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magicbern
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Inner circle
Hong Kong, China
1217 Posts

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A fascinating debate but one I've wrestled with for a long time. I think as magicians we want to travel lighter (especially if we have no car, rely on public transport and getting older!) and aalso, undeniably there are many tricks that offer great entertainment for a very small physical space (see the choices offered above). However I also agree that kids need to be visually impressed as do parents who do the booking! In HK, many kid parties are occassions for parents to 'show off' to others how lavish they can entertain. Therefore, if you turn up with a briefcase, silks and cards only (no offence to those who do...because I utilize some of those tricks myself) they may not be too happy!
Anyway, as with most things in life, you need to strike a balance between larger more visual props and smaller lighter ones. It all depends on your style, budget and market. That's my take on this matter for all its worth!

Also, I wonder in this policallyy-correct era, why is there the need to address oneself (and others) as 'Chinamen'? Lving in HK where 98% of the population are ethnic Chinese, I know the majority would find the term rather insulting and reeking of the Hollywood 1930s-40s Charlie Chan mentality towards Asians. Why not just call oneself "Chinese'?
Or does race and nationality even have a bearing? I personally have turned away clients who on the phone ask me what nationality I am or what is my skin colour...not that I,m ashamed (I'm part Peruvian, part Filipino and part Chinese) but I don't want clinets to book me on the basis of my skin or race. The kids never seem to mind...just some parents!
Perhaps many members may feel this has no place in a magic thread...just an observation I have based on certain names I've seen on this forum.
paraguppie
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Forsyth Montana!
411 Posts

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Ricky,

I see I hit your touchy button. If you re-read your first 2 posts here you may see how they could hit MY touchy button. I tend to call it like I see it. Your post just didn't scream "I love children", that's all.

I respect the fact that you have 20 more years in the business than I do and I'm always willing to learn from a senior magi.

I hope you can see past my post. I really was not trying to be rude, but it may have come off that way. I do actually have a sense of humor, and I'm not the least bit offended by your stage name. Smile

Keith
Check me out at www.magickeith.com
magicbern
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Inner circle
Hong Kong, China
1217 Posts

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I really am disappointed at the confrontational stance of the C....... (I hesitate to repeat his name for fear of another outburst)> If members have read my posts, I endeavour to be polite and not antagonize. Why the need to go out of his way to defend an observation is not easy to comprehend. If he reads my post he will also see I have CHinese blood and having lived in a multicultural society like HK all my life, I think I am partly qualified to make an observation...that's all it was, not a condemnation!
I'd also like to thank Mr. C.........for his advice which I will bear in mind.

BY the way, I'm in my late 30s if that qualifies me for senior citizenship then so be it! Furthermore, I DO give many DANGS what parents say...they're the bookers and I am not arrogant to say take it or leave it! I do a very good show and have done so for 20 years but my observations are based on real-life performing situations in my part of the world. I was of the opinion that on this forum, there would be lively but respectful exchange of ideas and opinions, but obviously not for some members.
Therefore, as I prepare to leave this discussion and forum (to avoid any more animosity) I would like to say thanks to all who have helped me and have offered their constructive advice and support.
Decomposed
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Eternal Order
High Desert
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Sweating like a pig. That was me Saturday. Performed with a car load of props along with backdrop, music, PA etc in 95 deg heat (outdoor party).

I know eventually I need to downsize but at this point, I also believe the parents (and children to a degree) like to see a colorful, magical production.

Determing the success of my show Saturday was difficult at best. They were all very hot.

I think I know the Café member who makes the six figure income and uses very little. I have his DVD in fact:)

Very good thread here:)
p.b.jones
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Milford Haven. Pembrokeshire wales U.K.
2642 Posts

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HI,
I have stated on other threads is my personal aproach all of my props fit in one suitcase including the rabbit production, I have one journey to the car sutcase and bunny unless I need sound equipment which is an extra journey
phillip
Decomposed
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Eternal Order
High Desert
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Phillip,

I think one of my problems is I am a packrat. I have one colorful footlocker that stays in my trunk and it only contains the bunny box and square circle plus plenty of silks.

I have to get better organized, especially at the shows knowing where my next effect will be. This past show everything was in the grass and not properly laid out.

Wayne
BIlly James
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Hi folks,
Well, big props or small props,
so talented that one need not bother to do magic or not,
I can tell you there are people who have posted here who wouldn't even get a sniff at performing for my kids because their attitude would give them away over the phone.
NJJ
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Inner circle
6439 Posts

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Ha! That's what YOU think!

Luckily I'm such a silver tounged salesman that I'd been in the door and performing my dodgy colouring book and breakway wand before you knew what hit you!

:)

(just kiddin')
MarkTripp
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Michigan
618 Posts

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Interesting thread and ideas...

However in my many years as a professional magician who makes a full time lifing off of all of this, I beg to differ with many.

First, the big picture, when I leave my home to begin my day, I can have a series of shows lined up that consist of two birthday parties, a retirement banquet, a wedding reception and a comedy club show.

Do you really think I am going to carry seperate props, tables, and the like for all of those shows? I'd need a truck, anbd I'd lose money.

