The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » Want to see Fitch Kohler Holdout in action... (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2~3~4 [Next]
Rocky
View Profile
Elite user
487 Posts

Profile of Rocky
Is anyone who leased this product incorporating it into their act yet? After speaking with those responsible for this state-of-the-art holdout,Ive been promised that I'll witness some really spellbinding magic. Its that time of year again for me to hit the road and seek out performers for my restaurant. If you have a restaurant or gig that you perform at on a regular basis, please respond as I travel the US and am more than willing to alter my route to see some possible perfromers for my place. I would be especially interested in those who are using the holdout I mentioned. It appears that this product is hard to keep on the shelves so I know that there are magicians using it,hopefully Ill get to see it in action. Keeping my fingers crossed!!
Rocky
sullivanl
View Profile
Loyal user
277 Posts

Profile of sullivanl
I would also love to see some real-world live performances. I want to know what I am missing out on!
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24252 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
I've seen it. I've seen the set. It will take practice to use it, but nothing I have ever seen is as good.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
debaser
View Profile
Special user
Boulder
552 Posts

Profile of debaser
Yes, it is nice, specifically in the small touches. However it is still just a hold out and requires a ton of practice. Anyone using a good holdout though will probably fool you and therefore I don't understand the desire to see that specific holdout in action. Because in the end, you wont see it.
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24252 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
That is precisely true. However, I have seen some holdout workers who occasionally blew it. And it was fortunate that they were around magicians when it happened.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
debaser
View Profile
Special user
Boulder
552 Posts

Profile of debaser
Absolutely, I think the holdout is one of the more precarious devices in magic and conversely most effective. However it is like learning a whole different craft. Body language, blocking, timing in relation to the routine. It is like going from guitar to slide guitar, similar and to the same effect as regular guitar but with a comple new dimension added. Not for the faint at heart.

Matt
Thomas Wayne
View Profile
Inner circle
Alaska
2240 Posts

Profile of Thomas Wayne
Quote:
On 2005-04-30 01:18, debaser wrote:
Absolutely, I think the holdout is one of the more precarious devices in magic and conversely most effective. However it is like learning a whole different craft. Body language, blocking, timing in relation to the routine. It is like going from guitar to slide guitar, similar and to the same effect as regular guitar but with a comple new dimension added. Not for the faint at heart.

Matt


Well then I guess it's a good thing that the Fitch/Kohler Holdout System comes with a FIVE DVD instructional set and free access to a forum with many, many articles written about using the system.

Best Regards,
Thomas Wayne
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
Bob Kohler
View Profile
Special user
703 Posts

Profile of Bob Kohler
It seems to me that nothing is ever mastered without work, thought and practice.
Mastery of the holdout as a tool is no different than mastering the pass or classic palming coins so that your hand looks natural.

Integrating any method to the level necessary for professional presentations is going to take a lot of time. Writing and integrating professional level presentations that contain excellent patter, correct body movement and posture etc. takes even longer.

Living in Las Vegas I've been very fortunate to be behind the scenes to witness how much time and effort pros such as David Copperfield, Penn & Teller, Mac King, Criss Angel and Rick Thomas put into a routine before it's ever offered for public consumption. It's staggering. They are at the top because of their talents but also their work ethic.

The Fitch Kohler Professional Holdout System is a tool for serious performers. Sure it's going to take time to master. But using the best tool for the job is a decision that all master craftsman make when doing a job. It's no different in magic.

Holdouts simply do many things better than any other solution. It's up to each performer to decide what there character is going to be, what effects they will perform and what methods suit them best. No doubt holdout work isn't for everybody. But our solutions solve all of the issues magicians found daunting when they've attempted to use this mighty tool in the past.

Out of all of our Holdout users only one has transfered his lease. No names, but he's a good friend of mine so I know the reason. It had nothing to do with difficuly to master but everything to do with his change of necessary show material.

Actually, you've probably already have seen our holdout used but had no idea what happened. It's been on TV not only in the US but several other countries. The list of users is for the most part professionals and a few serious magicians who don't perform for money but really care about there magic.

Our intention when releasing the secrets and equipment of our system wasn't to flood the magic world with the knowledge and turn everybody out there into a holdout nation. We really did it to keep our work alive but at the same time keeps the secrets secret. We've done that.

Many think we've made a fortune with it, but the reality is if we really look at the hours and money we've invested in it we've probably just broken even. It's really been a work of love for the device.

It has been rewarding though to see what others have adapted our solution to do. Bob Fitch, Thomas Wayne and myself with the help of the new holdout users are still working on making it better and better...

