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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Coins in spectator's hands (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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warren
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uk
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What is the least amount of coins a spectator can hold when in reality you have added an extra one?

For example, when performing Flying Eagles and you give a spectator six coins to hold but miscall it as five they never know the difference, when I've practised a coins across with my wife and miscalled three as two she says that she can feel quite easily that she is already holding an extra coin so I've never tried it in the real world.
So, I would like to ask all the experienced coin workers when doing this in the real world i.e. miscalling three as two have you ever been caught and also do you honestly think they believe you or are they just being polite?

Many thanks in advance.
Chris "linkster" Watson
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I have placed 3 as 2 in a specators hand on quite a few occasions. I think the thing to do is distract the spectators attention at the crucial moment so that they aren't concentrating on the coins as you put them in their hand. Some of this comes down to selecting people to work with who are receptive to magic and not trying to catch you out. I think partners who have seen 1000's of tricks are often the hardest audience. Once you are in a performance situation and people are paying attention to your engaging performance you should be fine.
twistedace
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philadelphia
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I do 3 as 2 all of the time for a pet effect of mine...I haven't been caught yet. Ok, maybe once or twice by good friends who have seen the effect more than one time.
Mike Wild
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Girlfriends and wives have a funny sense about this. My girlfriend busts me all the time on three for two's, but I've never been caught in performance.

They must be be able to see it in our eyes Smile

Best,

Mike
<><>< SunDragon Magic ><><>

"Question Reality... Create Illusion"
Chris "linkster" Watson
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Still you can always say "most people keep quiet when I give them too much money" to distract them and vanish the other coin.
Open Traveller
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It should be pretty obvious that it depends a whole lot on what size coins you're using, how milled they are, and most importantly, where in their hands you're placing them.
Curtis Kam
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same as you, plus 3 and enough to make
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I think this is the sort of poll that can be useful. It is difficult to get sufficient primary data on this sort of thing just going on your own experience.

For me, I have gotten away with 3 silver dollars as 2, but it's not reliable. Even 4 as 3 is unreliable at this size. I find that 5 as 4 is the lower limit for everyday work.

Also, I think most people will agree that it's safer to have the spectator put her hand over the coins on the table rather than holding them in her hand. What's the lower limit on this? DO you notice any difference in reaction between the two?
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Open Traveller
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Several times every night I put three silver dollar sized coins as two in a spectator's hand. These are old Chinese coins with rounded edges. When they hold their hands out, I place the coins so their fingertips (the most sensitive part of the hand) don't touch the edges of the coins. To date, I've not been busted (knock wood). Of course, it helps to structure a routine so that an extra coin is never suspected! Smile

If milled coins are used, the odds increase dramatically that the spectator will notice something isn't kosher.

It IS safer to have the spectator put her hands over the coins rather than hold them, but in my experience the wow factor decreases significantly.
watchdog
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I have always thought about somehow placing a [ and two coins in a spectators hand then somehow getting them to un-nest it for me. Is this just a pipe dream? Has anyone else thought along these lines?
Eric Falconer
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Finishing in the spec's hand with a [ is easy. Place all 3 coins + [ in their hand... place coin w/[ last.
Count 1..2..3..
then just lift off the [ and leave the 3 coins in their hand... quickly closing their hand.
"I take this one and that leaves 2 in your hand"
Vanish the [ using method of choice and reveal that coin has traveled to spec's hand (ditch [ and you're clean)... This is how I end my coins across w/[ routine...
Eric Falconer

Houston TX
mike gallo
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Warren,

When placing coins in the spectator's hand...placement is very important. Never place the coins on their palm. Place them at the base of their fingers...help them close their hand and turn it palm down (this also decreases their chance of prematurely opening it). Also, give their hand a slight squeeze before you let go (this takes away sensitivity a little). Count the coins in their hand...but do not constantly remind them how many they have (they think they already know...don't create suspicion...don't run when being chased). Attitude is everything! Most important don't be discouraged just 'cause ya got busted!

Mike
warren
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Thanks for the coin placement tip, Mike. I never really thought about where I placed the coins as usually I'm calling six as five, however when using a much smaller amount of coins I will definitely use the tip you gave me. Thanks again for the advice.
Also I thought Curtis made an interesting point of having a spectator cover the coins on the table, this is also something I've never considered.
many thank's again to everyone for their comment's
watchdog
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Thanks Falconer, I'm already familiar with that application. What I was trying to convey is to very openly show two coins (one with a [ on it) place them into the spectators hands allowing them to see two coins. Let them close their hand, vanish an extra coin, then have them open their hand to show three coins. I have tried out a number of different version on my girlfriend but they all seem contrived when it comes time for them to do the dirty work. I was just wondering if anyone had gone down these lines.
MICKEY SILVER
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What is the " LEAST " amount of coins a spectator can hold when in reality you have added an extra one?