Now, to birthday parties, most magicians bring things into peoples homes that are far too large for the space they are going to have in most situations I won't even speak to the silly notion about bringing in a major illusion (boy to rabbit, flying carpet) to use with the birthday child and get more money for the show. EXPOSED magic is just as bad (perhaps more so) as poorly performed magic, NEITHER has any mystery to it.

Years ago I realised that to play EVERY paying venue that calls, would require my working out of my pockets. No tables, no large props, if it didn't fit in my pockets, it was out.

I am not alone in this, people like Jay Marshall, Karrell Fox, Billy McComb, Patrick Page, Terry Seabrook, etc, ALL learned it years ago.

Yes, this path means you actually have to learn magicial skills beyond how to work a dove pan or wich way to turn a foo can so you don't get wet. However, it can be done and I can only say having done every kind of magic over the last 40 years that the audience DOES know the difference between "close up on Stage" (Danny Korem's term and where you should begin your journey), and prop magic.

In there near future Camirand Academy will be puting out a DVD with me on this subject, frankly I do not believe it will sell well. The market today seems to be driven by either colorful stuff and is very easy to do (and figure out in my personal opinion) and things to fool the boys at the magic meetings. More the pity because unlike most things sold these days, I know it works in the real world cause if it didn't I wouldn't be able to pay trhe bills.

If this thought interests you, I would spend some time with the video tapes by Patrick Page and Billy McComb, and that Korem without Limits book. You will be well served by the journey.
Emazdad
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Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

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For those that wonder wher 'ricky the chinaman has gone, I'll give you a 2 word clue.......Mark Lewis.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
paraguppie
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Forsyth Montana!
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Hi guys,

Nice to see that they pulled a few posts (including mine) they were not appropriate for this forum. I should bite my tounge more often. Smile

Some great posts that made me think, thanks for that. I can see if I was doing 4 or 5 shows a day that packing in my ABC Gumball, Blow Yur Stack, Balloon Wand and Funhouse could be a pain. I am currently not that busy (give me a couple years!). Even then I would have to consider it though.

I can see the other side of the fence on this one I guess. Good stuff.

Keith
Check me out at www.magickeith.com
Avrakdavra
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The Pine Tree State, USA
224 Posts

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Mark Tripp wrote
Quote:
In there near future Camirand Academy will be puting out a DVD with me on this subject...


I hope you'll let us know the title and other details when it's available.
Bruce
MarkTripp
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Michigan
618 Posts

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I shall
Emazdad
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Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

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<<<Do you really think I am going to carry seperate props, tables, and the like for all of those shows? I'd need a truck, anbd I'd lose money. >>>

Hi Mark, that's why I put one show together that plays across all the age ranges, I don't want to be carrying more than one show if my 1st party is for 4 year olds and my next 8 year olds etc. I'd rather have one brilliant show, than a few good shows.

I don't even normally bother changing shows if the kids have seen me before, unless it's like this weekend where I had the same kids on the Saturday and Sunday, This was too close together so I took last years brilliant show which is now show 2, on Saturday, and this years show on Sunday.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
flimnar
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Salt Lake
577 Posts

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Seems to me that if it works for you, there is no
need to justify your approach or criticize someone
who takes a different approach. What is the
true definition of a Magician? Does it matter if
something falls into a particular category or
philosophy? If it works for you and the people
for whom you perform, then it seems to me that you
go with it. If it doesn't, then don't. I can't imagine anyone here believes that the same effect works the same for every performer.

For what it's worth.
"This one goes to eleven..." Nigel Tufnel
Decomposed
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Eternal Order
High Desert
12020 Posts

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"In there near future Camirand Academy will be puting out a DVD with me on this subject, frankly I do not believe it will sell well. "

Mark,

Count me in too please........

PS: Has anyone seen John Zander's DVD? He works out of a suitcase and does school shows full time in LA.
p.b.jones
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Milford Haven. Pembrokeshire wales U.K.
2642 Posts

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Some great posts that made me think, thanks for that. I can see if I was doing 4 or 5 shows a day that packing in my ABC Gumball, Blow Yur Stack, Balloon Wand and Funhouse could be a pain


Hi,
there is always another aprouch.. keep your prices very high then you will earn as much if not more and never need to reduce yourself to the type of commodity that's doing 5 shows a day
Phillip
MarkTripp
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Michigan
618 Posts

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Quote:
On 2004-09-14 03:54, p.b.jones wrote:
there is always another aprouch.. keep your prices very high then you will earn as much if not more and never need to reduce yourself to the type of commodity that's doing 5 shows a day
Phillip


LOL! Hey, here is a better idea, why not charge one million dollars? You won't get very many, but all you need is one! Also you can say you are the most expensive kid show performer around

"Type of commodity"? I am the type that Karrell Fox trained me to be. But some day we will have to look at tax papers and see which one is making more money at magic.....
Emazdad
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Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

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I'm with Phil on this one, once your diary gets to the point it's bursting with bookings, you're racing around between shows like a madman and you're turning stuff away, it's time to increase your prices. That's what I do, last time I not only increased ny prices, but also the gap I leave between shows so I wasn't rushing around so much, This year I'm earning more than last year and doing less shows.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
Decomposed
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Eternal Order
High Desert
12020 Posts

Profile of Decomposed
Would live to have your problem Clive:)

Of course all I need is a few more school bookings and the ol birthdays can just be icing:)
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