This thread is about seeing the holdout at work. I haven't put up video on the web for many reasons. I doubt I'll change my mind. Thomas and I have thought about another way to let you have a peek behind the curtain but at the present time I haven't really started on it yet.

Part of the difficulty is our system can do so many things and can be adapted to do many more. It's virtually impossible to showcase what it can do in a reasonable amount of time.

So for now you'll have to trust the opinions of folks who have had a peek behind the curtain like Bill Palmer.
www.bobkohlermagic.com

Home of the BK Pro Line
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24252 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
Let me point out before anyone misunderstands what I meant when I wrote "However, I have seen some holdout workers who occasionally blew it." that I was not referring to anyone using the Fitch-Kohler holdout. Quite the contrary. I was referring to someone who was using a Jack Miller holdout. The setup is completely different between the two. The principle is the same, but there are features of the Fitch-Kohler system that preclude the particular accident that I saw.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Robert Fitch
View Profile
New user
Leonia, NJ
38 Posts

Profile of Robert Fitch
Bill Palmer wrote:
Quote:
That is precisely true. However, I have seen some holdout workers who occasionally blew it. And it was fortunate that they were around magicians when it happened.

Yes, and that happened to me...It was very frustrating...which is why Bob Kohler and I put our heads together to help avoid these accidents as much as possible. And those ideas are the basis of what our Fitch/Kohler Holdout is all about. The additional way to avoid these accidents is to ... need I say it?...practice!

But seriously, take the time to look up the explanations of our holdout adaptations and changes on Bob Kohler's website. It gives a full explanation of what the improvements were all about...it doesn't tell you how we did it...but rather what we did. That should give you a primer on Holdouts and their basic problems (Now solved).. <www.bobkohlermagic.com>
Bob Fitch
Cheers...Imagination can make magicians of us all.
kihei kid
View Profile
Inner circle
Dog House
1039 Posts

Profile of kihei kid
Quote:
On 2005-05-01 14:10, Bob Kohler wrote:
We really did it to keep our work alive but at the same time keeps the secrets secret. We've done that.

Kudos.
Quote:
Many think we've made a fortune with it, but the reality is if we really look at the hours and money we've invested in it we've probably just broken even. It's really been a work of love for the device.

Major Kudos.
Quote:
This thread is about seeing the holdout at work. I haven't put up video on the web for many reasons. I doubt I'll change my mind.

:bawl:
In loving memory of Hughie Thomasson 1952-2007.

You brought something beautiful to this world, you touched my heart, my soul and my life. You will be greatly missed.

Until we meet again “my old friend”.
sullivanl
View Profile
Loyal user
277 Posts

Profile of sullivanl
Thank you for your informative comments Bob, I appreciate the fact that you spend the time to discuss your device with the magic community, your reasons for releasing it, etc... I would like to thank you for releasing this device to the magic community, and I feel your stipulations of ownership help protect the magic community and keep the device out of the hands of the idly curious and rip-off artists. I would do the exact same thing if I was in your place.

Just to clarify one thing, if someone leases your holdout, they are allowed to use it when they perform effects on TV, but can not expose it under any circumstance? Of course they would have to be proficient in its use, but that goes without saying. I ask because I perform on TV in Asia quite frequently, MTV Asia, BBC, Bravo, and was wondering if the magic community would shun me if I used your holdout in a few routines (assuming I leased it and was able to use it effectively)?
Dan Watkins
View Profile
Inner circle
PA
3027 Posts

Profile of Dan Watkins
Quote:
On 2005-05-05 15:27, sullivanl wrote:
Just to clarify one thing, if someone leases your holdout, they are allowed to use it when they perform effects on TV, but can not expose it under any circumstance?


Bob posted this above:

Quote:
On 2005-05-01 14:10, Bob Kohler wrote:
Actually, you've probably already have seen our holdout used but had no idea what happened. It's been on TV not only in the US but several other countries.


I think that answers your question. Also, you can read the Lease agreement on Bob's site. It does not prohibit any of its use, it just prohibits its exposure.
Click to visit:
Image
reidem
View Profile
New user
1 Post

Profile of reidem
Bob Kohler and Bob Fitch have put many years and sleepless nights into this space age holdout and dozens of its uses. It's not for the idle, it does demand you have a passion for magic and a willingness to spend time and live with it. If you already have the "meat and potatoes", i.e. are a good magician, this will add the spice to your magic. If you are a beginner, spend your time learning all the fundamentals first. You can't build a house without a strong foundation grasshopper.
TheAmbitiousCard
View Profile
Eternal Order
Northern California
13385 Posts

Profile of TheAmbitiousCard
Quote:
it just prohibits its exposure.


what a great idea!
www.theambitiouscard.com Hand Crafted Magic
Trophy Husband, Father of the Year Candidate,
Chippendale's Dancer applicant, Unofficial World Record Holder.
WalterZ
View Profile
New user
83 Posts

Profile of WalterZ
I think it's ridiculous.
A holdout is a tool. Choosing the right holdout for the proper time is the key. Why have different connections etc for ONE holdout? This just sounds terrible. Especially if you’re supposed to change attachments during performance?

