to add to several communication degrees. For me, what one a can "learn" by watching video snippets is "the tip of the iceberg" of what can be learned and never will be for many.

So, George and other readers here can consider both of our opinions and those of other posters and perhaps find something of value. That is good.

For you to judge that anyone should give up magic because they don't see learning the way you do is sad.

How can you say that George is "already doing the things I am talking about," and then say you don't understand what I am talking about.

But, you seem to know what he "did not ask" and what "our interests" are. So, I bow to your superior paranormal abilities here.
Most folks getting into performance magic today probably agree with you. Those repeat customers George is worried about probably would prefer watching a TV screen too.
A decade ago on the Café' I suggested table-hoppers should just carry a laptop to plunk on the table and stand back for a YouTube superior performance. More entertaining and no practice required.

Me, I watch the programs and YouTube offerings you mention and see a lot of skill demonstration and "gotcha" and puzzles - but very little magic. My failing, perhaps.
If I could just accept that what is seen by peering at the world through a toilet paper tube is the "true reality" I could quit creating new magic effects and just copy someone else.

I consider that George is interested in orchestrating a unique "experience of magic" for his observers, and that he has already watched all of the stuff on the Internet.
But, maybe he has taken your advice and given up magic.

Then again, maybe he is looking at an old favorite and asking, "How can I use this 'repeat customer issue' to advantage?"
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
Dannydoyle
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This thread makes me sad now.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Jumbopenny
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On Dec 11, 2021, Dannydoyle wrote:
This thread makes me sad now.


Don't be sad Danny. Sometimes people who are passionate about the same subject have passionate "discussions." Although this one seems to have gone WAY off topic. Smile
Dannydoyle
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It is not a passionate discussion. It is more about proving one point of view is better, right, or somehow more valid than another.

The idea that the internet is the solution to all performance is sort of odd. It is not so for everyone. Yes we do have MORE options. Yes there is MORE information and this can be a good thing in many ways. But you seem to be putting forth the idea that it is the "right" way or the "only" way and this is sort of silly don't you think?

You put forth the success of Shin Lim as if it is the way every performer learns now as opposed to the way one has. Is that the ONLY way he learned or was it the way he started? Was his entire Las Vegas show put together ONLY from You Tube?

The internet can be a wonderful resource and it is access to things that is unparalleled in history. Nobody should argue that. But it is far from the "only" way to do things. I don't think this is what you are putting forth, but it sort of comes across a bit like that.

I get sad when "passion" becomes "I am right and you are wrong".
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
George50
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Danny I agree with you when I started this post I didn't mean to start a fight! All I wanted was some advice how to improve my act. So everybody calm down and lets get back to helping each other.
funsway
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OK - drop me an email and describe what impromptu effects you now perform using found objects,
and I'll send you an eBook of effects to compliment and add to your list.

ken@eversway.com
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
Dannydoyle
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On Dec 12, 2021, George50 wrote:
Danny I agree with you when I started this post I didn't mean to start a fight! All I wanted was some advice how to improve my act. So everybody calm down and lets get back to helping each other.

I think you are on the right track even thinking about it.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mr. Woolery
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Ken, I really enjoyed that story. Having read a lot of your stories in the time I’ve been here, your writing keeps getting better and I think this may be my favorite.

As to repertoire, I know I get an odd sort of tunnel vision sometimes. I’ll have practiced a particular trick until I feel ready to road test it, then in the moment all I can remember is something I’ve done a jillion times before. (Which means I may have the mechanics ready to road test, but the trick itself is not ready. I know.)

I’ll make a list of every trick I know, realize I have maybe a dozen, crack a book and say “oh, yeah, I know most of these, too.”

I have no real solution for the OP, but I can say what I’d love as a restaurant regular. If I’ve seen all your normal material, it would be great fun to have you say “I know you already know most of the stuff I do here, so maybe you can give me some feedback on a new piece I’m working on. It isn’t really ready to show, but if you don’t mind telling me what you think of a work in progress, I’d appreciate it.” That would feel awesome because it is like getting a sneak peek at something others haven’t seen. I may be unusual, but I’d love being the first to see a new trick.

Patrick
TomB
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Bands do that Patrick and it works. And then when it is on the radio you feel special that you heard it first.

Suzanne the magician has a great penguin live and she discusses repeat customers. The bottom line is if they like you, they like YOU. It's not about the tricks. And people can bring in friends to watch.
madmalone
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Develope new material to use in this situations... doesn't have to be all new... in fact all new its a bad idea!
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