Warren, this is a very interesting question. I would very much like to share my findings and thoughts on this situation. My answer is " NONE as ONE ".......THATS RIGHT ! Based on the philosophy of reality....We as magicians can have a spectator show a empty hand and make a fist .... "HOWEVER " upon opening their empty hand , a single coin is seen. The Question is : Can this be done...." YOU BET IT CAN " and very,very convincingly. For those of you who have seen my tape regarding my coin work....NOTE: After I execute the SUV , I come back showing that the coin is still in my hand. This come back move I developed, allows us magicians to show a single coin in a spectators " EMPTY " hand as well.

OK...let me set the stage...! Example: A magician is surrounded by spetators.....The magician flips a silver dollar up in the air, catches it ..."NOW"...One spectator is asked to extend their arm and make a fist. Other spectators all around are watching closely.(a very important subtlety here is to notice if the spectator is right handed..IF SO...have them extend their left arm out making a fist of course with the LEFT hand ) ...OK..."NOW" The MAGICIAN places or takes the coin in his left closed fist....gesturing..throwing the coin at the spectators fist....Ok.."NOW" After the throw gesture...The MAGICIANS left hand is seen ONE HUNDRED PERCENT EMPTY! because it is.....OK..."NOW" The Magicians right hand, palm forward, so all can see its emptiness, (Coin in Ramsey Subtlety at this point) extends first finger tapping the spectators fist.....Asking the spectator to open their hand very slowly.....OK.."NOW" as the spectator starts to open their hand, the MAGICIANS left empty hand comes over to the spectators finger tips...pulling open the spectaters hand gentely (note: each one of the MAGICIANS fingertips are on each fingertip of the spectators.....OK.."NOW"..at this point the right hand lifts the SILVER DOLLAR out of the palm of spectaters hand using my come back move. The coin is immediatly held up at so all spectators can see.
I'M TELLING YOU GUYS ..... THE OTHER SPECTATORS WATCHING WILL SWEAR THE COIN CAME FROM THE SPECTATORS HAND. THE IRONIC THING ABOUT THIS IS SO WILL THE SPECTATOR THAT OPENED THEIR HAND......for they "FEEL" it as well as "SEE" it comming out of their hand. REMEMBER, as we all know in MAGIC,"TIMING" is everything. FOR IT IS THE EXACT TIMING AND SMOOTH MECHANICAL ACTIONS THAT CREATE THIS ILLUSION....HOWEVER...THINK ABOUT IT ! THIS TIME, WE THE MAGICIANS ARE CONTROLLING THE TIMING BY CONTROLLING THE WAY THE SPECTATOR OPENS THEIR HAND.

CREATING THE LEAST AMOUNT OF COINS IN A SPECTATORS HAND......... " NONE AS ONE "


IT IS TRULEY AMAZING AND VERY MAGICAL!


THANKS FOR READING,

YOUR FRIEND,
MICKEY
Mike Wild
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I'd love to know how that move is done Mickey... ever consider making a DVD? Smile

Just joshing... I know it's coming. I'm really looking forward to it man.

I've done none as one, but it has always required me to cover their hand with mine. Your way sounds and looks much better, and resolves some serious discrepancies.

Best,

Mike
<><>< SunDragon Magic ><><>

"Question Reality... Create Illusion"
Curtis Kam
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same as you, plus 3 and enough to make
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Very Clever, Mickey. That would make a nice addition to a "Miser's Dream" routine with a kid up, but I'm sure you know that already.

Thanks!
Is THAT a PALMS OF STEEL 5 Banner I see? YARRRRGH! Please visit The Magic Bakery
Jonathan P.
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For the "none as one", Luke Jermay has a nice strange routine in which a coin is put in the spec's hand as she is told that there is nothing (patter about the remaining feel of weight when something is removed from the hand.) In "skullduggery".
I usually put 3 coins as two in the spec's hand as a finale for a coin-across or for the charming chinese challenge ending.
Curtis Kam
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same as you, plus 3 and enough to make
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Great info so far, guys. Anybody getting away with 2 as 1?

What about different-size coins? How much can you sneak in under a dollar?
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Doug Peters
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I have a life, so I only have
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How about the other way around? Anybody try 2 as 3? Or 1 as 2??? Or Smile 0 as 1????
"if you have any answers, it's time to ask harder questions!"
Dan Watkins
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Curtis,

Doc Eason's C/S/B routine at one point is a 2 as 1. He puts the three coins in the spec's hand, but removes the 2 part gimmick which leaves the spectator only 1 coin, when they should be holding 2.

Dan
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