I read the entire description on the site, along with all the supposed improvements. My point is, one holder should have one purpose/use and one only. Attempting to use the same holder for everything is not a good idea, and that is exactly what this device does.

What really bothers me is the price. I can purchase a car for the price of this gimmick!! I’ve never been caught with sleeving things the old fashioned way, and I have no incentive to sign my life away on a piece of metal. That of course doesn’t mean that this gimmick couldn’t truly be sensational. Maybe it is. But if these guys are in it to make money, they’re going with the wrong approach. If they’re trying to protect the secret, why are they selling it…. It just sounds like a scam to me… not to mention they have no video demos whatsoever!... Perhaps because any average magician could see right through the “choreography”. LOL.

Anyways, I have devised a holdout of my own. It allows me to hold any small object in the sleeve until needed. No moving parts, no gizmos, no weights, no magnets NOTHING. It is all done with clothing. I’m quite confident that I have found a much simpler solution to this problem.

Anyways, I’m just shocked at what these guys expect. How can they expect anyone to buy something blindly without even providing a video or something of it in action? I just don’t understand their logic.
~WalterZ~

Themystifier.com
El_Lamo
View Profile
Special user
Canada
589 Posts

Profile of El_Lamo
Walter,

If you don't need it... then they have not lost a sale by not providing a video or something of it in action.
Obviously, there are some people that want and need to buy the hold-out. They can recoup the cost in their shows and performances.
It is not a slight to any of us that don't need it, don't want to spend the money on it or can't spend the money on it.
If it was a scam, those that have bought it... would say so.

It sounds as though, you have developed the perfect holdout for yourself. Congratulations, you are fulfilling your neeeds.

Sometimes, people feel they must access everything before they can make decisions. I am interested in knowing about IT work but it is not important for me yet. When it becomes important, I will progress down that path, but starting with the best and most expensive IT system will not provide me with the grounding that I need. Eventually, my search may lead me in that direction, but maybe not.

Cheers - El Lamo
Life is a system of circumstance presented coincidently in an illusory way.
Dan Watkins
View Profile
Inner circle
PA
3027 Posts

Profile of Dan Watkins
I saw Thomas Wayne demo’ing the holdout at his booth at LVMI last week. Apparently he did it last year too. So there is one place I know of to see it in use. It’s a really crazy thing to watch.

Walter,

From your post, it doesn’t seem that you understand what a gravity holdout does. You can learn by buying the book “Holdout Miracles” by Ed Mishell for less than five bucks. Check it out, it is interesting reading.
Click to visit:
Image
WalterZ
View Profile
New user
83 Posts

Profile of WalterZ
I own the book and I own the books of wonder also... which is why I'm not understanding the pricing. I have nothing against these guys or their work. Sorry if I came off sounding offensive. But think about it: If you they wanted to make money, why charge such a high fee? If they intend to keep the secret, why are they selling it at all? So what ARE they trying to do?
If they are trying to provide the ultimate variation of the classic holdout by Jack Miller, why can't they show how smooth it is in operation? Or practical?

Anyways, getting back to l_Lamo's comment: Yes I would like to know everything about a utility tool before I buy it. Just imagine buying a $2000.00 laptop and the guys at Fry's electronics keep it in the back and have you read a black and white pamphlet. Would you buy it? You know what the laptop does don't you? So why not spend a "few" bucks on it right?

So anyways, thanks for your input as always guys, but I just don't think it a wise marketing strategy on their part.q
~WalterZ~

Themystifier.com
Glenn Godsey
View Profile
Special user
737 Posts

Profile of Glenn Godsey
Quote:
On 2005-06-19 01:49, WalterZ wrote:
.... But think about it: If you they wanted to make money, why charge such a high fee? If they intend to keep the secret, why are they selling it at all? So what ARE they trying to do?
If they are trying to provide the ultimate variation of the classic holdout by Jack Miller, why can't they show how smooth it is in operation? Or practical?....


Certainly some valid and thoughtful questions which should be answered.

Best regards,
Glenn Godsey
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » Want to see Fitch Kohler Holdout in action... (0 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2~3~4 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.22 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL